List of banned/allowed exploits for CotMs?

*'Infinite Wealth'/Research by specialists. Was a non-issue before with 1gpt/1 beaker p.t.
*Sub Bug. Causing the AI to declare by moving Subs next to their ships.

Oh, and in general I nowhere find a mention on false peace treaties, and gpt purchase and subsequently declaring to get out.

All I can find is RoP Rape, Palace Jump, Ship Chaining. And the banned ones 'Gold Mine' and 'Scout Denial' (everything else doesn't work in c3c anyway).
 
Doc Tsiolkovski said:
*'Infinite Wealth'/Research by specialists. Was a non-issue before with 1gpt/1 beaker p.t.
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wasn't the power of taxman/scientists intentially increased by the game maker? how is this an exploit by using a known game mechanic that was intentionally implemented?

Doc Tsiolkovski said:
*Sub Bug. Causing the AI to declare by moving Subs next to their ships.
Click to expand...
is this different much different than demanding the AI to leave when you know they will declare (ie, are furious with you)? I don't think this was ever disallowed here.

Doc Tsiolkovski said:
Oh, and in general I nowhere find a mention on false peace treaties, and gpt purchase and subsequently declaring to get out.
Click to expand...
false peace treaties, etc. were available before C3C came out. i don't think they were ever forbidden, anyways. you pay a price for this by ruining your rep.

sorry, but i don't see any new exploits in this list. i think the sub bug is a bug, but baiting the AI to declare on you was never disallowed in the GoTM.
 
I know breaking peace treaties is common practice, that's why I'm surprised to find it mentioned nowhere. Baiting the AI to declare is absolutely fine when they are obviously on attack vector - but buying Techs for gpt, and then not only breaking the deal, but recieving War Happiness since they run into one of 8 Subs around a ship is something completely different for me...

Using Specialists is of course intended; but you can turn your entire population into Scientists/Taxman (as long as they don't starve), earn the Beakers/Gold, and then enter the city screens via TBP/Capital production/disorder pop-up and the arrows, and then reassign everyone to max production...
 
good points :) i'll let the gotm staff comment for now. however, i think the taxman/science exploit is sorta covered:

GOTM page said:
Gold mine
You can make cities give wealth and production at the same time. First set the cities to produce wealth. At the beginning of the next turn when another city is done building something else you can go to other cities with the arrows above and change the production of the cities that produce wealth to e.g. some unit. That will get production as well.
Click to expand...
 
grahamiam said:
false peace treaties, etc. were available before C3C came out. i don't think they were ever forbidden, anyways. you pay a price for this by ruining your rep.
Click to expand...

The last part is not entirely true.
I use this trick all the time even in current GOTM37 without ruining reputation.(so it doesn't apply just to C3C)

Example: Make an AI furious with you (quite an easy task on Emp-Diety levels). Wait for the time when AI units comes wondering around trough your territory...
1. Make a crazy GPT deal.
2. Same or the next turn come back to diplomacy screen and ask him to leave. Bingo! AI declares war. You get tech and your money back. Your rep is not ruined, but AI has ruined his
 
grahamiam said:
good points :) i'll let the gotm staff comment for now. however, i think the taxman/science exploit is sorta covered:
Click to expand...
Not quite; building 'Wealth' uses production to generate Gold, so the player who does the 'Gold Mine' is using the city's shields twice. In DocT's example, the player gets the Research/Taxes from the Specialist, then gets production after assigning the specialists to work a tile. It seems prudent to extend the 'Gold Mine' prohibition to include moving Specialists back onto tiles until after the inter-turn sequence is concluded.

BTW, since food is added after Commerce but before Production, these Specialists do not generate food if moved during Production, but would generate food (and shields) if moved during SMTBP after a Tech is learned.

The sub issue obviously wouldn't affect all our fast Domination and Conquest players, but could have a considerable effect on the later Victory conditions, and especially for people chasing the 'cow' award. Not sure if it should be banned, though.
 
civ_steve said:
Not quite; building 'Wealth' uses production to generate Gold, so the player who does the 'Gold Mine' is using the city's shields twice. In DocT's example, the player gets the Research/Taxes from the Specialist, then gets production after assigning the specialists to work a tile. It seems prudent to extend the 'Gold Mine' prohibition to include moving Specialists back onto tiles until after the inter-turn sequence is concluded.
Click to expand...
This looks like rule splitting. To me the Gold mine rule clearly outlaws any deliberate attempt to get two different productions out of the same citizen. Either through wealth, taxes, specialists or by having them work a sea zone and then switching to a Mined Mountain.

