Hammer of the North v2 PBEM

Patient English said:
Arthedain. We will withdraw our ship. It is just peacefully exploring.....If you were to send us your map, we could avoid this entirely. We would be happy to send you our map in return....;)
Well i figured since we were at war and we're on a cease-fire basis now, I don't want any military ships in our waters, I don't think you want our ships in your waters either. And we don't want ships there now when this conflict in Europe is here. That's why.. :)
 
We thank our Frankish allies for their information and gifts. Aenglish explorers are returning in their mercenary Drakkar to home waters...

We welcome the new treaty of alliance with Scotland, and have build a new road to link our realms...

No combats.
 
Patient English said:
Well, OK. But we know you have at least one city in Wales, and two Viking chiefs (one in Wales, on on the Scottish borders). Are you going to withdraw your warriors to their encampments?

Denmark has no cities there. :crazyeye: :lol:
 
Frankish-German war
Frankish veteran Archers destroy the mighty Saxon siege engines assembling outside the walls of Liège, including one Mangonel and one Siege Tower, and one additional unit.

Poorly protected by the nearby Abbey, the Saxon defenders apparently relied on the safety of their Siege Towers, whose defenders nearly destroyed the Frankish attackers. Ultimately, however, their mighty cover was destroyed.

Leaving the protection of Worms castle, the Frankish king himself led the Charge against the town of Mainz, while leaving the siege of Worms to his trusted siege forces.

Mainz suffered severe damage during the fighting that followed. In remembrance of their dead mutilated friends at the slaughter at Liège, Frankish troops rallied to burn the monastery of the town to the ground. After taking their rich plunder from the monastery, Frankish forces were ordered to withdraw from the town to the refuge of Worms castle, receiving fresh reinforcements.

Worms was bombarded and reduced by Frankish mangonels, and the defending spearmen destroyed.

Other affairs
King Charles kindly request the Norse Chief taking camp in the Soissons Abbey to withdraw to the Norse domains in Normandy, as his forces are draining the area for the ressources distributed by this Abbey.
 
Let me get this straight.
You had a veteran archer, assualt my veteran seige tower (base defense of 12), which was also then doubled in it's defensive (hill) value... 24. And you lose nothing? What am I missing, here? Are the Frank archers so different that they're throwing tactical nukes!? <frustrated non-jest>

If this is the 'norm' for this scenario, I would suggest that something is seriously flawed. There can be NO POSSIBLE BETTER defensive value in the entire friggin scenario, unless it's my same stuff on a mountain, instead of a hill.

If this is normal, please tell me, as I am then obviously in serious trouble understanding the concept of the non-modern game, and better stick to more modern scenario's. Obviously, I am somehow missing something 'obvious' to apparently everyone else, and I have no desire to become a laughingstock. I'd rather quit, than not figure this one out, so would you, could you, please explain this one to me? Anyone?

It's totally rediculous. No offense, but then why waste time researching, when spears defend just as worthlessly?

~Frustrated Gary
 
@Gary
Chill out. I destroyed your stack against all odds with one veteran Archer. I didn't see you Siege Tower first, but attacked your stack, showing a mangonel. The Siege Tower took the defence instead. Your Siege Tower was not fortified, and on undefended terrain, and while still a strongpoint - amazingly though, it took the blow.

If the Siege Tower had been on fortified grounds, or better a more defensive terrain, my Archers wouldn't have had a chance, veteran or not.

When I designed the units for this scenario, I did a tremendous amount of research on medieval warfare. I wanted a balance, that made missile fire important, Archers and Siege Engines in particular, as sieges were paramount in medieval warfare. I wanted Siege Towers to be a temporary base of defense, allowing one to bring in a buildup of mangonels, archers, defensive and construction units, outside a city.

I didn't want, however, that this should be impregnable, as it would be completely unreasonable in you could completely rely on just a Siege Tower for the defense of a complete area (not to mention the AI stacking them in their cities for defenses, which I wanted to avoid). So I made sure that missile units had a chance (if slim, in the case of Archers) of damaging a Siege Tower.

This would be quite common in a siege situation. Archers on the city walls attacking the approaching enemy, and the Archers on the Siege Tower returned fire. In many cases you need to bring in the monks or craftsmen and build a castle on the site as a more permanent base for an attack.

