G&K Review by VentureBeat (65/100)

[Cymsdale]

http://venturebeat.com/2012/06/18/civilization-v-gods-and-kings-review/

Summary:

Pros:
- Early building has less ridiculous costs
- Diplomacy is better

Cons:
- Happiness system (reviewer really seems to hate this system, says ICS is the best strategy)
- Tactical AI

 

[headcase]

Fortunately this guy seems to have disliked Civ V from the start (especially the global happiness mechanic) so a 65 from him still gives me hope.

Judging from the tone of the review, espionage sounds simple but entertaining. Religion is only touched upon but apparently it ties into the diplo nicely at least.

This review is nearly proof that the tactical AI still isn't very good, so that's a shame.

 

[smallfish]

What about the naval combat system? Espionage? The new tech tree? Was that piece of bad combat situational (it was a CS, for cryin' out loud!) or endemic throughout the game?

I fear this review is too hasty

e: I have never ever seen CS NOT attacking your units whenever they are in range of city or units for that matter.

 

[nokmirt]

This guy acts like he never played CiV before, always citing things that came out in 2010, as if they were something brand new to him. I will not agrree to anything, until I try it myself. He is basically calling Dennis Shirk and Ed Beach liars, saying the AI is no good. We'll see early tomorrow morning if he is right. I still feel this is a biased review.

 

[Emperor Giulio]

Unlike the reviewer, I've learned to really accept Civ V for what it is. I found Civ IV harder to get into, but I eventually had a change of heart.

 

[MkLh]

"Once you have enough sway over a city-state, it becomes your ally and grants you bonuses specific to the type of state that it is. Mercantile city-states provide unique luxury resources, which give your empire happiness, and straight-up just hand over even more happiness. Ally with one or two of these and you’ll not have any limit on expansion."

Interesting. Does this mean that ICS is back? IMO ICS wasn't a problem nor optimal strategy in Vanilla after the patches (even when Global Happiness is a clumsy system), but will Mercantile CSs break it again?

 

[blackcatatonic]

Agreed with the comments in this thread. The new combat system hasn't been mentioned at all, and religion is only discussed in the context of diplomacy (although it is interesting to get some insight into how diplomacy will change).

 

[Veneke]

He seems to rate the improvements to diplomacy pretty well and there are a couple of interesting tidbits especially regarding espionage in there that would still pretty much match well with my hopes for G&K.

This though 'After converting several cities in Japan, leader Oda Nobunaga asked for my audience to give me an ultimatum: Stop spreading Tengriism or face the consequences' is unfortunate. This came up in the 8.5 review and this would seem to all but confirm it that an isolated start with a religion effectively means nothing from the point of view of diplomacy modifiers.

'... the A.I. still doesn’t seem to quite understand the importance of naval power' and 'Instead, I moved lancers and horsemen back and forth over a specific hex because Lhasa would first attack whatever I put in that space.' do not bode well, particularly the naval aspect. Having a poor combat AI is not ideal but its relatively acceptable considering the limitations. Not building ships when they're needed, however, is much more of a concern.

 

[nokmirt]

He seems to rate the improvements to diplomacy pretty well and there are a couple of interesting tidbits especially regarding espionage in there that would still pretty much match well with my hopes for G&K.

This though 'After converting several cities in Japan, leader Oda Nobunaga asked for my audience to give me an ultimatum: Stop spreading Tengriism or face the consequences' is unfortunate. This came up in the 8.5 review and this would seem to all but confirm it that an isolated start with a religion effectively means nothing from the point of view of diplomacy modifiers.

'... the A.I. still doesn’t seem to quite understand the importance of naval power' and 'Instead, I moved lancers and horsemen back and forth over a specific hex because Lhasa would first attack whatever I put in that space.' do not bode well, particularly the naval aspect. Having a poor combat AI is not ideal but its relatively acceptable considering the limitations. Not building ships when they're needed, however, is much more of a concern.

He probably reviewed the demo. On the live feed today, everyone keep an eye on the AI.

