Do you believe in the American exceptionalism

[Ajidica]

America is exceptional in that we are the sole remaining superpower, nothing beyond that. Whether we should be proud of being the sole remaining superpower is a different matter.

 

[CaptainF]

Anyway, enough of him. Can I just tell you one thing? After reading your posts for the last year, I have come to appreciate America. The real America, where you and your ultra progressive and socialistic views are a slim minority, almost non existent in the grand scheme of things. That's why you use the internet and a video game forum to voice your opinions. Because it is impossible to impose and advance your views in the real America. An America where it's people are still largely Christian and center-right. So yes, you may bring out the very worst of America, but the only reason you continue to have a cynical attitude is you know the only platform you have is the internet, where your views attract the teenagers of America going through a rebellious stage.

So, Mr. America-lover-man, do you have a platform other than the Internet? Why aren't you out there with your "real Americans™" doing "real American™" things? Hell, why are you even in this country at all? You should be doing "exceptional™" things with your life, like killing muslims in some far-flung locale.

Moderator Action: The thread was warned to not get personal. This is well over the line.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[CaptainF]

America is exceptional in that we are the sole remaining superpower, nothing beyond that. Whether we should be proud of being the sole remaining superpower is a different matter.

For some very small-minded individuals, being able to commit mass murder and destruction is important to them. Helps them sleep better at night, I guess, knowing that those darn brown-skinned bogey men are getting killed half-a-world away.

 

[JollyRoger]

Can I just tell you one thing? After reading your posts for the last year, I have come to appreciate America.

As an American, I am exceptionally persuasive. It is always good to turn the unappreciative into the appreciative.

 

[Save_Ferris]

For some very small-minded individuals, being able to commit mass murder and destruction is important to them. Helps them sleep better at night, I guess, knowing that those darn brown-skinned bogey men are getting killed half-a-world away.

If I'm correct, your view of America is a heartless place in which everyone wants to engage in unjustifiable killing. This is completely false.

 

[madviking]

If I'm correct, your view of America is a heartless place in which everyone wants to engage in unjustifiable killing. This is completely false.

America is exceptional for considering the extermination of an entire people/culture beneficial to the country.

 

[Junius]

America is exceptional for considering the extermination of an entire people/culture beneficial to the country.

Really? Sadly that's not all that rare.

 

[Lord of Elves]

For some very small-minded individuals, being able to commit mass murder and destruction is important to them.

Link to video.
USA #1

 

[Perfection]

Yes as an extension of Perfection exceptionalism.

 

[Shekwan]

This is a very common misconception. China owns more of our debt than any other single nation, but very little overall. Less than 10%. This link has a useful graph. http://seekingalpha.com/article/246958-guess-who-owns-the-most-u-s-debt-not-china



Alright let me see if i can have as much fun as you did.
1. Thinking the Austrians, Prussians, and Russians who did most of the dying have a claim too. Also, same as the american thread that was split off, people have to quit saying that WWI "saved Europe". As has been said already it was hardly a battle between good and evil.

2. Of course there were already people there. Nobody on the moon. Not really the same thing. Also is it fair to say they "colonized" India or much of their african possesions? Not a ton of englishmen there.

3. How are you defining democracy? Parlimentary democracy i'll give ya. Plenty of examples of other represenative governments.

4. Best navy in the world without question. Hardly the best army in the world. What centuries are you talking about? I'd think again.

Defeated colonial terrorism?

The British Empire IS the definition of colonial terrorism.

BTW, what do you mean with invented democracy?

Jeez, take it easy guys, I was exaggerating the achievements of another country to expose the original poster's hubris.

 

[Theige]

1. America played a relatively small part in defeating the Germans both times.

Lolol you can't possibly actually believe this is true, in regards to the second go around, I pray?

Edit: On topic; America is without question exceptional, to deny such is to fundamentally misunderstand the question, the meaning of the word "exceptional" and/or the world we live in.

 

[Junius]

Lolol you can't possibly actually believe this is true, in regards to the second go around, I pray?

Edit: On topic; America is without question exceptional, to deny such is to fundamentally misunderstand the question, the meaning of the word "exceptional" and/or the world we live in.

A thread was split of from this one concerning the US role in WWII. It can be found here. http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=428408

 

[GoodGame]

Is there an inherent conflict between being a Libertarian and believing in US exceptionalism?

I don't think so.

 

[NiRv4n4]

Lolol you can't possibly actually believe this is true, in regards to the second go around, I pray?

Edit: On topic; America is without question exceptional, to deny such is to fundamentally misunderstand the question, the meaning of the word "exceptional" and/or the world we live in.

Indeed, it seems that the meaning of "American Exceptionalism" is not understood in full by some respondents. It simply states that the US is a fundamentally different nation than the rest of the world, and not superior or inferior. So these assertions regarding America's "taste for war" and economic/political problems aren't constructive, not in the derisive sense in which they are stated. I feel that lampooning America based on stereotypes and the actions of a couple of administration/congresses isn't really fair, and doesn't sufficiently answer this question that was first posed nearly 100 years ago. Saying America is bad because of was Bush/Obama/LBJ have done is like saying Germany is bad because of WWII, or France is bad because of Napoleon's warmongering. It isn't a valid argument - people have to realize that the nation and the government are not synonymous.

