adcarrymaokai
Emperor
- Joined
- Dec 31, 2013
- Messages
- 1,616
After knocking several easy Science Wins as Korea, decided to go for a CV as Byzantium to take advantage of their religious UAand failed miserably. Seems like Piety opening makes me lag not so much in culture (faith buildings and choral music ftw!), but puts me behind in growth and hence science, so I get fewer wonders, while the AI is pumping out tons of culture for my tourism to compete.
Both games are Huge map, Archipelago, Immortal, regular barbs, standard speed
Game 1. Started on an island with the Incas; one coast tile away was another island with Siam and the Dutch. Coastal/jungle capital and coastal other cities. Found El Dorado (500g) and bought a settler to settle near it. Opened Tradition then went Piety. 3-4 Dromons sailed off for world exploration. Earth Mother Pantheon to get faith from copper sources (4). For religion, took Tithe, Cathedrals (no other faith buildings were available), Choral Music, then IP+RT. Unity of Prophets as Reformation. That hardly helped against AI missionary spam, but I managed to convert all of Poland, some CSs and the entire Siam to my religion. Unfortunately, Siam was the cultural, military, and tech leader, so shared religion made his already strong tourism even stronger, and then he went on and conquered the Dutch. I was able to get Leaning Tower, Louvre, rushed Globe Theater from Pisa GE, Porcelain Tower. Spammed archaeologists and got theming bonuses for Oxford, Louvre, Hermitage, Globe Theater, and Broadwaynot bad! In that game, I was slightly behind in tech, but early sea trade routes with the Dutch let me catch up, and I was on par entering the Industrial Era and was the first to get to Modern, but after that I fell behind in tech: I did not rush public schools and did not re-route international trade routes to internal for faster growth (was hoping for trade routes tourism boost). Also, since I was first to enter Modern Era, I was the first to adopt ideology and chose Freedom to eventually get down to media Culture. Then every civ in the gameand I mean all 11 of themwent Order or Autocracy. Ugh, really? In the end (T358), I sort of gave up and went on to liberate Prague from Atilla just for the lulz and then dropped two great musicians on Siam for very minimal tourism output (I know I am supposed to wait for the Internet, but I spawned some for the Broadway theming and then they kept on coming). Cities pop: 27-25-21 with second city having 108 hammers. Over 9000 faith. 209 base tourism without airports and internet. Second to Siam, but its rising rather slowly. 4-th on the score list.
Obvious mistake: did not send food trade routes into the capital. Kept jungle tiles which gave culture from Dutch pantheon until fertilizer. After that, improved 3 bananas and built more mines on jungle copper. Perhaps, could have just kept jungle for science+culture and sent internal trade routes for growth. Other than that, not sure what I could have done against wonder-whore Siam. We had been buds for the entire game, share religion, but he also has strong militarily, and going to war with him would probably give me backstabber penalty and DoW from others, since he is friends with about everyone, and no one wants to DoW him.
Did I give up too early? Airports and Internet will increase tourism by a lot, and I can just try to eliminate Siam after achieving influence over others. But its T358 and I feel like the game is taking too long, seeing people talk about pre-300 CV.
Game 2. Even more fail than the previous one. Started on a big island, settled 3 cities again. A nice desert folklore/Petra start with 5 desert hills. Bee-lined currency after sailing (for pearls). Nice culture and faith ruins. Because of Petra, finished a rather late NC (seems like people here prefer to rush it asap). Timed third settler from city 2 and settled city 3 when Petra was completesent the Petra caravan there. Indonesia was GP and missionary spamming, so I DoWed them and stole 2 GPs to make Holy Sites. Killed a bunch of missionaries and spread my religion to America and Mongolia on another island, but other GP-spamming civs came about and started converting cities. For religion, I took Tithe, Cathedrals and Pagodas, Choral music and Religious Texts, To the Glory of God for Reformation. Saved faith for GP instead of spamming pagodas/cathedrals, and maybe that is why I got a leftover Reformation instead of desired Sacred Sites (though it seems Sacred Sites and Jesuit Education always fly away first and the AI always gets those). Shaka randomly DoWed me and sailed with Frigates, but I built Galleases in 3-4 turns each and repealed the attack. Only trade routes suffered. T246 and I just researched Scientific Theory. Significantly fewer RAs this time around, as well, and everyone was too far away for beaker trade routes for the entire early-mid game. So I just gave up.
Mistake: Perhaps, if I had spammed enough faith-bough buildings, I could have beaten the AI to Reformation. Other than that well, I guess, taking Piety in the first place. Also, Archipelago map can suck when you get isolated.
