Never mind - I really need a few barrels ofReveal tech makes resource visible on map.
That's why it should be on or before Enable tech.
Never mind - I really need a few barrels ofReveal tech makes resource visible on map.
That's why it should be on or before Enable tech.
Can you try to explain why they are needed in the first place?If this is done then the "Not in vicinity" national wonders are not needed at all.
Ok. And it still is. Is that an attempt to explain why we need to ensure that any buildings be made to require that a promotion is NOT within a city radius?It was possible to build your nation to have a resource but not in the vicinity of any city. This was because the cities were placed for maximum use of space which leaves plots outside city radius since we use square plots and fat crosses for city radii.
To be fair, you asked why "not in vicinity" wonders were needed, and that's what DH answered. Maybe you meant to ask "why should these wonders have to be built without the resource in vicinity?" But, well, um... you didn't.Ok. And it still is. Is that an attempt to explain why we need to ensure that any buildings be made to require that a promotion is NOT within a city radius?
Well, ok, so my question really is, why should these wonders require not in vicinity in the first place?To be fair, you asked why "not in vicinity" wonders were needed, and that's what DH answered. Maybe you meant to ask "why should these wonders have to be built without the resource in vicinity?" But, well, um... you didn't.
I don't have any problems with moving all plant and animal reveal techs to gathering/scavenging (or column later persistence hunting if revealed later).All plants should be visible at Gathering and all animals at the first Hunting tech.
If this is done then the "Not in vicinity" national wonders are not needed at all.
Shellfish is manufactured resource - that is you obtain it only trough building.Why "not in vicinity"? Because they are duplicates if the resource is in the vicinity. We don't allow two of anything just because you have two in the vicinity so why would you allow two this way?
Water animals also need to be early enough. Trap Fishing seems about right for fish, crabs, lobster and shrimp but Gathering would be right for shellfish. The Gatherer should be able to make a plot with one of these resources on it improved from a neighbouring land plot.
I said shellfish not Shellfish it being short for clams, oysters/pearls and murex.Shellfish is manufactured resource - that is you obtain it only trough building.
You would need to move all water animal resources reveal tech to Gathering.
They require one or two resources in vicinity.
Spoiler :
You would need to make new shellfish related building, that requires any of shelled animals (pearls/lobsters/crabs/shrimp and so on).
Most of water animals are revealed by Trap Fishing already.
Also "Not in Vicinity" could be solve by replacement:
Vicinity building would replace Not in vicinity building.
One in two cities is OK two in one city isn't because you can't do that with any other building.You do want the national wonder to be buildable whether or not the resource is in vicinity of one of your cities (I'm agreeing with TB). That does mean you can get two of the resource from one source, but you can do the same with two cities sharing a vicinity tile, so why not?
I don't see why you would want to build it in a city with the resource in the vicinity. You can already build the Farm or the Mine and then the Smelter there, so why would you want to build the NW instead?
Or am I missing something?
Ok to be perfectly clear, I don't think the national wonder should be buildable in a city with the vicinity resource, but it should be buildable in any other city even if the resource is in vicinity at one or more of your cities.One in two cities is OK two in one city isn't because you can't do that with any other building.
Actually it's not exactly true.One in two cities is OK two in one city isn't because you can't do that with any other building.
You can do that with many buildings that produce fruits, grain, berries, etc. Very often you can build quite a few of them, like Wheat Farm and Oat Farm (with Wheat and Olives in the vicinity).One in two cities is OK two in one city isn't because you can't do that with any other building.
Here's my problem with this. Once I have a city that has a vicinity resource access to horses, I no longer need another one. Anywhere. I can use that city to train my horses and send them around to make herds from there.Why "not in vicinity"? Because they are duplicates if the resource is in the vicinity. We don't allow two of anything just because you have two in the vicinity so why would you allow two this way?
Exactly.Actually it's not exactly true.
By building the national wonder you create a source of the resource in the city. You can have multiple sources of the same resource in the same city. You can have the same resource on multiple tiles around the city. Also you can build different buildings that give you the same resource, you can have multiple fruits, vegetables, nuts in the same city.
Strategically it doesn't matter if you have multiple sources of the same resource as long as you have at least one. As far as I know the only exception is when you trade your resources but I don't think that one national wonder makes too much difference in this case. It would be a very different case if there would be a volumetric resource system in the mod.
This is also an inaccurate statement. You can add a horse herd from a subdued horse where there is already a horse resource being worked. There are numerous buildings that create a bonus and by doing so create it with vicinity access for that city, and none of them are kept away from being constructable just because there's already access there. Look at the new salt generating buildings, for a non-animal example.One in two cities is OK two in one city isn't because you can't do that with any other building.
This is a second matter for discussion. To this, I'm a huge proponent of being able to see them earlier and thus being able to plan your city placements more effectively, particularly when some super important resources can be scarce enough that the only way you can get to them in time is to plan your way out to them from nearly the beginning of the game. However, I will agree that if you cannot use those resources, you shouldn't be getting additional yields from those plots. I may be able to correct that part of it in the code by finding where that extra yield is added to the plot based on visibility and change it to a tradeability function call instead.Concerning the visibility of resources: Out of a game perspective I would prefer to have them visible better later than sooner, it increases the suspense when settling early cities if you don´t know where the resources are and therefore is fun (in my eyes). And it is probably more realistic, too, who would have decided on the starting location of a village on animals, plants or minerals that at that time have no value at all?
E.g. I think that Iron Ore is visible too early. If you can´t process it to iron it just isn´t worth anything, just a brownish ugly mineral (copper ore at least has nice colours ). But it already increases mining revenue which I think it shouldn´t.