bcool
Deity
Funny...I was just looking at maintenance in the Sevopedia, it doesn't say anything about colonial maintenance? I was sure it was added in CivIV...
no colonial maintenance if the "no vassals" option is checked
Funny...I was just looking at maintenance in the Sevopedia, it doesn't say anything about colonial maintenance? I was sure it was added in CivIV...
Sorry...silver and gold before that of course. OSS is off to a solid game also, I think their pace is a bit slow maybe though.cough cough, well defending silver medalists
no colonial maintenance if the "no vassals" option is checked
Thanks for the discussion about HE and stuff - I regard it as ongoing, but here's a draft PPP for now:
There's three turns of anarchy planned, and not a great deal to be done with the war under control and little whipping to do, so I think this is reasonable as a 13-turn set.
Tech Path
100% on compass, then see if Joao will do drama+compass for machinery (we'll have same religion by then). If not, do 0% on CS until we have enough cash to see how much he wants for machinery, and then put just the right amount of tech on Mach for him to trade. Then continue binary research on Optics.
Civic changes
Anarchy is still one turn. Switch to Taoism T199 (spread in CC already, want to get diplo benefits with WvO earlier) then Paci+Caste T200 (keep slavery as long as possible in case of needing to whip trireme in GH)
Religion Changes
As above, Taoism T199. Anything to be done with other AIs before they start to hate us for our religion?
Tech Trading
bc and I had a discussion about trading drama to Joao - he now has it anyway. We could get Vicky's (Cathy?)110 for Drama, or Ragnar's 70 for Monotheism. By the end of the set, we hope to organise a Drama+Compass deal for Machinery once WvO likes us a bit more.
Other Trade Opportunities and Diplomacy
- Maintain current trades
- We traded away our marble to Ragnar for wheat for the , but we hope to change that during my set if something looks possible.
- Once someone has something worthwhile to offer for iron - even a few , I think - I wanted to give that away and build some warrior MPs. We don't really need them at this stage, but once the wars start and we lose trades, I thought we might want them. Currently we're +2 from trades (and another in forge cities for the gems). We do have dye, wine, ivory, our own silk and silver still to acquire soon - maybe we don't need MPs at all?
- Reject "Stop Trade" demands, particularly with Cathy, Ragnar and WvO who make up our 14 overseas trade routes.
- If we have an excess resource, unload it if we can get some cash
- If we have an expired deal for (easiest to check on the F4-"Active" screen by mousing over deals) and they have more income, cancel and try to get more. AIs will normally trade all their excess income for a resource up to about 10 (or more)
- Check if there are other deals that can be canceled/reevaluated.
- Reject research demands of low cost (<300 ) techs from others - we want their cash, not their liking.
- Reject other research demands (but will check with the team if at all possible before doing so)
- I'm thinking we accept a demand to go to war with Izzy (but probably AI won't ask since we are at war?) Will reject other war demands
Espionage
Adjust allocation to maintain a view of WvO research, but put any excess towards Cathy.
Great People
One in the middle of the set, after the revolts. About 85% scientist, 9% merchant, 6% artist, 0.1% engineer. Save them all, for bulbing Astro and war-time Golden Age as appropriate. I don't think it's worth waiting 6 turns for the chance of a non-GScientist Golden Age to save the anarchy turns, or various hybrid plans.
Workboats
We need three for the silver site and one for Hastings, and probably one for Vicky's eastern iron site. We have two en route. We also need one for GH which is nearly finished in GH.
City Builds
Still need two more theatres from somewhere...
- CC... Grow to 11 happy next turn and run seven scientists after the revolutions (plus two from GLib). Build Courthouse next (verrrry slowly - 30 turns if we don't help it, but finishing is worth about 32 per turn)CH is worth about 32, Monastery gains us at least 6 + ability to continue to spread if we need to.
- FH... Whip courthouse next turn before revolt, continue with workboat working fish, Gmine and coasts, unless switching Gmine to coast gets growth one turn earlier. (Basically, a workboat elsewhere will get those growths even faster...)
- SM... keeps fish, switch to something to 2-pop whip next turn (theatre?)
