Deities on Earth

[vadalaz]

Just confirmed in IGE that it works (used Writers Guild to test though)



It's something I've been itching to try in a Futurism game, but now I can see how it can also be useful to get multiple GMus during International Games. With National Epic I think you can get three... Add Broadway and 3 faith GMus and you'll have an IG-buffed Musician for every AI on a standard sized map.

Not that it's something we really need to do in this particular game though, since I don't think an extra 2000-3000 tourism on one Musician is going to change much.

 

[Nizef]

Raider, you played a few turns before your technical problems. Should I try to continue from there, or how should we proceed?

 

[raider980]

Raider, you played a few turns before your technical problems. Should I try to continue from there, or how should we proceed?

No, go ahead and play from Beetle's last post, T221. So you all can continue from there. (Edit. I only played two turns).

I do think think the map settings (large, extra AIs) were a little ambitious for our first Succession Game.

I loved that aspect of it though. I've always wanted to play TSL Earth with lots of Civs but didn't want to take it on myself!

 

[beetle]

Agreed @raider980, I never would have tried TSL absent this game.

That is an amazing find @vadalaz! BNW is 8 years old this summer, but rebuilding Guilds is a brand new exploit! With strong cities, I see no reason why one could not pop four (!) GMu in ~15 turns.

Might be worth similar shenanigans for Great Writers? I think their value is just when you burn them, and nothing to do with when they are born. So no real harm having them siting around waiting for optimum bulbing. Seems like a complicated way to save a little gold on unit maintenance!

I am not seeing any benefit at all for pulling this trick with GA.

 

[vadalaz]

With strong cities, I see no reason why one could not pop four (!) GMu in ~15 turns.

Not sure how you're getting 4 GMus in 15 turns.

Even as Brazil, in the best case scenario you get 9 base GPP + 160% from Carnival, Sweden DoF, Garden, LToP, Aesthetics and ideology, plus another 25% in the National Epic city. So 23.4 GPP in the expos and 25.65 in the capital.

Assuming you have 4 cities at 99/100 musician points, and they all have put production into Musicians' guild so they can 1-turn it:

- you spawn one on turn 1; sell MG and rebuild it in the next city
- next GMu is now at 99/200 points, 101 points away, 5 turns at 23.4 gpp
- second musician spawns on turn 6, third one is 201 points away, 9 turns at 23.4 gpp
- third one spawns on turn 15, fourth is 301 points away, 12 turns at 25.65 gpp

So I'm getting 4 musicians in 27 turns at best. And that's assuming that the city governor will actually lock both musician tiles during the turn rollovers when you rebuild MG in each city. I think it's pretty safe if you put the city on culture focus. (edit: tested it and it doesn't add Musician points in the turn rollover when you rebuild the MG; so add 1 turn to all the timings above whenever MG is rebuilt)

Might be worth similar shenanigans for Great Writers? I think their value is just when you burn them, and nothing to do with when they are born. So no real harm having them siting around waiting for optimum bulbing. Seems like a complicated way to save a little gold on unit maintenance!

Rebuilding the guilds is a heavy production investment, I think it's not worth it just to save a bit of gold.

Doing this with writers and artists only makes sense if you're trying to wrap up a Futurism game as quickly as possible, I think. And even then there are probably better things to build anyway.

 

[beetle]

Thanks for running that math @vadalaz! Still 3 GMu in exactly 15 turns, Broadway for another maybe, and pretty easy to have 2500 faith for two more. And another GMu 12 turns later.

