[MOD] Fall from Heaven II

[MagisterCultuum]

mana nodes are built with arcane units like adepts, mages etc. , NOT with workers. you need to have Alteration or Necromancy or Divination or Elementalism tech.

However, the AI never really learned to build things with units other than workers, so the code allows them to build nodes with workers too. Humans must rely on adepts though.

 

[Grey Fox]

Use your own assassins, attack them before they attack you. Try to scout a head and see where their assassins are. Use Mounted units to get to them fast. Use magic (promote your mages with earth II and use stoneskin). Etc.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

what Grey Fox said. although I definitely agree that being able to get guardsman promo a lot sooner would be much better.

 

[andrew_yaweb]

Or, a unit that is produced at the same tech-time as assassin, maybe thru a different building that is a bodyguard. The bodyguard would have the guardsman promotion, obviously.

Bodyguards have a long history of being critical to any military operation back to the stone-age. So, why not make a body-guard available soon for FFH? Proper use of it still takes strategy on the part of the player, but the tools should be available, please!

 

[andrew_yaweb]

While it looks good for the popularity of the thread to have 430 pages, isn't it about time to trim this bad boy? What good is it to fish my way in to around page 400-ish to see the December release discussions...that vast timeline of this thread is starting to get daunting.

 

[Omegon3]

So.. I seriously need one or two good, solid suggestions what to do about the menace of Assassins, or for that matter any other unit that happens to have the Marksman promotion. It can't be that the only sensible way of protecting yourself from them is by having units with the Guardsman promotion, can it? I mean that one requires Combat IV, so that would seem a tad steep considering how easy it is to spam out a bucketload of Assassins.

And it does get a tad.. frustrating.. to see those precious, high-XP units get picked off by some assassin from out of nowhere when they are sitting nice and safely in a city or a stack of other units, licking their wounds.

PS. Not to mention all those poor Catapults!

OK... I'm sure that other individuals will have better suggestions, but when I want to protect my high XP units (such as liches and mages) from assassins i always stock up on hawks. The assassins always go for the hawks first and hawks are REALLY cheap to turn out. If one or two gets killed I can have them replenished in one turn. Typically when I get attacked by assassins I have sufficient other units in the stack that can kill the attackers before I run out of hawks. When I go to war I always insure that I have several beastmasters, rangers, or druids in the stack carrying hawks to prevent my weaker units from getting killed.

Anyway, that's my solution to the problem of assassins... Take it for whatever it's worth.

 

[deanej]

While I haven't looked at the file yet, does this file require a special tool to maintain or is it in a format that can be accessed/modified via something like Word Pad?

Thanks.

It requires either DXTBMP or photoshop. It's very hard to edit properly because an incorrect alpha channel can cause major issues.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

OK... I'm sure that other individuals will have better suggestions, but when I want to protect my high XP units (such as liches and mages) from assassins i always stock up on hawks. The assassins always go for the hawks first and hawks are REALLY cheap to turn out. If one or two gets killed I can have them replenished in one turn. Typically when I get attacked by assassins I have sufficient other units in the stack that can kill the attackers before I run out of hawks. When I go to war I always insure that I have several beastmasters, rangers, or druids in the stack carrying hawks to prevent my weaker units from getting killed.

Anyway, that's my solution to the problem of assassins... Take it for whatever it's worth.

I'm pretty sure this no longer works. people used to always use hawks and workers to guard against assassins, so this was taken out in a later version ( 0.34 IIRC )

 

[Dragonlord]

So.. I seriously need one or two good, solid suggestions what to do about the menace of Assassins, or for that matter any other unit that happens to have the Marksman promotion. It can't be that the only sensible way of protecting yourself from them is by having units with the Guardsman promotion, can it? I mean that one requires Combat IV, so that would seem a tad steep considering how easy it is to spam out a bucketload of Assassins.

And it does get a tad.. frustrating.. to see those precious, high-XP units get picked off by some assassin from out of nowhere when they are sitting nice and safely in a city or a stack of other units, licking their wounds.

PS. Not to mention all those poor Catapults!

What I do: I make it top priority to take out any enemy Assassins I see on the map - get them before they get you! Have your own Assassins with high movement promotions ready to pick them out of enemy stacks or towns, and also have some units promoted with Commando to use enemy roads to go deep into their territory to get those b****rds.

Fighting defensively, Guardsmen are all you can do... or keep some cheap units in your stack (catapults etc.) expressly as Assassin fodder.

Oh, and try to heal your top-level units somewhere deep in your own territory, where the Assassins can't get at them.

All in all, it's not easy to counter Assassins... but then, it's not supposed to be...

Edit: just saw the other posts - using Hawks and Workers definitely doesn't help anymore, they are ignored ... as are ships BTW

 

[Dragonlord]

Finally managed to level a Grigori Medic up to a Luonnater, expressly so I could (I thought) use Inquisition to get rid of those pesky AV in my cities and lower the AC.... and now the ability/spell doesn't show up!

Is this a bug, or does the Luonnater have to learn the spell as well as gaining the ability? So I'd have to level him to 7 first? Anyone know?

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

you can't usre Inquisition without a state religion. so Grigori and Illians can never do that due to the Agnostic trait.

