I feel that the Lighthouse is vastly underrated.

[Athenaeum]

I do believe there's a difference between the Vanilla lighthouse and the lighthouse on GNK/BNW.

On the DLC, the lighthouse seems pretty amazing to me. It turns fish/coast tiles from 2 food to 4 food and 1 hammer.

If you have 3 fish/coast tiles near your city, you have just gained 6 food and 3 hammers from building that. It can really turn some mediocre/boring tiles into some pretty good ones.

 

[Callonia]

Yeah I like building lighthouses in GKs / BNW.

The god of sea + explorer + uh something else = good fish hexs.

 

[BruinBound]

I wasn't aware that people didn't find them important. If you have two or more sea bonuses I would think they are the most important building early. They probably come after libraries just to not delay the NC time.

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[Gordon Brittas]

The lighthouse is not underrated. I always build one if I'm on the coast.
I don't know where you got that idea from to be honest.

 

[Teproc]

Yeah, lighthouses are one of the most important buildings in the game. I don't think they're underrated at all, but obviously that depends on who you talk to.

 

[consentient]

They are great for growth, but in Domination games where growth is not so important (some of them), it's pretty hard to justify putting it in the build queue when units, barracks, happiness buildings, etc, all take priority. For a peaceful game, they are good, but I would like to see a mathematical treatment of how early they have to be built to make them worth it in borderline games.

 

[joncnunn]

Lighthouses are only "underrated" if you find old threads about the CD release of Vanilla and are comparing what they said then against the current rules. One of the balance patches to vanilla made Light Houses super important for all coastal cities that have fish.

 

[reddishrecue]

I agree, the lighthouse will get your cities big quick if you have the resources.

 

[bayard sartoris]

Yeah I like building lighthouses in GKs / BNW.

The god of sea + explorer + uh something else = good fish hexs.

On top of that, Japan: plus one culture per fishing boat and free boats from medieval era on. That's beauitful

Lighthouses do create some strong tiles. If you settle a costal city, it probably has at least two sea resources tiles in range, otherwise it would be just a crappy costal city and you rather not settle it. That said, Lighthouse is a key building for growing those cities, and you wouldn't skip it unless, as someone said above, you don't care too much about growing you cities, which has more to do with gameplay style and strategy than the building itself.

 

[mrwho]

Lighthouses are super OP if you have fish, especially when you compare them to the severely underpowered workboats. I don't think any experience civ player thinks otherwise. It's a pretty major balance problem in my opinion. A workboat costs 30 hammers, and usually gives you a crappy +1 food, and that's it. Maybe it gives you +1 gold, which is even worse. You might get a luxury. A lightouse costs 75 hammers. For that, you get +1 food on every coastal tile, +1 on every fish tile, and +1 hammer on every sea resource. Come on. I may be alone in this, but I don't even bother with workboats for the most part. There's almost always something better than +1 food for 30 hammers.

 

[Callonia]

Lighthouses are super OP if you have fish, especially when you compare them to the severely underpowered workboats. I don't think any experience civ player thinks otherwise. It's a pretty major balance problem in my opinion. A workboat costs 30 hammers, and usually gives you a crappy +1 food, and that's it. Maybe it gives you +1 gold, which is even worse. You might get a luxury. A lightouse costs 75 hammers. For that, you get +1 food on every coastal tile, +1 on every fish tile, and +1 hammer on every sea resource. Come on. I may be alone in this, but I don't even bother with workboats for the most part. There's almost always something better than +1 food for 30 hammers.

Not even when workboats take only 1-4 turn to build?

 

[Dushku]

I may be alone in this

You're not. I really wish work boats weren't consumed. Or that you could have a worker hop in the water and take some turns to improve it.

Using a work boat to up a tile you're going to be working, even by only 1 food IS worth it. However, if it's early enough to make a difference, it's probably early enough that those hammers can be better spent elsewhere. I usually have my science game in order, so I hardly ever find the time.