 

[Nizef]

Here we go:
t221 TR to Rio. Started on a few Hotels.
t222 AA desires Gold but I could not find it anywhere? Shaka denounces us but most other denounciations of us hold no more sway.
t223 Peace deal with Siam (200 g and 95 gpt). AA started on the Hermitage.
t224 No AI has more than 18.000 culture and thus I decide to take Flourishing of the Arts. I think a CV is very much achiavable after all. Rome denouned us.
t225 Buy OB from Siam. Start on SOH in Gondar. Buy a couple of Hotels (Adwa and Axum).
t226 Genghis asked a tribute from Lhasa and I told him to go to h-ll. We entered Information era and I sent the new spy to Rome as a diplomat and redirected our diplomat from Ulundi to Moson Kahni.
t227 Started NVC in AA. Sold MuGuild in AA, since we are at 298/300. The World Congress voted on the next host. I chose to vote on ourselves. Bought Gold from Siam for 2 luxes + 3 gpt to get a WLTKD in AA. Vancouver also liked us connecting Gold to our Trade Network.
t228 New SP. I took Artistic Genius to get the third and final GA and popped the two other GAs to fully man Uffizi. Marrakech fell to Rome.
t229 Palenque fell to the Aztecs. I started on Neuschwanstein in Lalibela. It is perhaps not that important but there is a CS quest for it.
t230 Denounciations fly in all directions. Buenos Aires are impressed with our culture.

We are making 172 tourism per turn at the moment. We have two turns until both NVC and Internet and I must say that, in my opinion, it looks good for a CV now. MuGuild needs to be rebuilt but after that we will get a GMu in one turn. Siam has the most culture, 20.001 to be exact and we have OB with them and a timely GMu bomb will do wonders.

 

[beetle]

Looking good! Are we building Mu Guild in Lalibela to also get it to 299/300? I agree the GMu will do wonders, but I expect us to need at least one more.

Disney definitely worth it, not just the EZ CS quests, but the Happy will mean faster SP and maybe another GA.

Are we trying to finish out Rationalism? Seems like it will be too late to do much good. But we could use finisher for Globalism and probably pass Freedom as WI. That is a little tricky with extra civs.

 

[Nizef]

.
Are we trying to finish out Rationalism? Seems like it will be too late to do much good. But we could use finisher for Globalism and probably pass Freedom as WI. That is a little tricky with extra civs.

I would expect us to finish Aesthetics first but after that I am open to suggestions.

 

[vadalaz]

T231:

• Stopped working scientist slots everywhere, we don't really need the science anymore. Could just sell all the science buildings too at some point if we need to buy something
• Annexed Osaka, bought Hotel, started archaeologist
• Sent the L3 spy to Sukhotai as a diplomat
• Lalibela started Musician's Guild. Bought an Airport and a Broadcast tower there
• Denounced Harun and Genghis. Gifted Salt to Shoshone, 5 Horses to Attila and Spices to Rome. Basically trying to improve relationships a bit so we can maybe trade OB

Interim: RAs with Gandhi and Gustavus end, we get Internet and a tiny bit of overflow into Rocketry. Rome becomes allies with Sydney, replacing us

T232:

• Finished Aesthetics
• Started Broadcast Tower in Axum, Archeologist in Adwa
• Faith-bought a GA. Will need a Golden Age for IG production.
• Problem civs tourism-wise are the Huns, Rome and Siam
• So I bribe Askia to DoW the Huns, Mongolia and Morocco, then I DoW Askia to break the deal and get a trade route back. I'm sending some Foreign Infantry to kill Songhai units or even liberate Sale and get the common foe bonus with the Huns.
• Bought Cargo Ship in Adwa

Interim: We're getting denounced by all the losers in the world. Sydney is in awe of us so we re-ally them. Not sure I care enough about this alliance to secure it with 500 gold. The game's almost over, I think I'd rather spend the gold on something else.

T233:

• Sent a TR to Lampang
• Bulbed the GA for another 12 turns of Golden Age
• Lalibela finished Mus Guild, governor correctly assigned specialists in turn rollover, but apparently that's processed after GP points are calculated. Resumed Neuschwanstein.
• Bought Temple in Osaka
• Capital finished NVC, started Grand Temple
• Started Broadcast Tower in Harar
• Traded OB with the Aztecs

T234:

• TR to Rome
• OB with Attila; pretty affordable now at 75 gpt and some luxes and strategics
• Tourism looking stronger than I expected, looks like this whole business with Musicians Guilds might be unnecessary

T235:

• Started Windmill in Adwa
• Bought 3 aluminum from Montezuma. We can get some Hydro Plants to boost production for IG
• Started Hydro Plant in AA

Interim: We're influential with Arabia. England allies Antananarivo.

