HOF Mod to be made compulsory.

[socralynnek]

As ainwood has stated, the mod increases security. That reason alone would be enough for a competition. The other featuresare nice and make the decision easier, but I guess, that was only secondary.

 

[da_Vinci]

I'm argueing that installing mods that you do not need in order to play the game is strange. Cosmetic mod components often introduce more bugs than they fix and yes, they are still all cosmetic. Before I made my reply I had looked at each of the mods to see what extra options they would give and I still think they aren't that useful.
Autolog is the same thing as pen and paper and the bonus information from the advisors seem to be more like cheating info and half the important info you can figure out with Vanilla Civ and Vanilla Warlods anyway.

I don't mind to download a patch that actually fixes bugs, but I do mind patches with unnecessary components. If you want whipping changed then okay, I can understand it if you want that patched However, if you want to see which building each city has built, then I can point you towards the individual city screens. 20 second installation aside, if you want to play with those mods that's fine with me, but I don't understand why it would be necessary for me to download them as well.

Btw.. for as far as I know, whipping hasn't caused a problem in Vanilla Warlords.

I have not used the HOF mod (I guess I will in the near future), but the discussion (or argument) that the quote above is part of seems to be one of semantics.

It sounds like the mod has a host of efficiency features: auto log instead of keeping a pen and paper log, or even a log in word or excel; enhanced summary screens that eliminate the need to search each city screen for an empire overview, etc.

To the extent that these give you no more information than you could find before, or do not something you could not do before by other means, some might refer to that as cosmetic. But my sense is that the mod makes tedious tasks more efficient, and gives you the kind of briefing documents that great leaders have always had. A huge gain in efficiency (if it works like I expect) and time savings, and thus in my opinion more than cosmetic.

Now if the HOF mod gives you more information than you could get by some other means without the mod, then it would be a valid question to ask if the mod is akin to a cheat. But it sounds like the mod does not do that (confirmation, please).

dV

 

[EEO]

From my point of view, it is a very good decision.

Having to install the mod is a very little disadvantage.

On the other hand we have
- more security (it is important to ensure that we all play according to the same rules)
- an important bug fixed (for vanilla civ)
- useful features like exotic foreign advisor and autolog ( Iroumen, I can assure you for my part that these features are not cosmetic only ... )
- last but not least, simplification of administrative tasks in such a way that results will be published sooner (ainwood said 5 days after the deadline ideally... fabulous !!)

 

[godotnut]

Great news! I'm all for it. But prepare for a drop in accepted submissions, at least temporarily, until people realize the mod is a good thing (and that they really can't reload anymore).

 

[Mad Professor]

I have not used the HOF mod (I guess I will in the near future), but the discussion (or argument) that the quote above [Insert: by Iroumen]is part of seems to be one of semantics.

It sounds like the mod has a host of efficiency features: auto log instead of keeping a pen and paper log, or even a log in word or excel; enhanced summary screens that eliminate the need to search each city screen for an empire overview, etc.

When discussion first started a while back about making the HOF mod compulsory, I resisted the idea on similar grounds to what Iroumen was talking about, and main objection was having to use stuff I didn't want on my computer to play the game a way I didn't want to.

HOWEVER

Having downloaded and looked at the HOF mod, I like what I see. I don't actually use it when I'm playing still, but it certainly arranges information in a more easily finadable format, and that can't be bad.

My objections were also shown by my own investigation to be just about groundless. The download is minimal and the installation rapid, and unless you deliberately set it up to boot the mod every time it doesn't even load unless you go out of your way to load it. It can sit there in a dark corner being ignored if you like most of the time.

I have no problems with that idea, and pulling it out to use for GOTM's when I have to use it. From the point of view of the staff, it seems to be a HUGE bonus, so I'm quite happy for it to be compulsory, even if I only play one game a month with it. I will probably use it more often than that I suspect, but even if I don't it's no problem because of the way it is set up to be ignored if that's the way you like it.

Now if the HOF mod gives you more information than you could get by some other means without the mod, then it would be a valid question to ask if the mod is akin to a cheat. But it sounds like the mod does not do that (confirmation, please).

From what I can see the mod simply gives you the same info you'd be able to find without it, but in an easier to use fashion, with less searching. If you are not a meticulous player it might give you information you've never seen before, but that's only because you never went looking! It's information the better players DO go looking for.

 

[Ambiorix]

Haven't used the HOF mod yet, but from what I read here I'm all in favor of it.
Looking forward to more details from Ainwood.

