Where are ciV competitors?
- Thread starter Ermak-
- Start date
I don't agree that HOI2 is so much better than HOI3, or even better at all. I think that is very dependent on personal taste. HOI3 is now a very decent product. I also wouldn't agree with you that EU2 is superior to EU3 (which has made similar progressions). Your line of reasoning would lead to that conclusion as well.
I do agree that Arsenal of Democracy is worth checking out, as well as its upcoming brother Darkest Hour and the expansion Iron Cross (which fits on both). I especially look forward to the WW1 scenario of Darkest Hour. Victoria doesn't really lead to WW1 in the end, unfortunately.
Threedog43
Warlord
Crusader Kings all the way!!! Far and away my favorite Paradox game.
I wish I never read this thread... it inspired me to pick-up a copy of Europa Universalis III and its first three expansions. In a word - wow! I saw more depth last night in EU3 during the tutorial, followed by a 3 hour session, than I have in ~150 hours of play with Civ5.
Want to settle unclaimed lands in the New World? Surprise... there are natives! Want to exterminate them? No real problem. Peacefully co-exist and eventually absorb them into your population? Also doable. Want to increase the size of your settlement's population? Send more settlers! Logical, huh?
It's strange how perspective can change with new experience, but now Civ5 seems distinctly like that cludgy old Age of Empires game (from Micro$oft IIRC). I would say Civ5 can be compared to EU3 as Call of Duty can be compared to ArmA2 (sorry if you never played them). Now I feel like I wasted my money on Civilization V... no, that's not fair. 1-200hrs. of entertainment for $60 is pretty good, better that the same amount for a 4hr. CoD campaign I guess.
I hope Civ5 matures and comes around someday, but for now I gotta' go play EU3 - see you guys in a year or so.
EDIT* I just noticed the developers of EU3 are European (Swedish). I am definitely noticing a trend here... my last 3 favorite games came from their side of the pond - all very fun, rich with detail and very well worth their (relatively low) prices.
Cheers!
I'd highly recommend Divine Wind at some point, though you could wait on DW for awhile until the price comes down.
'Europa Universalis III Collection' - £5.99 on Amazon. Hey I don't even know if I dig it yet (but I'm sure I will) so don't rush me, man.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Europa-Universalis-III-Collection-PC/dp/B001BVAQSI/
Heir to the Throne is on sale for the holidays so you could pick that up on the cheap. I'd say that expansion adds so much and refines things that are already there that it is on a BTS level for the sake of comparison.
http://www.direct2drive.com/8827/product/Buy-Europa-Universalis-3:-Heir-to-the-Throne-Download
Doctor Phibes
Prince
I have SMAC/X playing quite happily (and very fast, you can run some mega-maps) under 64-bit Windows 7 (Quad-core CPU, but it's not going to take much advantage of that, sadly). Slight problem with wide-screen display aspect ratio but that's easily fixable in the .ini file - check the SMAC forum here or Apolyton if you have problems with that.
The narrative drive (and the unit workshop) in SMAC is so strong that I don't care about the state of the graphics. And some of the wonder movies are little works of art in their own right.
Oh - and you can get SMAC/X Complete for £3.50 from Amazon. Now that's a bargain...
Doctor Phibes
Prince
I'll put in a plug for Distant Worlds. I'm a long-time space game hater, but this one has me hooked for some reason. I posted more about it in this thread. The Distant World website is here.
I also have played and enjoyed all the Paradox games, but perhaps because I've played them so much, they sometimes seem too much like work now. I'm sure I'll try the Devine Wind expansion for EU3 at some point.
For now, though, Distant Worlds is scratching my 4X strategy game itch.
Doctor Phibes
Prince
I'll put in a plug for Distant Worlds. I'm a long-time space game hater, but this one has me hooked for some reason. I posted more about it in this thread. The Distant World website is here.
I also have played and enjoyed all the Paradox games, but perhaps because I've played them so much, they sometimes seem too much like work now. I'm sure I'll try the Devine Wind expansion for EU3 at some point.
For now, though, Distant Worlds is scratching my 4X strategy game itch.
Oh gawd. That looks like the kind of game I'd disappear into and never re-emerge from. Got to try to retain a life...
Further to the cheapness of SMAC on Amazon, have just realised that I haven't played the all-expansions version of Civ3, though I played vanilla a lot. Now the complete version of that is going for an amazing £1.99 on Amazon. Thrift shop prices, basically. (Just to be a completist, added to basket to go with my next book bundle, at these pricing levels not worth it as a single delivery.)
Dale
Mohawk Games Developer
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2002
- Messages
- 7,604
No idea if anyone's mentioned this one but Battle for Wesnoth is totally free, and a pretty decent game. Still fully supported and being worked on (a new version came out a few weeks ago) and available for PC or Mac.
http://www.wesnoth.org/
http://www.wesnoth.org/
SHaW1986
Prince
another paradox game, i just bought Supreme Ruler 2020 gold on amazon, (cheap like 6 bucks) am waiting to see how that game pans out. and i already own EUIII complete but that game crashes for me even more than CiV. I cant even get into the tutorial to figure out how to play the game. im going to unload and try reloading it because ive watched alot of youtube videos about it and heard some really good reviews and want to really check it out. lets see what happens.