Gold mine
You can make cities give wealth and production at the same time. First set the cities to produce wealth. At the beginning of the next turn when another city is done building something else you can go to other cities with the arrows above and change the production of the cities that produce wealth to e.g. some unit. That will get production as well.

Maybe it needs to be reworded to something like this.
You cannot use the Arrow keys in the city view to change the squares or specializations of any citizen in another city.
 
Well, that's a problem because I often forget to check for disorder, especially when at wars in rep. gov't. So between turns if I have a city go to riots, I'll zoom, then go through the rest of the cities and fix entertainers so the cities don't go down for a turn. If this is illegal, then that makes all of my GOTM entries invalid.
 
(QwertySoft has beat me, I see)

jeffelammer: I totally understand your viewpoint; the Gold Mine exploit as stated seems to focus only on Shields, using the shields twice, once to produce Wealth (which is something you can choose to 'make') and a second time to produce whatever. This doesn't cover switching Specialists or any citizens around.

I'd rephrase your suggested wording to say "You can't move Specialists to a workable tile during any part of the inter-turn sequence; that includes through using the 'Show me the Big Picture' option after learning a Tech or using the Left-Right arrows in the city display during Production or Civil Disorder. You CAN move a citizen from a workable tile to be a Specialist during Production or Civil Disorder for the purposes of preventing other towns going into Civil Disorder." This would allow someone the opportunity to adjust to pop-up CD, such as when a city flips to another civ or you lose Luxuries due to the AI declaring war on you.
 
There is a third way of using resources twice interturn, this should be disallowed as well:

-Two cities have access to the same tile. Interturn city 1 finishes something. You rearrange citizens of city 1 and go to city 2 via the arrows in the F1-screen and re-assign their workers to the tiles that are now available that were 1st worked by citizens of city 1. Also now you're using a tile twice.

I already thought this was forebidden, so I'm not using this. Looking at my COTM06 QSC build sequence, this 'exploit' could have given me approx. 30 food + 30 shields extra. Not a lot, but still a full settler, or in percentage 3-4% of total food & shield production of QSC.
 
You can make all the lists you want, but if a person is going to cheat or use an exploit, it is going to happen.

I figure it is like cheating at solitaire. Great! You won! But can you really appreciate the victory?
 
Oh yes, true. But I wanted to know which creative cheats I'm allowed to use. I believe RoP rapes and breaking gpt deals are worse than, say, "Scout Denial" by a huge margin; and not only that, they don't even require some smart set-up. Both bother me much more than Palace Jumps and Ship-Chaining (the first requires a lot of work to yield benefits in C3C, the later is a completely minor issue); still, they aren't even mentioned in the Code of Conduct.
So, when anything not specifically mentioned is allowed...maybe I can come up with some new exploits as well ;).
 
Actually Doc... I think you might find there is a "catchall" clause which prevents that. After the worker dogpile and the mobilisation cheats were discovered it became necessary to be able to reject a submission that used some new technique that was clearly in breach of the games designed intent in order to manufacture an advantage over the rest of the playing population. That's just a long winded way of saying - if it feels like cheating then it probably is and your submission will be refused.
 
M-B is correct. The following appears on the Code of Conduct page:

There are some types of exploits and bugs listed <here> that are specifically allowed or disallowed. If you wish to take advantage of a bug or exploit not listed then you must contact the staff via Private mail for a ruling on whether or not it will be allowed.
Click to expand...
 
There are a couple of bugs/exploits that should clearly be disallowed.. both seem related to the old bug where you could bombard anywhere with artillery:

A) Any unit that can be airlifted between airports, can be airdropped anywhere on map if you hit G, followed by Shift-T , instead of just Shift-T (need to be in a city with airport or on an airfield)

B) Tactical nukes can nuke anywhere on map if you hit G, followed by B instead of just B
 
Gyathaar said:
There are a couple of bugs/exploits that should clearly be disallowed.. both seem related to the old bug where you could bombard anywhere with artillery:

A) Any unit that can be airlifted between airports, can be airdropped anywhere on map if you hit G, followed by Shift-T , instead of just Shift-T (need to be in a city with airport or on an airfield)

B) Tactical nukes can nuke anywhere on map if you hit G, followed by B instead of just B
Click to expand...
Are these fixed in 1.22f? One of the pre-requisites for the COTM is that it is played under patch 1.22f.
 
ainwood said:
Are these fixed in 1.22f? One of the pre-requisites for the COTM is that it is played under patch 1.22f.
Click to expand...

They work in 1.22f, I haven't tested if they work in last patches of vanilla and ptw

edit: Tested ptw 1.27f, and it does not work there
 
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