SEAPOLE Map Request

[YungPtolemy666]

I'm not sure if you've seen it, but this guy named Chris Wayan did alternate maps of Earth. One of them was called SEAPOLE and I was wondering if anyone has made or possibly could make a map for Civ 3 based on this concept?

Thanks

Link -http://www.worlddreambank.org/S/SEAPOLE.HTM

Moderator Action: Welcome to CivFanatics. Moved your thread to the main C&C forum as that is where questions or requests reside. Happy posting.

 

[timerover51]

I'm not sure if you've seen it, but this guy named Chris Wayan did alternate maps of Earth. One of them was called SEAPOLE and I was wondering if anyone has made or possibly could make a map for Civ 3 based on this concept?

Thanks

Link -http://www.worlddreambank.org/S/SEAPOLE.HTM

Moderator Action: Welcome to CivFanatics. Moved your thread to the main C&C forum as that is where questions or requests reside. Happy posting.

That is an interesting map concept. The closest to it that I can readily think of is Ozymandius Eemian interglacial map here.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=556985

I suspect that our mapmakers could come up with something though.

And welcome to the Forum.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

That is an interesting map concept. The closest to it that I can readily think of is Ozymandius Eemian interglacial map here.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=556985

I suspect that our mapmakers could come up with something though.

And welcome to the Forum.

Thank you.

And thanks for the suggestion, I'll check it out.

 

[timerover51]

Thank you.

And thanks for the suggestion, I'll check it out.

I am a neophyte at making maps from existing one, but I might take a try at that one. It looks quite interesting. My expertise is working with combat values and tampering with everything else.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

I am a neophyte at making maps from existing one, but I might take a try at that one. It looks quite interesting. My expertise is working with combat values and tampering with everything else.

If you give it a shot definitely let me test it first.

 

[Blue Monkey]

I'm not sure if you've seen it, but this guy named Chris Wayan did alternate maps of Earth. One of them was called SEAPOLE and I was wondering if anyone has made or possibly could make a map for Civ 3 based on this concept?

Wayan's maps are fascinating. I've looked at them a lot for inspiration & just for enjoyment.

I suspect that our mapmakers could come up with something though.

Without getting too technical, the fundamental problem is that his world map of course exaggerates the inevitable distortions. Making something usable for C3 is achievable by fitting together his regional maps. Simple, but a time-consuming jigsaw puzzle with all the decisions to be made along the way. At that point you'd have a useful graphic as a basis for a bmp to be processed through Quintillus' editor.

I'd love to do a series of maps based on his work. They're somewhere down there in the middle of the pile of "eventually" stuff. Hopefully someone else has them closer to the top of their personal stack.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

Wayan's maps are fascinating. I've looked at them a lot for inspiration & just for enjoyment.

Without getting too technical, the fundamental problem is that his world map of course exaggerates the inevitable distortions. Making something usable for C3 is achievable by fitting together his regional maps. Simple, but a time-consuming jigsaw puzzle with all the decisions to be made along the way. At that point you'd have a useful graphic as a basis for a bmp to be processed through Quintillus' editor.

I'd love to do a series of maps based on his work. They're somewhere down there in the middle of the pile of "eventually" stuff. Hopefully someone else has them closer to the top of their personal stack.

I hope so. I could take a crack it but it would be my first map project, and it seems like it may be difficult. And yes, his other maps are cool too. This one just stands out for some reason.

 

[Blue Monkey]

I could take a crack it but it would be my first map project, and it seems like it may be difficult.

Creating something you really, really want is an excellent first project. This one is more time consuming than difficult. Just needs patience. This is how I would proceed:

1. Patch together the regional maps into one big image. Use whatever graphics program you are comfortable with.
2. Change the mode of the image so it is indexed - limiting the number of colors. Save it in bmp format. (You'll get help from many of us answering questions if you need it at that point).
3. When you've got that far you want to use Quintillus' editor. There are several of us around to help talk you through that step. You'll be telling the program what colors = what terrain, then it makes the map for you.
4. You can either edit the map, or go back to make adjustments to the image & then run it through the editor again.