Just cant seem to make Piety work for Byzantium, even when mixing with tradition, and if anything, Byzantium is appealing only because of its UA which seems strong on paper.
Here are the saves. Lambast me, please. (had to compress files or else too big)
Both games are Huge map, Archipelago, Immortal, regular barbs, standard speed
Game 1. Started on an island with the Incas; one coast tile away was another island with Siam and the Dutch. Coastal/jungle capital and coastal other cities. Found El Dorado (500g) and bought a settler to settle near it. Opened Tradition then went Piety. 3-4 Dromons sailed off for world exploration. Earth Mother Pantheon to get faith from copper sources (4). For religion, took Tithe, Cathedrals (no other faith buildings were available), Choral Music, then IP+RT. Unity of Prophets as Reformation. That hardly helped against AI missionary spam, but I managed to convert all of Poland, some CSs and the entire Siam to my religion. Unfortunately, Siam was the cultural, military, and tech leader, so shared religion made his already strong tourism even stronger, and then he went on and conquered the Dutch. I was able to get Leaning Tower, Louvre, rushed Globe Theater from Pisa GE, Porcelain Tower. Spammed archaeologists and got theming bonuses for Oxford, Louvre, Hermitage, Globe Theater, and Broadwaynot bad! In that game, I was slightly behind in tech, but early sea trade routes with the Dutch let me catch up, and I was on par entering the Industrial Era and was the first to get to Modern, but after that I fell behind in tech: I did not rush public schools and did not re-route international trade routes to internal for faster growth (was hoping for trade routes tourism boost). Also, since I was first to enter Modern Era, I was the first to adopt ideology and chose Freedom to eventually get down to media Culture. Then every civ in the gameand I mean all 11 of themwent Order or Autocracy. Ugh, really? In the end (T358), I sort of gave up and went on to liberate Prague from Atilla just for the lulz and then dropped two great musicians on Siam for very minimal tourism output (I know I am supposed to wait for the Internet, but I spawned some for the Broadway theming and then they kept on coming). Cities pop: 27-25-21 with second city having 108 hammers. Over 9000 faith. 209 base tourism without airports and internet. Second to Siam, but its rising rather slowly. 4-th on the score list.
Obvious mistake: did not send food trade routes into the capital. Kept jungle tiles which gave culture from Dutch pantheon until fertilizer. After that, improved 3 bananas and built more mines on jungle copper. Perhaps, could have just kept jungle for science+culture and sent internal trade routes for growth. Other than that, not sure what I could have done against wonder-whore Siam. We had been buds for the entire game, share religion, but he also has strong militarily, and going to war with him would probably give me backstabber penalty and DoW from others, since he is friends with about everyone, and no one wants to DoW him.
Did I give up too early? Airports and Internet will increase tourism by a lot, and I can just try to eliminate Siam after achieving influence over others. But its T358 and I feel like the game is taking too long, seeing people talk about pre-300 CV.
Game 2. Even more fail than the previous one. Started on a big island, settled 3 cities again. A nice desert folklore/Petra start with 5 desert hills. Bee-lined currency after sailing (for pearls). Nice culture and faith ruins. Because of Petra, finished a rather late NC (seems like people here prefer to rush it asap). Timed third settler from city 2 and settled city 3 when Petra was completesent the Petra caravan there. Indonesia was GP and missionary spamming, so I DoWed them and stole 2 GPs to make Holy Sites. Killed a bunch of missionaries and spread my religion to America and Mongolia on another island, but other GP-spamming civs came about and started converting cities. For religion, I took Tithe, Cathedrals and Pagodas, Choral music and Religious Texts, To the Glory of God for Reformation. Saved faith for GP instead of spamming pagodas/cathedrals, and maybe that is why I got a leftover Reformation instead of desired Sacred Sites (though it seems Sacred Sites and Jesuit Education always fly away first and the AI always gets those). Shaka randomly DoWed me and sailed with Frigates, but I built Galleases in 3-4 turns each and repealed the attack. Only trade routes suffered. T246 and I just researched Scientific Theory. Significantly fewer RAs this time around, as well, and everyone was too far away for beaker trade routes for the entire early-mid game. So I just gave up.
Mistake: Perhaps, if I had spammed enough faith-bough buildings, I could have beaten the AI to Reformation. Other than that well, I guess, taking Piety in the first place. Also, Archipelago map can suck when you get isolated.
Just cant seem to make Piety work for Byzantium, even when mixing with tradition, and if anything, Byzantium is appealing only because of its UA which seems strong on paper.
Here are the saves. Lambast me, please. (had to compress files or else too big)