- PC... whip courthouse next turn, then workboat or finish trireme (do not run any artists, and turn off the damn spy!)
- MC... continue courthouse, then theatre
- BF... switch to barracks to whip, get marble back and build HE. Do not bother with artists to pop border
- FC... whip courthouse next turn, theatre
- GH... finish WB (run one artist to accelerate border pop to sync with WB), finish archer, finish trireme while growing to at least 8 before running merchants
- SR... whip missionary next turn, then work max food tiles while growing and finishing the granary
- London... has just been poisoned, but if we whip a granary next turn, a chop will finish the courthouse and we can continue with theatre and barracks to prepare for GT.
- Nottingham... courthouse with artists after Caste to pop border ASAP, then max food
- York... chop lighthouse, artists for border pop ASAP, then courthouse while max food
Workers
- Strauss workshop N of SR
- Eiffel workshop N of SR for a turn, then to jungle, then one turn on horse pasture, then onto Beta and NG galley chain, then offload on jungle south of BF to chop and workshop
- Stevenson chop forest, workshop south of FC (maximises chance of forest growth)
- Hoover get off in Nottingham, chop forest NW of Nottingham, then start workshop there, then move to forest 2N of Nottingham to chop it after the border pop
- Yeltsin pasture horse for three turns, then onto Beta and NG galley chain, then offload on jungle south of BF to chop and workshop
- BF worker (near SM, named MacAdam) workshop north of SM, then NW of SM, but interrupt to load onto Beta and go to BF to chop and workshop there.
- Nottingham worker (in Nottingham, named Goethals) moves along roads toward London, then to the forest 2N of London to chop. This maximises the chance of a forest regrowing while we chop the others.
- Captured worker (SW of York, named Brunel) moves to forest S of York to chop into lighthouse. Then chop forest S,SW of York after running artists to pop the border.
War Plans
Alternatively, the cat can wait in London while the York healing stack does so in York, and the cat leaves London to meet the York units on the tile 1NW of iron. Since Hastings is unlikely to build any/many more units, I think this gives sound odds of taking both cities fast to get rid of the motherland unhappiness.
- I think we need to pillage the iron right away....I don't see that in the plan???
Also, are we keeping the eastern iron city or razing it?- Fetch Great General from GH when the missionary arrives, and take him to the HE city to settle.Where is that? Hastings with some workers!
- Catapult to hill near Hastings under the axe, bomb down Hastings. Attack if she leaves only one unit in Hastings.Promote the Axe for better defense???
- Take uninjured sword and two axes in/near York to wine en route to Hastings.
- London catapult waits for a turn, then 2SW onto forest, then S onto stack arriving from York.
- Upgrade one cat CR1 and attack Hastings. Will have second cat from London available as needed, and four uninjured swords and axes, including CR1+CR2 sword. Should be fine.
- Other two swords, cat, axe and archer heal up one tile north of York. This allows the stack to cover either city as needed, and still move on Canterbury (1N of eastern iron) soon.
Triremes
Trireme "La Couronne" heads into PC to heal up - what promotion, if any?
Trireme "Paralus" heads up to bust fog near the silver site
Other triremes RIP
Galleys
- Argo RIP
- Kon-Tiki off-loads settler in Nottingham and continues to the silver site crab tile. Settler walks along roads to the tile 1N of corn. Then to iron and tundra and finally to the silver city tile if necessary. It could stay on the boat at plant at the same time, but we would not have vision of the tile 1N of the iron at the time we offloaded. K-T then continues through the new city with Paralus to provide vision near Hastings, and later a landing force for Hittite.
- Nautilus could accompany the above
- Beta lurks near the horses and prepares to take Eiffel and Yeltsin via galley chain to jungle south of SM, then to tile 1S of MC to get the second missionary (who won't produce until after the revolts), take him to GH, get the GGeneral and take him to HE site. The timing seems to work.
- New Galley moves to clam SW of CC to set up galley chain for Eiffel and Yeltsin
- Ferry heads east to move MacAdam to BF once the border pop is due.