You might consider working on a map of just one continent first. Once you see what's involved and how to do it, then you could tackle the world with confidence.

 

[timerover51]

Greetings, Blue Monkey. Any objections if I sort of tag along with this? I have generated and modified a lot of maps in the editor, but never made one from scratch off of an existing map or area.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

Creating something you really, really want is an excellent first project. This one is more time consuming than difficult. Just needs patience. This is how I would proceed:

1. Patch together the regional maps into one big image. Use whatever graphics program you are comfortable with.
2. Change the mode of the image so it is indexed - limiting the number of colors. Save it in bmp format. (You'll get help from many of us answering questions if you need it at that point).
3. When you've got that far you want to use Quintillus' editor. There are several of us around to help talk you through that step. You'll be telling the program what colors = what terrain, then it makes the map for you.
4. You can either edit the map, or go back to make adjustments to the image & then run it through the editor again.

You might consider working on a map of just one continent first. Once you see what's involved and how to do it, then you could tackle the world with confidence.

Seems like a good idea, idk about you but if I was going to start anywhere it would be Ornithia. That's the most interesting continent to me.

Greetings, Blue Monkey. Any objections if I sort of tag along with this? I have generated and modified a lot of maps in the editor, but never made one from scratch off of an existing map or area.

That's what I've done. I've made maps but they weren't anything of this scale or complexity.

 

[Blue Monkey]

Seems like a good idea, idk about you but if I was going to start anywhere it would be Ornithia. That's the most interesting continent to me.

QFT. Do the one that will keep you motivated through the rough spots!

I'm not sure how much experience you have using a graphics program such as GIMP or Photoshop or something else. I'd be happy to share whatever of my working process helps, but don't want to confuse you - there are so many different ways to do things.

One of the best things I ever did for myself was make graphic of what colors I wanted to represent what terrains. I swap colors in a copy of the original image (Ornithia in this case) or paint in areas. Having pre-set colors makes it easy to consistently convert to the format needed for Quintillus editor - and to remember what I intended. This is especially useful for anyone who will make more than one map. Here is my current version. Feel free to use it or adapt it to your needs. You can use any colors you want - these aren't required, just the ones that work for me.

Spoiler :

 

[Midnight-Blue766]

I think this map is actually doable if you take the coordinates of each locale and try and scale it to Civ3 coordinates. I did another map of Wayan's with that method in Civ4, and that was without the "show grid coordinates" function.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

I think this map is actually doable if you take the coordinates of each locale and try and scale it to Civ3 coordinates. I did another map of Wayan's with that method in Civ4, and that was without the "show grid coordinates" function.

I don't suppose you'd be willing to take a crack at it? I'm terrible I know, trying to get others to do the work for me.

 

[Blue Monkey]

I don't suppose you'd be willing to take a crack at it? I'm terrible I know, trying to get others to do the work for me.

I know you were addressing Farsight, but I want to saythat for me personally it's more a matter of time than willingness. With several short scenarios, a major mod/scenario, 3 sets of terrain along with some supplements to other sets, unfinished contributions to published scenarios, UI graphics, and various stand-alone maps already in my pipeline, there's not much time left to do work by request.

I really would encourage you to attempt making a map yourself. If nothing else converting Wayan's work will teach you a lot about how geography and climatology contribute to scenario design. It's very likely you will produce something other people take an interest in as well.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

I know you were addressing Farsight, but I want to saythat for me personally it's more a matter of time than willingness. With several short scenarios, a major mod/scenario, 3 sets of terrain along with some supplements to other sets, unfinished contributions to published scenarios, UI graphics, and various stand-alone maps already in my pipeline, there's not much time left to do work by request.