T236:

• Started another Archaeologist in Osaka
• Attacking Sale. City will fall next turn

Interim: Rome allies Sydney again.

T237:

• Liberated Sale
• The city had a great work but apparently you don't get to steal that if you choose to liberate. Lame!

Interim: Ahmad offers me his open borders and an iron for Dyes. Since he's the one who offered it, I accept

T238:

• Finished Sydney Opera, got Bank happiness in Freedom
• Peace with Askia, got 460g and 70gpt
• Setting up production overflow for IG. Voting next turn

T239:

• Voted for IG
• New policy; took New Deal for better landmarks. 505 tpt now
• Bought Hydro Plants in Lalibela and Harar
• Bought Solar Plants in Harar and Gondar
• 5th in Manufactured Goods with 596 hammers now. Will have huge overflow as well.
• Bribed Japan to attack Songhai so that every single AI is at war
• Bribed Shaka to attack Brazil for 2 iron because the Zulus have too many ships

T240:

• IG passes, Scholars in Residence too
• Bribed Rome to DoW the Huns - those two need to be fighting because they have the hammer lead

*****************
Notes:

• Some of our cities are starving. I did this for the extra hammers, although it's probably overkill. I think we should be able to comfortably win IG here.
• Osaka will need to buy a Museum, a Broadcast Tower and an Airport.
  
• In 10 turns we'll have enough faith for 2 GMus. Lalibela's GMu is 9 turns away, Addis Ababa's will be at 298/400. The capital can then rebuild the guild and spawn the 400-point GMu while IG is still active.
  
• I think we might not even need all 4 musicians though.
• A trade route to the Shoshone would be nice.
• I think this was my last session in this game!

 

[Nizef]

Will you take the next turn @beetle ?

 

[raider980]

Wow, its going to be done in less than 20 turns? That's pretty impressive.

 

[beetle]

Will you take the next turn @beetle ?

Will do!

Edit to say that I open the file and am a little surprised to find that we are not at war with anyone. Doesn’t seem like anyone likes us.

We need Pearls for a few WLtKD. Anyone going to have agita if I DOW Shaka?

 

[raider980]

That doesn’t sound conducive to winning in under 20 turns. Don’t we need his on and to not get into a war? Of course I haven’t seen the game on like 20 turns.

 

[beetle]

We are four turns from influence over Shaka. Mostly it would be for the Lultz, and to thank him for so factoring so large in our choices. But we do not have air or artillery, so I probably won’t pull the trigger.

 

[beetle]

T241

• bulb GS for Satellites, now we can see the world. Three more NW, but doesn’t look like we missed any CS.
• buy Museum in Osaka

T242

• Reestablish embassies and check prices for OB; 300gpt+ everywhere, so no.

T243

• Motezuma builds Prora in Fortaleza
• India adopts Order
• Pocatello will have CR in ten turns, but I do not think we care
• IG 45% done, we have almost 3K hammers
• Buy Airport in Osaka

T244

• Pachacuit complains about jeans and music.
• Gustavus closes his border

T245

• Gustavus complains about jeans and music.
• Harun denouncing, but I doubt anyone cares.
• Liz and Gajah DOW Harun.
• Vancouver is impressed with our culture and is now our ally. I retract PoP.
• Caravan to Ulundi concludes, send to Delhi.
• Food Cargo Ship from Adwa to Axum concludes, so I move it to Osaka since that city has better options than Axum.
• Give Wittenburg PoP since they have the quest.

T246

• We win IG by less than 500 hammers, 738 tpt.
• Take Sovereignty, since we might need to close Rationalism for Globalism.
• Send Cargo Ship from Osaka to most profitable Shoshone city (Kamudeka).
• Food Caravan to Lalibela concludes, I move to Addis Ababa.
• I don’t know what I am doing at this point, so I put all cities on Culture and turn off Manual Specialist Control. I go through all the cities, and nothing looks terrible, so I stick with that.
• Archeologist in Osaka finishes a dig. Do a swap for one more themed Museum.
• Pedro builds Cristo Redentor.