 

[Vynd]

I'm fine with this decision myself. I think it is worth reminding those who object to the "cosmetic" aspects of the mod that you do not have to use them. The game security features and bug fixes are (I think) an "always-on" feature of the mod. The other, non-essential, stuff--like the altered Domestic and Foreign advisors--default to Off. You can play a GOTM game using the HOF mod without ever turning stuff like that on, if that's your preference.

 

[dowski]

Just played my first GOTM this month and elected to go with the HOF mod. I think making it mandatory will be a benefit to all players. I do not usually play with mods because I like the way standard Civ plays, but this one enhances the game without changing it (if that's possible ).

All of the info that is now easily attainable in the foreign advisor is great, and the event notices are helpful too. I forgot to turn on the event logger , but I will surely do so next month.

Anyhow, good call and thanks for the GOTM.

dowski

 

[Khalid]

I accept the change, though i wasn't much in favour of it. If it will reduce the admin work, its only good. I just want to ask somebody who understands the changes to provide a summary of all changes, which the mod provides. And please add details.

Example: HOF mod fixes the whipping bug. So now when you will use the whip, you will get x hammers per every whipped person, etc.

I have not seen a complete description of the HOF mod. On the HOF page there is only a summary of all mods used and I just dont't want to go through all those mod threads, so please is anybody will do it I would really appreciate it.

Thanks

 

[wwassme]

I'm playing GOTM 11 with the HOF mod and had played some prior games with it. I've found the features useful, particularly the enhanced Foreign Advisor, which gives more and better organized information on what the AIs have available for trade and on the diplomatic relations between the AI (the "glance" feature). The glance feature makes it easy to tell if your prospective trade partner is someone's "worst enemy," so that you can decide if the trade is worth the -1 penalty with the other AI(s).

The enhanced Domestic Advisor also provides relevant information in a more organized fashion.

I also like the notices that tell you when a city is about to grow, particularly when it tells me that the city will become unhappy or unhealthy as a result. I can then stop the growth if I want.

 

[DaviddesJ]

Cosmetic mod components often introduce more bugs than they fix and yes, they are still all cosmetic. Before I made my reply I had looked at each of the mods to see what extra options they would give and I still think they aren't that useful.

Features that add convenience are not "cosmetic". Cosmetic would mean that only the appearance is changed. The HOF mods do more than that, by presenting information in a more convenient and accessible way.

 

[Lexad]

I totally support the idea.

 

[Denniz]

I accept the change, though i wasn't much in favour of it. If it will reduce the admin work, its only good. I just want to ask somebody who understands the changes to provide a summary of all changes, which the mod provides. And please add details.

Example: HOF mod fixes the whipping bug. So now when you will use the whip, you will get x hammers per every whipped person, etc.

I have not seen a complete description of the HOF mod. On the HOF page there is only a summary of all mods used and I just don't want to go through all those mod threads, so please is anybody will do it I would really appreciate it.

Thanks

There are a lot of details to come up with.

Until something better comes along, I would suggest following the links to each incorporated mod creator's thread. Those links can be found in the Credits section on the HOF Mod page. Also, there is a Release Notes section that details some of the changes/additions made by the HOF Staff. (The same information is contained in a Readme file that is installed with the mod.)

Beyond that, looking at and experimenting with the options on the HOF tabs on the Civ4 Game Options screen is probably the best way to familiarize yourself with the HOF Mod. (There is some additional information in tool tips there, that may be helpful.)

As for the hammer fix, unless you understand all the details of the bug (Which I don't. ), then I doubt any more details would help very much. (It didn't for me. ) All I can say is it fixes it so it gives you the right amount of hammers for all the different combinations of game speed, production bonuses, etc., etc.

 

[Heroic]

Ok, I have downloaded and installed HOF. I dont know much about it. And to be honest, I doubt that any new player like me that comes to these forums in the future will.

From the threads I have read, and the additional screens under options I have seen, it looks like there are a million things that you can check or uncheck. So, which ones do I or dont I? Someone said something about turning autolog on? I dont even know where that is. And someone said something about HOF being invalid with vassal states, but not being disabled?

For newbies like me can someone explain if there is anything that needs to be done besides just install it? Like a tutorial/settings that need to be adjusted to play for WOTM? Pehaprs there is some thread that explains these things (in context of WOTM rather than just HOF) I saw a little on HOF threads.

I just wanna be able to play the WOTM without screwing things up. And with a zillion checkboxes on just the options screens (let alone anything else I haven't noticed), I think I might need some help so I dont screw things up.

Thanks.

 

[Danthor]

Starting from WOTM-02, the use of the HOF mod will be compulsory for all Civ 4 GOTMs and WOTMs. It will likely be extended to the next SGOTMs as well, depending on compatability issues.

buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

why not make it compulsory for plain Civ only?


where can it be downlaoded anyways??