I really would encourage you to attempt making a map yourself. If nothing else converting Wayan's work will teach you a lot about how geography and climatology contribute to scenario design. It's very likely you will produce something other people take an interest in as well.

I'm just not sure where to start. Do I need a square-shaped map to begin with? And I completely understand people might not have the time, I was just hoping someone with skills could make the map.

 

[Blue Monkey]

Make the map - don't worry about dimensions to begin with. Ornithia is completely surrounded by water, so you can always adjust the shape of the image later. Quintillus' editor is set up to handle oddly shaped maps anyway. If you want to end up with a map that is 80 tiles across the editor needs 2560 pixels. But don't worry about numbers. I've worked out a spreadsheet that will tell precisely how to resize a map to give the desired number of tiles. Work with a big image & be sloppy. For example, if you're using a brush less than about 10 pixels diameter you're being too precise. 16-20 would be better. Just forget about too-precise details - you're going to do the usual terrain tweaking in the biq anyway.

If you get to the stage where you have a map graphic with one color for each terrain I can invest a fair amount of time helping you walk through all the more technical steps - from indexing on.

PS - Ornithia is my favorite as well. Always been fascinated by a "green" Antarctica.

 

[YungPtolemy666]

Make the map - don't worry about dimensions to begin with. Ornithia is completely surrounded by water, so you can always adjust the shape of the image later. Quintillus' editor is set up to handle oddly shaped maps anyway. If you want to end up with a map that is 80 tiles across the editor needs 2560 pixels. But don't worry about numbers. I've worked out a spreadsheet that will tell precisely how to resize a map to give the desired number of tiles. Work with a big image & be sloppy. For example, if you're using a brush less than about 10 pixels diameter you're being too precise. 16-20 would be better. Just forget about too-precise details - you're going to do the usual terrain tweaking in the biq anyway.

If you get to the stage where you have a map graphic with one color for each terrain I can invest a fair amount of time helping you walk through all the more technical steps - from indexing on.

PS - Ornithia is my favorite as well. Always been fascinated by a "green" Antarctica.

That's exactly the reason it interests me.
When you say make the map, you mean on the Civ3 editor or in an art program?

 

[Blue Monkey]

Make an image in an art program with one color for each terrain. It's time-consuming, but much much faster than making a map from scratch in the editor.

Then let Quintillus' magic convert it to a map for you.

What you do in-between those two is simple & fairly quick - but not easy until you've done it a couple of times. OTOH that step is easy & won't take much time for me to explain it to you when you get there.

Don't be shy - post wips & post every question/stumbling block you encounter. Much better than trying to find the answer in a long detailed tutorial on using Quintillus' map making tools in his editor (which would need to be written up, doesn't exist) or blindly searching for posts in other threads.

 

[Gojira54]

I looked at these maps when you first posted, and while I like them I simply wouldn't have the time to make one right now.

What I do these days with my maps is open up the image I want to make, and shrink it down in pixels to the size I want the map to be (say 180x180). I keep a full size image up for reference. Then I zoom in full scale (800% or 1600%) in MS Paint the shrunk version, and pixel by pixel apply the relevant terrain to a map of the same dimensions in the Civ3 Editor. Sometimes the terrain is a bit hard to figure out when zoomed in that close, so I use the full-sized image for reference. Once that is all done, I tweak as needed, and add things like rivers.

This is all a very time consuming process, but since I've switched to doing it this way, I've been very satisfied with the end result.

 

[timerover51]

I was looking through the various maps in my Civ3 Complete folders and came across a set of three maps for an ice-free Antarctica, scale being 180 X 180, 140 X 140. and 100 X 100, all are .BIC files for the basic game. They are called Antartida, and at least on my Mac, show up in the scenarios folder of the Civilization 3 Complete game. I would say, starting with one of those, converted to a .biq file using the game editor, and then put into Quintillus's editor, or simply using the standard game editor and a color print out of the Seapole map of Antarctica, it might be possible to come up with a 180 X 180 map fairly quickly.