 

[smallfish]

The actual quote in which naval was briefly mentioned:

Many times when I approach a new Civ adventure, I just want to plunk down in some corner of the world a erect impressive structures of culture and significance that last the ages. Warring with rival nations can be a stressful affair that I’d prefer to avoid if possible. And if you choose an archipelago map type (because the A.I. still doesn’t seem to quite understand the importance of naval power), you’ll be left alone enough to build to your heart’s content.

I figured it was taken from his previous experience with vanilla CiV. It hurts this review even more that this new mechanic change wasn't elaborated with examples, and it would help if we knew what difficulty level he was actually playing.

 

[Putmalk]

He probably reviewed the demo. On the live feed today, everyone keep an eye on the AI.

I'm going to assume that the game they will be playing has been carefully examined to make sure little if not no negative situations can occur with the AI in their live playtest. It's going to be a PR machine. :/

You'll see what they want you to see of the AI, I'm afraid.

 

[nokmirt]

The actual quote in which naval was briefly mentioned:



I figured it was taken from his previous experience with vanilla CiV. It hurts this review even more that this new mechanic change wasn't elaborated with examples, and it would help if we knew what difficulty level he was actually playing.

Show us some evidence, your right. I guess we have to try for ourselves. There are going to be mixed opinions.

The one thing I'd like to see improve is the naval AI, that was the worst thing for me about CiV. It would perform an amphib operation, but very rarely would protect embarked units.

I'm going to assume that the game they will be playing has been carefully examined to make sure little if not no negative situations can occur with the AI in their live playtest. It's going to be a PR machine. :/

You'll see what they want you to see of the AI, I'm afraid.

Yes and the same goes for all these early reviews too. None of them can be trusted.

 

[Putmalk]

Show us some evidence, your right. I guess we have to try for ourselves. There are going to be mixed opinions.

The one thing I'd like to see improve is the naval AI, that was the worst thing for me about CiV. It would perform an amphib operation, but very rarely would protect embarked units.



Yes and the same goes for all these early reviews too. None of them can be trusted.

I heard something about naval units being able to stack on top of embarked units? Wouldn't that help the AI incredibly?

 

[nokmirt]

I heard something about naval units being able to stack on top of embarked units? Wouldn't that help the AI incredibly?

Not according to this dude. We'll see, your not going to find out in one playing. One reviewer gave the XP a 9/10 review, but he said he played it for weeks. Most seem like they played through it once briefly, and their reviews were likened to what they really knew, pretty much nothing.

 

[Txurce]

This review is nearly proof that the tactical AI still isn't very good, so that's a shame.

Yeah, I never thought it would be much better beyond the specifically-cited better army composition and naval attacks on cities.

 

[RohirrimElf]

So in one review i read the ai has improved tactically. In this one the AI hasnt improved. Which is the truth?

Ill like to know before buying the game.

 

[K7avenged]

So in one review i read the ai has improved tactically. In this one the AI hasnt improved. Which is the truth?

Ill like to know before buying the game.

Did Warlords or BTS fix civ 4's AI? Nope, just more units to add to the stack. Don't count on G&K fixing civ 5's AI issues either.

 

[RohirrimElf]

Did Warlords or BTS fix civ 4's AI? Nope, just more units to add to the stack. Don't count on G&K fixing civ 5's AI issues either.

Any mods then which helps improve the ai?

This game isnt really fun if i just mass up an army and dont loose any units through the entire game. Maybe the AI can mass up such a large bunch of units so that the kamikaze (run in and loose all units in a few turns) it normally does is more effective with the new combat system. Or maybe let me build an more diverse army then just archers/crossbows with few melee. At least i hope so as i like some of the other improvements to the game and find that the ai is the biggest letdomwn in civ 5.

 

[headcase]

Did Warlords or BTS fix civ 4's AI? Nope, just more units to add to the stack. Don't count on G&K fixing civ 5's AI issues either.

BTS's AI was a bit better, but only because they directly implemented the Better AI mod made by fans.

 

[Emperor Giulio]

It kinda annoys me that VentureBeat is the first Google search entry when you search for Civilization Gods and Kings. I hope it doesn't negatively impact the sale of the game, in-turn impact the progression of the Civ series.