T247

• Gajah complains about the Jean and music.
• Genghis denounces us.
• Close out Rationalism for Globalism.
• Addis Ababa sends Caravan to Attila’s Court.
• Buy Pearls from Caesar for 41gpt, oil, and one Coal. Less bother than DOWing Shaka.

T248

• Askia makes peace w/ Attila and Genghis.
• 3x WLtKD from the Pearls.
• Bribe Shaka into wars where it is cheap to do so.
• Bribe Attila to DoW Genghis for 17gpt.
• Lalibela resumes work on Neuschwanstein. Castles are up almost everywhere.
• Adwa starts on EIC.
• Addis Ababa working on CN Tower.

T249

• Washington, Askia, and Shaka complains about the jeans and music.
• Caesar make peace with Shaka. He wants like 3 lux to DOW anyone, except Askia is cheap, so I go with that.
• Bribe Shaka into wars where it is cheap to do so.
• Bribe Attila to DoW Genghis for 17gpt.

T250

• Pedro and Oda complain about jeans and music.
• Pocatello working on Kremlin
• Archeologist finishes another dig; we have one more working.

Some items of note:

• Lalibela will spawn GMu and GE next turn.
• 2500 faith in the bank, so that could be two GMu.
• 3900K gold, I had no idea how to best spend it!
• Six turns to influential on China and India.
• Seven turns to influential over Siam and Maya.
• Nine turns to influence over Shoshone.
• Ten turns to influential on Mongolia.
• Eleven turn to influential over Aztec and Rome.

Huns seem to the only difficulty, since influence is falling, despite OB, Trade Route, and Diplomat. I think @vadalaz is up, is that correct?

Edit to note that I had meant to turn off Quick Combat before uploading. Sorry about that!

 

[vadalaz]

The Huns probably burned a Great Writer, that's why our influence is falling. It'll go back to rising next turn if that's the case.

It's @Nizef's turn now. Looks like it'll be a short session, 3 GMus should be enough to win here.

 

[Nizef]

Here we go:
t251 Bought a settler in Harar. The idea being to gift a city to either the Huns, the Aztecs or the Shoshone. Not yet sure which AI will need it. Faith bought 2 GMus.
t252 Lalibela built Neuschwanstein. The mongolian turn alone took 1 minute on my computer! Used the GE for Hubble. I know I should have used it for the Firewall but I wanted to show off to our stupid neighbours.
t253 Moving GMus into position. Lalibela built Hubble.
t254 July came early this year. The 20 pop city of Juli joined the magnificent empire of Ethiopia, leaving the backwards Huns behind them.
t255 Founded the city of Bahir Dar. Bought OB from Siam and used one GMu there. Declared war on Rome and forced one GMu inside their borders. We are influential over both. Used the GS at 11.144 beakers each to get two techs.
t256 Gifted the newly founded city to Monty and used the third GMu there. We are influencial over all AIs. Before the game ended Genghis still wanted to point out that our empire is puny. I had to laugh in his face. I also noted that our religion, albeit practiced in 21 cities around the world, in fact is the smallest religion of all seven. Our world consists of 201 cities all in all.
t257 Game ends with a fantastic CV for the glorious empire of Ethiopia. Our culture is dominant over six AIs and influential over 14 and Russia did not make it to the end.

Take away: I had a lot of fun with this. We were not very well coordinated but it did not matter for two reasons: our start was "the best" in the history of Civ5 and every time it was needed, @vadalaz pumped new life into our game on his turn.

 

[vadalaz]

Thanks for uploading those screenshots. Good game guys!

 

[beetle]

Awesome! GG everyone, thanks very much for this, lots of fun! Yes, special thanks for @vadalaz for doing 20+ turns of work each time, and @Nizef for taking us over the line with flair (and the screenshots). (Can someone clue me in please as to where I should be looking for Bahir Dar?)