 

[chocmushroom]

But that does not make sence, they used to be able to do it, they are there to remove religion from your lands

 

[Kael]

Patch "p" is linked in the first post. It won't break save games and makes the following changes:

1. New Dwarven Arquebus model by seZereth.
2. iAttacker is now correctly passed to the scenario onUnitKilled function.
3. New Arquebus model by seZereth.
4. New Balseraph Courtesan model by seZereth.
5. New Asssassin model by seZereth.
6. New Malakim Assassin model by seZereth (and the Malakim can now build assassins).
7. Diseased, Plagued and Plague Carrier no longer effect the heal rates of other units in the plot.
8. March gives +10% heal in Neutral and Friendly tiles (it used to only effect enemy tiles).
9. Combat 4 no longer effects heal rates (it used to give +10% heal in neutral tiles).
10. Combat 5 no longer effects heal rates (it used to give +10% heal in enemy tiles).
11. T3 units (Mages, Assassins, Rangers, Champions, Horse Archers, Longbowmen, Priests, etc) never obsolete.
12. Marksmen no longer require Mithril to build.
13. Fixed a very weird visibility CtD (game crashes when a unit moves into a plot).
14. Fixed an issue that was causing damage resistance to not be calculated correctly (thanks Snarko!).
15. Fixed an issue that caused Council of Esus civs to be kicked out of vassal lands when declaring war.
16. Fixed an issue that would allow you to ressurect a hero another civ was in control of.
17. World units can't cast Lichdom anymore.

 

[wuntoothrie]

Edit: just saw the other posts - using Hawks and Workers definitely doesn't help anymore, they are ignored ... as are ships BTW

sucks ... I use to use slaves as assassin buffers ... considered them servants/body doubles ... tigers are still good if you're FoL ... and I think skeletons too, but Assassins seem to single out arch-mages and heroes

now I'd suggest stoneskin for your mages .. keeps most assassins at bay, but for shadows or marksmen or high level assassins you need a bodyguard ... well worth it to train a bodyguard to protect your VIP's

Bodyguards have a long history of being critical to any military operation back to the stone-age. So, why not make a body-guard available soon for FFH? Proper use of it still takes strategy on the part of the player, but the tools should be available, please!

I like this idea because I liked using buffer units to protect my Mages (as I tend to run Mage rich armies) but the well trained Melee Unit I think is the perfect solution and I dig the new dynamic ...

I agree though that it should be a more easily accessible promotion maybe only requiring combat I or II ... I think the only difference would be how special it makes Bannor units (lowering the requirements might make the bannor feel somewhat slighted) and how good a bodyguard you'd be getting (ex-Policia as opposed to ex-CIA) ... and I personally think that you get what you pay for ...

a bodyguard unit would be cool though ... an add-on unit ...could work like a great commander but just for mages ... they could absorb 1 attack and be spent in the process ... priests too, maybe ... though with the proper promotions they can usually defend themselves ...

but like I said I do like the change ... the slave/hawk/worker buffer seemed a but like cheating ...

on a side note ... I miss Gaelan ... I know the guilds are out for the most part, but I miss Gaelan, maybe he could just be an event reward like Lord Neitz ... I don't know, I just Miss Gaelan ...

 

[Dragonlord]

you can't usre Inquisition without a state religion. so Grigori and Illians can never do that due to the Agnostic trait.

I feared this might be the problem - but it really doesn't make sense! An Agnostic civilization should have it easier to remove a religion, not harder... and I don't think this was intended, else why give the Luonnatar the Inquisition ability in the first place?

@Kael: could this be changed? My Grigori are helpless against the AC as it stands...

 

[Keroro]

I feared this might be the problem - but it really doesn't make sense! An Agnostic civilization should have it easier to remove a religion, not harder... and I don't think this was intended, else why give the Luonnatar the Inquisition ability in the first place?

@Kael: could this be changed? My Grigori are helpless against the AC as it stands...

lurker's comment:
Agnostic means an ambivalent position with regard to religion, not an antipathy towards it. In an agnostic civ it would be normal for all religions to have some influence, without one in particular being able to dominate. An inquisition suggests a vendetta persued by one religion against another, so IMHO the present situation is fine. Can anyone think of an atheistic inquisition?


EDIT - Wow, I didn't know that we had official lurker tags now.

 

[azzedar]

lurker's comment:
Can anyone think of an atheistic inquisition?


EDIT - Wow, I didn't know that we had official lurker tags now.

He never heard of Richard Dawkins, did he?
If there was an atheistic inquisition, i suppose he would be the chief inquisitor (or however the guru of guru of inquisitors would be called[...])

/edit:
btw. in the name of all philosophical godkillers i demand a grigori hero called <Richard Dawkins>! :>

 

[Keroro]

He never heard of Richard Dawkins, did he?
If there was an atheistic inquisition, i suppose he would be the chief inquisitor (or however the guru of guru of inquisitors would be called[...])

/edit:
btw. in the name of all philosophical godkillers i demand a grigori hero called <Richard Dawkins>! :>

Good point there, he does seem to have that determined, blinkered, dogmatic inquisitorial frame of mind. If there's anyone who has harmed the image of atheists more then I have yet to come across them. A pity, since some of his early writing was beautiful to read.

Anyway, I think that he would suit Grigori very well. He has an excellent floppy fringe.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

Can anyone think of an atheistic inquisition?

See the PRC and the USSR.

 

[Bezhukov]

A bizarre encounter with Assassins:

I was fighting Faeryl who had built Nox Noctis, so I couldn't see what was coming, although I was the Sidar with the home field advantage, so I'd just chewed up about 100 of her Champs and Nixs. Yvain is fully healed and powered up (combat 5) in a stack of 20 or so various units.

She brings an Assassin and Yvain (!) defends. Yvain proceeds to eat about 15 Assassins in succession, with some of Faeryl's own Assassins defending after Yvain commands them. Eventually Yvain takes one for the team, and the rest of the stack survives the 30 or so additional units Faeryl throws at them.

Very strange all around.