Yeah, when I got EU3 Complete the tutorials didn't work for me too. So I decided to just jump right in.
When you start the game, just take a few minutes to familiarize yourself with the interface. Most features have tooltips that show when you hover your mouse over them which explains what they are. Also, the EU3Wiki is a pretty good guide, so have a look through that.
JLoZeppeli
Prince
- Joined
- May 11, 2009
- Messages
- 598
TBS strategy game you need to rely on the past: Imperialism. Master of Orion, Master of Magic...
Turn based wargame: the best are the Matrix games, TOAW III is the best of all...
Strategy games: you can put your faith in Paradox games, expaecially Victoria II, Crusader Kings and EU III (with Magna Mundi Mod, that will be hopefully a stand alone by Paradox itself).
Total War games are good, the last good one was Medieval II modded (and i say MODDED with capital, vanilla was awful), Empire was trash...
Turn based wargame: the best are the Matrix games, TOAW III is the best of all...
Strategy games: you can put your faith in Paradox games, expaecially Victoria II, Crusader Kings and EU III (with Magna Mundi Mod, that will be hopefully a stand alone by Paradox itself).
Total War games are good, the last good one was Medieval II modded (and i say MODDED with capital, vanilla was awful), Empire was trash...
Here's another game:
Dominions 3 (http://www.shrapnelgames.com/Illwinter/DOM3/DOM3_page.html)
Takes a while to get yourself into, but the game is great when you get the hang of it.
Dominions 3 (http://www.shrapnelgames.com/Illwinter/DOM3/DOM3_page.html)
Takes a while to get yourself into, but the game is great when you get the hang of it.
Anthropoid
Grognard fantome
I would agree that Paradox graphics tend to be fairly utilitarian, though Victoria 2 has upped the bar quite a bit, and I believe they intend to make that their new standard. But I would point out that: there are multiple tradeoffs for a game that has the most cutting-edge, amazing, 3d zoomable, animated, moving graphics. First, the money and time and person-power that went into developing and perfecting those graphics are resources that do not get allocated to basic game design, balance, testing, and elaboration of strategic dynamics. For an FPS game in which "strategy" amounts to "Do I choose to use the assault rifle or the shotgun?" that is fine. For a true STRATEGY game in which the whole point is about pursuing a chain of decisions whose consequences are observable as a different developmental/historical trajectory in game, the decision to short-change basic game functioning for more enhanced graphics is nothing short of a travesty. Civ4 at release was a good example of this, though with expansions and mods, the obvious imbalance in development of pretty bells-n-whistles at the expense of basic game elements was rectified considerably.
Second, more fancy graphics require better machines.
Third, more fancy graphics run slower and tend to cause more crashes and bugs.
Fourth, more fancy graphics cannot make a mediocre strategy game "good" or a good strategy game great. That moderating effect _may_ be true for an FPS or other genre in which strategy are secondary game mastery concerns, but for a strategy (or tactics) game, graphics simply cannot save the game, or up it by a 'letter grade.' Perhaps half a letter grade.
I agree that prettier graphics are more fun in general, I won't try to tell you that static, flat, pixelated icon graphics set on top of a lifeless map actually look better or are more fun. The grahics in TOAWIII are just about as close to being "painful" as they could get and not make the game unapproachable. It is worth noting that for some, those simpler graphics WILL make the game unappealing. I suspect one can generally detect if the graphics are not suited to one's tastes by checking screen caps or a demo.
Second, more fancy graphics require better machines.
Third, more fancy graphics run slower and tend to cause more crashes and bugs.
Fourth, more fancy graphics cannot make a mediocre strategy game "good" or a good strategy game great. That moderating effect _may_ be true for an FPS or other genre in which strategy are secondary game mastery concerns, but for a strategy (or tactics) game, graphics simply cannot save the game, or up it by a 'letter grade.' Perhaps half a letter grade.
I agree that prettier graphics are more fun in general, I won't try to tell you that static, flat, pixelated icon graphics set on top of a lifeless map actually look better or are more fun. The grahics in TOAWIII are just about as close to being "painful" as they could get and not make the game unapproachable. It is worth noting that for some, those simpler graphics WILL make the game unappealing. I suspect one can generally detect if the graphics are not suited to one's tastes by checking screen caps or a demo.
I agree, Dominions 3 has given me heaps of hours of gaming.
Check out these AAR's:
http://forums.somethingawful.com/sho...0&pagenumber=1
http://forums.somethingawful.com/sho...0&pagenumber=1
civ-wrecked
Chieftain
- Joined
- Nov 22, 2005
- Messages
- 83
SHaW1986
Prince
ok... so i realize this is probably on the wrong forum for this, it just seems like people here have the answers to these questions. i have EUIII and EUIIIHTTT on steam but they dont sell divine wind, how does that work, i guess before i started playing ciV i didnt ever use steam. can i download Divine Wind from somewhere else and use it with my steam version of EUIII and HTTT?