On flat ground, even mounted units will have a shot at cracking a Siege Tower, if they are able to attack it. This is also historically grounded, as mounted units in a besieged town or castle often would attempt a breakout from the siege.

Another consideration I made, and which is of paramount importance in this scenario, is that terrain is everything. This is also historically grounded. Every unit in this game will be likely to lose to a just slightly able attacker on undefended grassland. And even the weeniest spearman will be mighty, if fortified on a mountain site, within a castle.

The way to think strategy in this scenario, IMO (although I've seen the Duke employ other unusual interesting defensive measures for the Scots) is in terms of terrain, and control of areas. Abbeys are deliberately extremely rich, and with no defensive bonus (i.e. equivalent to grassland), making them the ultimate target of warfare, and difficult to protect. Most cities are also sited on grassland, with some notable exceptions, and are often very difficult to protect, unless walled.

If you are in striking distance from a city or area, from a well-defended Castle placed on a hill, riverside or mountain, the enemy has a very difficult time in conquering your cities and Abbeys.

Civ actually reflects the latest historical research in medieval fortifications quite well. This emphasizes construction of castles as a means of expansion, of controlling conquered areas, rather than, as traditionally thought, defensive strongpoints and sitting ducks for a siege.

In this particular case, Liège is quite well protected, sited on a hill by the river, and your inability to gain a strongpoint outside the city. Unless you can get into the Frankish occupied hill southeast of the city. As for your spearmen etc, they were hopelessly defending on flat land, against my superior mangonels and king.

In the latest update of this scenario, I've made Archers a wee bit more expensive, as I long have considered them the far best unit of the early game.

All that said, my veteran Archers beating your Siege Tower singlehanded is still a rare situation. They were almost destroyed, barely surviving.
 
Norse Turn:

Scottish offer accepted.
Danish offer accepted.

Norse units in England will be picked up next turn.
Norse units in France are moving towards Bayeux.

Offer proposed to the Danish and German kings.

No other events.
 
I figured it out on my own... but then have had no internet until now to reply. I know I am just as frustrated in "regular" civ games, when I have a veteran Battleship attack an unescorted transport... and every now and then that 'one in a million' damned transport WINS against a battleship!

Sigh.
Wrong strategy.
Anyone want to buy a lot of worthless 'friggin seige towers? They don't do ANYTHING (!!!) for you... they are actually WORTHLESS, with a '3' attack (veteran '4') archer able to destroy them... but man, they certainly LOOK like they are awesome on defense.

Will sell them very (civ2dip) cheap...

EDIT: and it WAS on a frigging hill... I made sure of that. Hopefully, next time the '1 in a million' random event probability falls MY way! Death to the Franks, even though all we can (now) do is blow farts at you. By the way, did I tell you? I HATE your scenario. :)
 
*lol*
I'll play my turn tomorrow ok? Nice.. ;)
 
Gary J. Durham said:
EDIT: and it WAS on a frigging hill... I made sure of that. Hopefully, next time the '1 in a million' random event probability falls MY way! Death to the Franks, even though all we can (now) do is blow farts at you. By the way, did I tell you? I HATE your scenario. :)
I love the way these one in a milllion incidents bring out the emotions in people :lol:
War is damn expensive and incredibly risky - that's half the fun ;)

And it was positioned on the Abbey straight east of Liège, I am positive. I lost my own men-at-arms at that same square, positioning them there by mistake.
 
I know I'm late but I had various problems before I could play.

Danes
Frisland under Danish rule has been Christian for a long period now, and during the Danish reign there missionaries have travelled to Hedeby and king Sven. Sven has always respected his christian population. The missionaries work has finally led somewhere, king SVen has decided to Christianise Denmark. This will of course take some time but the process has already started, thus the danish monarchy will get stronger. :king:
 
Something 'mega' wrong with the game. Doesn't even appear to be my saved turn, and I'm at a loss as to figure out what is wrong. I will try to see what's wrong, but may need someone's technical assistance.

Arthedain... and everyone else... are you guys sure you sent the correct save from the correct game??

Confused and lost... Gary
 
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