 

[ShakaKhan]

I don't care for the way that coastal tiles are all-or-nothing. If they have a resource, any resource, they're vastly superior to almost any land tile. If they don't have a resource, they can never become better than a 2 food tile, sustaining but not increasing growth (unless a % modifier is in play), and adding nothing else. Consequently, coastal cities/island cities usually start by utilizing the seafood resources (often even buying these tiles), then working the limited number of land tiles, then fill up specialists, and then they have extremely diminishing returns.

From a gameplay perspective, I'd prefer if seafood resource tiles had slightly lower yields and non-resource tiles had slightly higher yields or some way to improve them. From a role-playing perspective, I'd prefer if coastal tiles had less food and production bonuses but higher gold potential as port cities tend to be commerce/trade centers in real life. While this is addressed to an extent with cargo ships vs. caravans, having a tile yield variance would do a lot to add variety to the game.

 

[Mr. Shadows]

Sea tiles can be very strong- once you get them on-line. I don't like seeing a lot of them in my cap though, because they take a TON of hammers and turns to get them going in the early game, as opposed to all land tiles which only require a worker. I feel like building work boats early really slows me down, but if that's what you're given to work with... you DO need the luxury. They pay off in the long run but they really interfere with early efforts to establish the NC, early wars and expansion.

 

[Redaxe]

The OP might be on to something. Usually I always heavily delay Optics because I prefer techs that improve land tiles but on some maps I think early Optics is very useful.

Take the Carthage DCL for instance - I lost that map probably in part because I ignored Optics in favor of improving land tiles and building early Wonders.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=547506

 

[redwings1340]

The lighthouse is really good when you have costal cities with at least a couple of fish, that thing can really kickstart growth and development quickly. I kind of think of the lighthouse as a costal granary. It's useful if you have any fish, but if you have three fish/sea luxuries, you want it asap, because those tiles get really good later on.

 

[mrwho]

Not even when workboats take only 1-4 turn to build?

I was being a bit hyperbolic with 'don't even bother with' but it's certainly a very low priority. If my military is satisfactory and I have the buildings I want, I'll get the workboat. Otherwise, not unless I have a a luxury, and even then I'll try to buy it because it's not worth the hammers.

 

[joncnunn]

I was being a bit hyperbolic with 'don't even bother with' but it's certainly a very low priority. If my military is satisfactory and I have the buildings I want, I'll get the workboat. Otherwise, not unless I have a a luxury, and even then I'll try to buy it because it's not worth the hammers.

In my own queues, Work boats are usually post cargo ships. I look closely to determine which city results in it getting there quickest. (Combo of how many tiles away it is from all naval cities & production of all of them)

This usually works out to:
For both the capital and second city: That city directly.
For 3rd city: Closer of capital & second city.
For 4th city: Closer of second & third city.

As to cash: I always have more important things to cash rush than work boats such as Lighthouses, science buildings, happiness buildings, etc.

 

[ShakaKhan]

As to cash: I always have more important things to cash rush than work boats such as Lighthouses, science buildings, happiness buildings, etc.

exception being redundant luxuries. A workboat costs 240 gold. If that workboat gives you an extra luxury, you can sell it for, coincidentally, 240 gold, assuming you have a friend.

So you spent 240 and the next turn you made 240. It was essentially free, except the tile yield is improved. And every 30 turns thereafter you can make some more money, so the earlier you do so, the more times you'll benefit from it.

 

[ShakaKhan]

A guy and his date walk into a restaurant. The waiter seats them.

Waiter: "Are you ready to order?"
Guy: "I'll have the fish and she'll have..."
Waiter: "Wait, sir! This city just built a lighthouse to help ships at port!"
Guy: "So..."
Waiter: So this fish will now feed BOTH of you and it'll carve a statue of George Washington. When it's done, it'll either help build an ancient Greek temple or help you train those guys over there in the art of club warfare."
Guy: "...What?!?!?"