Stopping/Pausing Conditions
A barbarian spawns in an awkward position that I can't immediately deal with
AI declares war on us
war with Vicky goes badly
Checklist every turn before hitting end turn
double check MM and whip timing for each city
check tech trades available
check if and what AI have researched from F4 screen
check for new/better resource trades
check espionage screen for large sabotage production values in all visible AI cities
check if any AI went into war prep mode
check for any barbarians
turn off spy specialists
save the game
While scouting
will put a note that notes the most recent location of barbarians
will put a note that notes the most recent location of all AI units
You really think BF is better than both PC and Hastings for HE? Hastings in particular seems much more suited.
I liked your first plan of getting navy from BF and keeping the ground troops coming from the line.
I still think an early super medic should be considered also. It might really speed our next war to heal better.
Do we know when Canterbury was founded so we can estimate growth to size 2?
bc would have to look in his saved games, but 16 turns from founding (between T189 and T193) is probably more than the time we'd need to send a critical-sized force against it. So if we want to keep it, there's again no rush to head for Canterbury.
CC... Grow to 11 happy next turn and run seven scientists after the revolutions (plus two from GLib). Build Courthouse next (verrrry slowly - 30 turns if we don't help it, but finishing is worth about 32 per turn) (Edit Ron suggested a Monastery, which would take the same length of time, but that length of time takes us to about when the path is complete and the monastery would have very little value, and a courthouse will keep doing something more useful for the rest of the game, albeit still small)
sureFH... Whip courthouse next turn before revolt, continue with workboat working fish, Gmine and coasts, unless switching Gmine to coast gets growth one turn earlier. (Basically, a workboat elsewhere will get those growths even faster...)
maybe a trireme instead of a theater, we need to find joao, and izzy their trades routes would be valuable for us.SM... keeps fish, switch to something to 2-pop whip next turn (theatre?)
workboat I think after the courthouse, let SM whip a triremePC... whip courthouse next turn, then workboat or finish trireme (do not run any artists, and turn off the damn spy!)
maybe a warrior instead of a theater it will have time to build the theater. I want MP, just in case we need an emergency upgrade.MC... continue courthouse, then theatre
BF... switch to barracks to whip, get marble back and build HE. Do not bother with artists to pop border
Maybe we let the chop finish the courthouse and so preserve a pop. Then maybe this can be drafted too?FC... whip courthouse next turn, theatre
whip trireme here I suggest for early warning against attack from cathy and more scouting, then finish workboat, then archerGH... finish WB (run one artist to accelerate border pop to sync with WB), finish archer, finish trireme while growing to at least 8 before running merchants
need to look at ideal hammer/food mix for granary build.SR... whip missionary next turn, then work max food tiles while growing and finishing the granary
London... has just been poisoned, but if we whip a granary next turn, a chop will finish the courthouse and we can continue with theatre and barracks to prepare for GT.
sure, chop here for courthouse too I think.Nottingham... courthouse with artists after Caste to pop border ASAP, then max food
yes, I think Forbidden Palace after lighthouse and courthouse. I think chop for lighthouse and courthouse if possible.York... chop lighthouse, artists for border pop ASAP, then courthouse while max food
If you really don't see a benefit to a monastery, then I would lobby for either mp's for outer cities or navy, something that can be whipped in an emergency. I just don't see the need for a CH here.CC... Grow to 11 happy next turn and run seven scientists after the revolutions (plus two from GLib). Build Courthouse next (verrrry slowly - 30 turns if we don't help it, but finishing is worth about 32 per turn) (Edit Ron suggested a Monastery, which would take the same length of time, but that length of time takes us to about when the path is complete and the monastery would have very little value, and a courthouse will keep doing something more useful for the rest of the game, albeit still small)
I'm happy with the courthouse, and I assume we won't have hammers to use the monastery since it is all scientists all the time after the revolt.
I am in the Trireme go scout SE camp.SM... keeps fish, switch to something to 2-pop whip next turn (theatre?)
