Possible wierdness of captured water city territory

In civ 5 and BE a tile belongs to the city that acquired it. Doesn't matter which city is closer or which works the tile. This becomes relevant when dealing with resources that allow a building to be built and when a city is captured. You can miss out on a resource building in a city because an older city acquired the tile long before. I've also had times when I've captured a city and found I got very little of the actual territory near the city, but got some on the outskirts. This being caused by the city being built in existing territory and then grabbing the territory at the edge.

I'm wondering if it could be particularity crazy with moving water cities. A strategy talked about on streams is having a water city continuously move and planting cities in the territory it has acquired later. I see some potential problems happening. If you capture one of the cities in the 'wake' of the mover you might get no territory at all because it all belongs to another city. If your mover city is captured you could lose all the territory around all your water cities, leaving them trapped in enemy territory. Or, your mover city could own all the resources that allow for buildings and have alloy foundries and xenonurseries while they are no where near those resources, and none of your other water cities have access to those buildings.

So am I over thinking that this might be troublesome?

Most buildings that require a resource actually boosts the said resource, so without it, it really hurts the actual building, making them less powerful.

I was wondering if you could use aquatic cities to surround a landmass and trap a sponsor there, at least until they get a teleporter satellite up.

And what happens when one aquatic city runs into the territory of another from another sponsor? Does it flip tiles?

Eagle Pursuit said:

I was wondering if you could use aquatic cities to surround a landmass and trap a sponsor there, at least until they get a teleporter satellite up.

And what happens when one aquatic city runs into the territory of another from another sponsor? Does it flip tiles?

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I think yes would be likely for both questions.

I don't think it would be very feasible to encapsulate a landmass like that. It's probably possible but very conditional. I doubt it would be an effective strategy.

Another related question is how close can aquatic cities move to each other? I think that it will be the standard value of 3 tiles between two cities. But what if both two aquatic cities at 4 tiles away from each other move into the direction of the other city, could it be possible to have 2 cities with 2 tiles in between?

Hakan-i Cihan said:

Another related question is how close can aquatic cities move to each other? I think that it will be the standard value of 3 tiles between two cities. But what if both two aquatic cities at 4 tiles away from each other move into the direction of the other city, could it be possible to have 2 cities with 2 tiles in between?

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Supposedly aquatic cities can bombard other cities, so pretty close.

Eagle Pursuit said:

Supposedly aquatic cities can bombard other cities, so pretty close.

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To get that close you'd likely have had to move into their territory. So did your city overwrite their territory or just move through it?
A lot of unknown details about how this works.

Minor Annoyance said:

To get that close you'd likely have had to move into their territory. So did your city overwrite their territory or just move through it?
A lot of unknown details about how this works.

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Exactly. I'd like to see this happen, but I suspect Pete is too much of a peace-monger to ever try it.

Well I vaguely remember when they first announced ocean cities that the boarders of the sea would be a rapidly changing environment.

So I through that a city will just take over other countries territory of it were to move over it.

So I imagine that if you capture a water city you just get all the boarder unless there is more than one city in it, in which case you only get the base 6 tile radius and have to move the city to capture the rest.

EDIT:
This way there arnt little blobs of your territory over the ocean if you lose all your cities, but your water cities arnt useless if you have been using one city to get territory and it gets caputes you other cites in the same territory an-rt screwed.

Cities can attack each other? Cool

Everyone!

Guys, seriously, guys do you realize what this means? Do you realize what cities attacking other cites in the ocean means?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDfbwn9Yn7s

No really...


Okay, bad joke aside cities attacking other cities would be kind of awesome, even land based cities with a certain wonder like the mass driver being used as ultra long-range artillery.
Even now, this would essentially open up the possibility of using a city as a giant battleship.
That idea alone makes this an awesome idea.

It's actually a fair point. If one uses a city to capture say 10/15 tiles with city movement. IF that city is captured, will all tiles ever grabbed by that city switch over to the new owner ? Or just the 6 tile radius it has at the moment of its capture.

Imo, it's gonna be just the current radius of the city. I dont see how it cannot be full of bugs the other way around.

As for the city vs city thing. It's definitely something i'm gonna try asap. First game ? Yes to a mid difficulty NSA military campaign on a very aquatic map ! OPNESS is coming

If you thought russia liked to settle too closely to you... wait til you see their floating cities settle inside your borders right next to you to complain about you settling too near to their cities!

Eagle Pursuit said:

Supposedly aquatic cities can bombard other cities, so pretty close.

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Minor Annoyance said:

To get that close you'd likely have had to move into their territory. So did your city overwrite their territory or just move through it?
A lot of unknown details about how this works.

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Another thing is, you could be able to have your own cities at very close range to each other to have a strong defense at certain strategic passes. Or if you could move cities even next to each other you could, by placing 3 of them next to each other, create a super megalopolis with a very strong defense. Of course this will have undesired effects for science, culture and health. But in some cases this could be a viable strategy.

cazaderonus said:

Imo, it's gonna be just the current radius of the city. I dont see how it cannot be full of bugs the other way around.

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Possibly, but in at least one firaxis Thursday afternoon Let's Play video, Pete said that in oceanplay, you can very rapidly gain territory, but you can also lose it all very rapidly. That statement suggests the counter-possibility, i.e., that if Player A captures Player B's water city, all the tiles Player B had previously gained with that city are lost. Mind you, it could be that those tiles simply become uncontrolled, rather than falling into the lap of the conqueror, but nobody's said either way.

It's also possible that if you plant a new water city in territory previously claimed by a city that's moved on, that the new city will "take over" control of the territory in the immediate vicinity.

Kaigen said:

It's also possible that if you plant a new water city in territory previously claimed by a city that's moved on, that the new city will "take over" control of the territory in the immediate vicinity.

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You need to be either at war with the colony who's city 'moved on' or have an open borders agreement. And founding an outpost in another's colony territory likely still means a forced declaration of war.

GeoModder said:

You need to be either at war with the colony who's city 'moved on' or have an open borders agreement. And founding an outpost in another's colony territory likely still means a forced declaration of war.

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I think that Kaigen is referring to the case that your colonist is just outside another sponsors borders settling a floating city. Would your outpost than grab the tiles that are previously of this sponsor during the development to a city? Well in anycase I would like to know the answer too.

Hakan-i Cihan said:

I think that Kaigen is referring to the case that your colonist is just outside another sponsors borders settling a floating city. Would your outpost than grab the tiles that are previously of this sponsor during the development to a city? Well in anycase I would like to know the answer too.

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Do outposts on land grab tiles owned by a city of another colony? AFAIK, no. I think the mechanic will work the same as it does now. If a tile is already owned (either your own colony or another), it will simply decrease the time needed to become a full fledged city.

I'm pretty certain, for gameplay reasons, you cannot move a sea city into a hex that is 3 hexs away from another, meaning that even if you did get the +1 bombardment range trait, cities will still lack the range to attack each other.

Moreover, I think the game will also add diplo penalties (and probably war) by moving a city close to someone's territory and grabbing it. Diplo penalty could be just like stealing hexes in civ 5 using citadels.

I also think the turns required to move a city will increase slightly exponentially just to make sure it's balanced. Rather than have a city that travels, say, 20 hexes in 40 turns with 1 tile movement every 2 turns. It would be more like 20 hexes in 55 turns and the production cost to move 1 tile increases a bit every time you successfully move 1 tile. The increased production cost to move would only be temporary, around 5-10 turns.