 

[Junius]

Indeed, it seems that the meaning of "American Exceptionalism" is not understood in full by some respondents. It simply states that the US is a fundamentally different nation than the rest of the world, and not superior or inferior. So these assertions regarding America's "taste for war" and economic/political problems aren't constructive, not in the derisive sense in which they are stated. I feel that lampooning America based on stereotypes and the actions of a couple of administration/congresses isn't really fair, and doesn't sufficiently answer this question that was first posed nearly 100 years ago. Saying America is bad because of was Bush/Obama/LBJ have done is like saying Germany is bad because of WWII, or France is bad because of Napoleon's warmongering. It isn't a valid argument - people have to realize that the nation and the government are not synonymous.

Well said. The USA is a very unique country for a number of reasons. One doesn't have to think it is a "better" one to acknowledge that.

 

[metatron]

nationalism

My point about all that nationalism and ancestry stuff was that the US are not that different from European nations cause...
a) A European-American (i.e. white non-Hispanic) majority is clearly dominating public discourse in the US.
b) Said majority has defined a national identity very similar to the ones present in Europe (we do that glossing stuff over with fancy ideals, too).
c) Nationalism based on that identity is helping US administrations conducting a rather un-idealistic foreign policy.
d) All of that has a bit of a racial undertone, making it relatively "ok" to mess in some Latin American place (with "freedom" as the excuse and some geostrategical or economical issue as the true objective).

This claim is not about the US being particularly bad at any of this, just about them being in their nationalism basically comparable to European nations.

Hollywood =/= art
Lady Gaga =/= art
Reality TV =/= art nor a US invention

Some things Hollywood does, are art imo.
I can't really judge whether Lady Gaga produces art. My preliminary guess is that she does and that i just don't like it.
That being said, TV, movies, and music weren't exactly what i was getting at. Just look at US achievement to theater, the opera, painting sculpting, etc.

Sure most of that position is a result of the US being that big and relatively wealthy, but if you add the somewhat special achievements in TV, cinema and music on top of that, the claim "Arts? USA #1" seems very easily defendable to me.
At least in comparison to many other claims containing "USA #1".

I feel that lampooning America based on stereotypes and the actions of a couple of administration/congresses isn't really fair, and doesn't sufficiently answer this question that was first posed nearly 100 years ago. Saying America is bad because of was Bush/Obama/LBJ have done is like saying Germany is bad because of WWII, or France is bad because of Napoleon's warmongering. It isn't a valid argument - people have to realize that the nation and the government are not synonymous.

That's a bit too easy, both on the US and on Germany.
Sure, governments (democratically elected ones as well as authocratic ones) engage in propaganda and succeed in misleading the public to some extent.
None the less you can't really free the Germans from the responsibility for WWII and the atrocities commited.
Both were based on nationalism and other sentiments widespread in large parts of the population and would have arguably been impossible without those as a precondition.
The same is true for the (much less bad) nationalism and (much less bad) foreign policy of other nations at other times.

If you want to take Bush and the invasion of Iraq as an example, what you said cannot really be true:
If it was, US media would not have completely failed in accurately reporting (and challenging) the asumptions the administration's policy was based on.
If it was, the US' public would not have entered that frenzy that resulted in all that freedom fries nonsense.

 

[Leonel]

I suppose I could understand US exceptionalism if it was referring to a ragtag group winning their freedom from the most powerful empire of the time, but it's still being done today with former Soviet satellites winning their freedom from the Soviets and, winning freedom from dictators, it's going on in the Middle East, especially Libya today.

 

[warpus]

It simply states that the US is a fundamentally different nation than the rest of the world, and not superior or inferior.

That's like, true for almost every country in the world, dude.

 

[NiRv4n4]

I suppose I could understand US exceptionalism if it was referring to a ragtag group winning their freedom from the most powerful empire of the time, but it's still being done today with former Soviet satellites winning their freedom from the Soviets and, winning freedom from dictators, it's going on in the Middle East, especially Libya today.

But America managed to get independence from truly the most powerful nation on Earth, Britain. The late 18th century and 19th century were times of British dominance everywhere, so America winning isn't really comparable to anything. Maybe, like, Ethiopia managing to resist colonization? I dunno.

That's like, true for almost every country in the world, dude.

Yeah, I realize this, but the degree to which America is different is unlike other nations. When you think of Germany, France, the U.K., Spain, Italy, they all have somewhat common histories; they had many wars together, many territory swaps, rise and fall of autocratic regimes, centralization/decentralization, etc. America had a war with Britain and Mexico, and later Spain, in order to get most of its territories. The Indian wars were so lopsided and hopeless that aren't really worth mentioning. Only three, relatively minor wars, in order to acquire all of its territory and potential power. The US has been a democratically liberal state since is incarnation, etc etc. The only other western (barely) state that seems comparable to the US is Russia, in that it went from weak to strong, was completely disconnected from European politics til Peter the Great, and even after maintained a highly distinct and conservative ideology until 1917. After which it went far right to far left.

 

[RedRalph]

But America managed to get independence from truly the most powerful nation on Earth, Britain. The late 18th century and 19th century were times of British dominance everywhere, so America winning isn't really comparable to anything. Maybe, like, Ethiopia managing to resist colonization? I dunno.

It is comparable to Ireland winning independence from the most powerful nation on Earth, yes. Except us doing so was relatively much more impressive, considering the size and geographical difference.