 

[MikeH]

So will the mod be cimoulsory oi play the GoTMs or hust to submit them? I.e. wull those of us who just enhoy plating the games, but don't bother submitting them still need the mod?

 

[ShannonCT]

Ok, I have downloaded and installed HOF. I dont know much about it. And to be honest, I doubt that any new player like me that comes to these forums in the future will.

From the threads I have read, and the additional screens under options I have seen, it looks like there are a million things that you can check or uncheck. So, which ones do I or dont I? Someone said something about turning autolog on? I dont even know where that is. And someone said something about HOF being invalid with vassal states, but not being disabled?

For newbies like me can someone explain if there is anything that needs to be done besides just install it? Like a tutorial/settings that need to be adjusted to play for WOTM? Pehaprs there is some thread that explains these things (in context of WOTM rather than just HOF) I saw a little on HOF threads.

I just wanna be able to play the WOTM without screwing things up. And with a zillion checkboxes on just the options screens (let alone anything else I haven't noticed), I think I might need some help so I dont screw things up.

Thanks.

It is hard to find a nice summary of what the HOF mod options are. I just started using the HOF mod a few days ago when I saw it would be mandatory for GOTMs. But I think I have mostly figured it out, so here goes:

1) Autolog
This keeps a record of all of the events in the game and is more comprehensive than the built in event log. The game records all of your actions in a file autolog.txt that you can look at later to use for writing in spoiler threads. The autolog deals with the possibility of reloading in HOF and GOTM games. When you reload from the autosave, the autolog will record both versions of gameplay and reveal if you reloaded to try to change some unfavorable events in the game. The autolog should be activated for GOTMs.

2) Civ4lerts
The mod adds new in-game alerts. The running text on the left of the game screen will now tell you things like when a city is about to increase population or culture borders, when the city actually increases pop or borders, or when an AI has reached a certain level of money available for trade. This seems mostly intended to give you information that you might lead you to take some action (like assigning a new citizen or making a trade with an AI) without having to recheck things every turn. This feature is optional for GOTMs.

3) Exotic Foreign Advisor
This adds new useful info to the Foreign Realtions screen. The Glance feature allows you to see how each AI feels about you and the other AIs. The resorce and tech trading screens are now more comprehensive. You can now see what civics each AI is currently using all on one screen, along with their favorite civic. This feature is optional for GOTMs

4) Modified Domestic Advisor
The dometic advisor screen now shows what's going on with your cities in many different areas: basic info, great people and specialists, defenses, buildings. This feature is optional for GOTMs

5) Specialist Stacker
This fixes the problem with the original game that you couldn't see how many specialists you had if you went beyond 5 or 6 of a particular type. Optional.

6) Mapfinder
I haven't figured out what this does yet.

I would just activate all of the features in the options screen when you begin the game. All the new features can be found under the tabs "HOF1", "HOF2", and "HOF3". You can access the options in game and change anything that you dont like. The autolog is the only thing you must use.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

More experienced HOF mod users, please correct any inaccuracies or deficiencies in this post.

 

[ShannonCT]

where can it be downlaoded anyways??

Just follow the CivIV HOF Mod link in Denniz's last post and go to the bottom of the page.

 

[Khalid]

1) Autolog
This keeps a record of all of the events in the game and is more comprehensive than the built in event log. The game records all of your actions in a file autolog.txt that you can look at later to use for writing in spoiler threads. The autolog deals with the possibility of reloading in HOF and GOTM games. When you reload from the autosave, the autolog will record both versions of gameplay and reveal if you reloaded to try to change some unfavorable events in the game. The autolog should be activated for GOTMs.

Does it create a separate file for every game? Or how does it deals with multiple games played simultaneosly (play one, save, play another, save load the first etc.). Will the information be mixed or lost?

6) Mapfinder
I haven't figured out what this does yet.

I think it is supposed to find a location on the map, but haven't tried it.

I would just activate all of the features in the options screen when you begin the game. All the new features can be found under the tabs "HOF1", "HOF2", and "HOF3". You can access the options in game and change anything that you dont like. The autolog is the only thing you must use.

I think thats a very good way to start with it. I have tried the mod and the alerts and advisors provide usefull info in a convenient way. I think the only thing to do is to check everything in the options and see what it does. Then people can experiment with it. Yes there's just too many options if you havent' seen it before.

I have a question with the whipping bug. I have whipped a granary with Huyana Capac. It had 25 hammers in it. Cost 1 pop and got 60 hammers with 25 overflow. Is this the way it should work?

 

[Lexad]

6) Mapfinder
I haven't figured out what this does yet

It is to chose from generated maps ones with desired start posittions. No use for GOTM purposes.