2.7 AI-only Game Statistics: 4UC Edition

[Rekk]

There are two very different things that could be happening here:

1. Warmongers are doing well but just not winning via domination
2. Warmongers are doing poorly overall and weren't really close to winning by any measure

My experiences tells me its probably the 2nd and tweaking the rules for a domination victory won't affect it much. I also noticed another trend for warmongers that I'll share an anecdote about:

Spoiler A Story :

In my time in VP I've only ever played 1 game where an AI got to close to winning by domination. It was Mongolia and he killed everyone except myself (Byzantium) and Egypt. Mongolia had 6 capital cities but was way behind in science. The game was stuck in eternal 3 way war, Egypt and I both tried to win by culture but weren't able to influence each other. There was only like 2 city states not conquered, so no one could possibly get enough votes to win by diplomacy (there was like 11 votes total between the 3 of us). I was pivoting towards a spaceship but it looked grim I could hold out long enough, once the Mongols had air units all I could do was stall with my smaller unit supply.

However, Egypt is also losing ground. And once the Egyptian cities start falling, I had a chance. Because I'm already influential over Mongolia in culture, when Genghis Khan takes Egypt's last city, I win.

That story above was a few years ago, but I'll say that I still think the core problem is tourism. Notably that a successful warmonger has a ton of cities and smaller empires with strong culture will devastate him with tourism. For a cultural victory to not happen you usually need 2 culturally strong civs to cancel each other out.

Mongolia should've gone for the city with Great Firewall XD

 

[CppMaster]

Combat in this game is too complex for the AI to do some human-like maneuvers and the only thing they can do is duke it out against each other. Changing the rule is the only viable method.

Yeah and antiwarmonger doesn't help warmongers too. I wonder what results would be if it was disabled. I think I wouldn't miss it if it was removed from VP Is it even need anymore?

 

[Jdoug312]

Noticed that Aztec and Huns won twice from score but not from domination lol. Even when they're the runaway they couldn't even win before time ran out.
And ppl still don't want to make DomV viable for AIs after all this time.

 

[nekokon]

Yeah and antiwarmonger doesn't help warmongers too. I wonder what results would be if it was disabled. I think I wouldn't miss it if it was removed from VP Is it even need anymore?

The main point of different victory types is to create asymmetrical interaction/competition among all contestants despite differences in power/score. I don't think removing any of them would make the game better.
If any I would prefer to see more victory types to have more interaction rather than just playing builder/turtle all game, something involve different civs like religion or ideology or even a shared victory/alliance victory.

But again, not gonna happen until some dev actually make the whole thing by themselves and submit it to congress. Too big of a change to have as a proposal without a dedicated sponsor.

 

[CppMaster]

If any I would prefer to see more victory types to have more interaction rather than just playing builder/turtle all game, something involve different civs like religion or ideology or even a shared victory/alliance victory.

But again, not gonna happen until some dev actually make the whole thing by themselves and submit it to congress. Too big of a change to have as a proposal without a dedicated sponsor.

Actually, I saw on Discord that devs created religious and economic victories and 3 new ideologies! It looks very interesting.

 

[Rekk]

The main point of different victory types is to create asymmetrical interaction/competition among all contestants despite differences in power/score. I don't think removing any of them would make the game better.
If any I would prefer to see more victory types to have more interaction rather than just playing builder/turtle all game, something involve different civs like religion or ideology or even a shared victory/alliance victory.

But again, not gonna happen until some dev actually make the whole thing by themselves and submit it to congress. Too big of a change to have as a proposal without a dedicated sponsor.

He's taking about removing Anti-Warmonger fervor (the Combat Strength bonus), not Domination Victory.

 

[InkAxis]

I'm not sure how you're collecting this data but maybe some other things could be logged? Like I wonder about policy choice, or other choices the AI make like religion.

 

[Stalker0]

One thing that could skew these results. There is a current bug where the Kidnap specialist mission bonus never expires. This mean an AI that is using this mission a fair amount will have ludicrously high specialist bonuses in their capital. So this may be skewing tradition civs (or frankly any civ that is using this behavior vs another civ that's not). I know the AI uses this mission sometimes, but not sure how often.

 

[L. Vern]

One thing that could skew these results. There is a current bug where the Kidnap specialist mission bonus never expires. This mean an AI that is using this mission a fair amount will have ludicrously high specialist bonuses in their capital. So this may be skewing tradition civs (or frankly any civ that is using this behavior vs another civ that's not). I know the AI uses this mission sometimes, but not sure how often.

According to these patch notes

New Version - 1.3.4 (December 27, 2021)

Hey all, New version inbound, just in time for the holidays! Most of this is just bugfixes, nothing too exciting, but there are some cool features in here. Special shoutout to balparmak for his awesome work for this release, including making buildings invest-able later on, reducing the size of...

forums.civfanatics.com

that was fixed about a year ago, was there a regression?