I would build Trireme > WB after the CH just to be a bit safer. The test game seems to show a bit of an increase in barb activity about T202-204.PC... whip courthouse next turn, then workboat or finish trireme (do not run any artists, and turn off the damn spy!......the spy is in BF)
I was leaning towards the worker....but here is a great reason to send at least 1 unit onto the hill at Canterbury! From the hill we get to see how many workers we have the chance to capture. We may not need to build as many as we think. I would build either Trireme or Galley, or WB I guess. We need 3 more WB's total as of now. Try not to build anything not directly related to navy.I would rather whip another worker here and build HE in hastings.BF... switch to barracks to whip, get marble back and build HE. Do not bother with artists to pop border
Why not whip it this turn?... no reason to wait to whip since it is only a 1 pop whip. Get to the Theater build sooner.FC... whip courthouse next turn, theatre
I like whipping the Trireme this turn, finishing the WB with the overflow and then finish the archer. Then probably pick up the navy builds for the rest of the game.GH... finish WB (run one artist to accelerate border pop to sync with WB), finish archer, finish trireme while growing to at least 8 before running merchants
Whip missionary yes, granary yes, but probably want to work the mine some as bc was hinting at.SR....
Again it would be great to know how many workers we can look to capture. If we are close to getting workers for free, then I would lean towards mabs plan. If no or few workers, then maybe whip a worker here.London... has just been poisoned, but if we whip a granary next turn, a chop will finish the courthouse and we can continue with theatre and barracks to prepare for GT.
You convinced yourself this was the best spot for HE....does Forbidden Palace still fit here? I don't think we have time.York... chop lighthouse, artists for border pop ASAP, then courthouse while max food
The monastery benefit is better than the courthouse, however we won't benefit from it until it is built.RE: Monasteries....I thought we were to quit teching before Scientific Method? IMO, if we have to go past SM in this game we played poorly. If we don't obsolete Monasteries, then one in CC makes a lot of sense. CC currently produces almost 1/2 of our sustainable beakers 77/157, and that number will increase with the switch to Caste. At 0% science, CC will produce 100% of our science which will still be 57b/t base, so even here the monastery offers a decent payback time. For the same investment of hammers as a CH, we get a much better ROI. The benefit of a CH here is only 2.4(now) up to maybe 3 g/t + the 2EP.
I was leaning towards the worker....but here is a great reason to send at least 1 unit onto the hill at Canterbury! From the hill we get to see how many workers we have the chance to capture. We may not need to build as many as we think. I would build either Trireme or Galley, or WB I guess. We need 3 more WB's total as of now. Try not to build anything not directly related to navy.
Are we thinking of settling the Ivory city S of York? If so, that should really happen ASAP. Maybe get a settler out of BF or ???
The ivory site is good as is the old GT site we were considering. I think BF could slow build workers and/or settlers after it whips a worker.
York... chop lighthouse, artists for border pop ASAP, then courthouse while max food
You convinced yourself this was the best spot for HE....does Forbidden Palace still fit here? I don't think we have time.
The first thing I see is that I want to send the healthy promotable Axe to the hill overlooking the new city. From there decide how we can best utilize our troops to take out both cities asap. She has about 1/2 as many troops as we do based on the demo screen. We should be able to split our forces and take both her cities quickly.
Would we consider moving our capitol to the English landmass? We would have much reduced colonial maintenance because most of our other cities are on single city landmasses. Not sure we can spare the hammers, but wanted to throw it out there,
Sort of on the above note, why are we building a Courthouse in FH? Will it really pay off that close to the capitol? It is only saving us 2.1g/t at the current size, a bit more as it grows. If we moved the capitol, it would make great sense, as would one in CC.
Hastings might be good for the HE depending on what it has after capture (sacrifice a courthouse maybe?) I think we want the forbidden palace in York. This would allow us make skipping a courthouse in Hastings more palatable.
I want to scout cathy, there is a small chance she is targeting us. It is very small but if she is, it is devasting. I think we might want to whip the trireme in GH and send it over to scout between us and cathy to give us time to see any fleet coming our way.
pushing revolt to T200?
idea for london, granary T198
T199 whip granary start barracks
T200 whip barracks, finish granary
T201 finish barracks
T202 finish? courthouse with OF
BF might build worker and whip for OF into a barracksHE on T200(when we can cancel marble trade I believe)
oops would have to build the barracks first