ideology unhappiness is impossible and horrible
- Thread starter adecoy95
- Start date
Bibor
Doomsday Machine
Ideologies and trade routes are my favourite features of BWN and are really, really well done. Both require learning how they work, though.
The soviet union was broke and their economy was on the ground. The GDR had already borrowed a billion DM from the FRG a few years before it collapsed and that money ran out fast as well.
Your sarcastic statement is a little bit ignorant.
headcase
Limit 1 Facepalm Per Turn
The AI might have a bit of an unfair edge with tourism, but overall I've found it manageable and entertaining. It could be better explained though, and there could be more stages of dissent to make it less surprising.
Bakspatel
Prince
You could consider tourism to be the factor in which people see the 'greatness' of another nation's political system and starting to demand reforms to create a similar system.
Look around in the news, this stuff is still happening quite recently. Take a close look at the Arab Spring were dictators were overthrown as people demanded change. Or like now in Egypt, where people demanded a different course of the country once again. The effect and consequences of these changes are of course a different topic, but in a way you could compare this to the BNW system.
Abraxis
☮
And what consequences there should be for playing a game?
loss.
Too many gamers these days have been coddled by illusions of challenge because balance is hard and publishers are greedy morons. Back when developers weren't so beholden to their publishers, and arcades encouraged high difficulty to turn a profit. You were lucky if something was simply a challenge, rather than downright near impossible.
Coming from a background of enjoying games for their difficulty, because it's a challenge that makes a victory sweet, not the fireworks. It's more then a little frustrating watching people complain about minor stumbling blocks forcing them to (god forbid) use their heads to get to the end.
Go try and beat super ghouls and ghosts or contra and you'll be thanking every god you can think of that your hurdle here is a simple +40 unhappiness. It's a simple adjustment of perception, and one that will increase your enjoyment tenfold. Learn to love a challenge, rather than complain about its fairness.
True_Candyman
Emperor
Firstly, his sarcasm was a reaction to a very sharp statement you made which isn't conducive to a positive vibe in the forum. I kindly ask that you make constructive posts rather than unnecessarily denouncing what you see fit
I don't mean to have a go, it just makes for a more pleasant environment where we can actually help people! Likewise, we could do without sarcastic responses, that only aggravates the situation.Secondly, no it's not ignorant, he didn't say it was the be all and end all, just that it was involved. In this game, if you have a strong enough economy and happy enough populace you can sustain the impacts of foreign cultures, likewise, or at least put up with it. It's a fair comparison. It's actually very old fashioned and incorrect to say that the USSR fell purely based on economic reasons as you seem to suggest
Also, don't think of tourism as tourism. It's a bit poorly worded. It is more like national conscience or cultural identity the way i see it. Whenever a civ starts wearing my blue jeans, i essentially see it as having become more or less an autonomous state within my empire, or at least a puppet-like ally. Basically akin to how Europe is to America now in that well known grouping "the west". Can you imagine how people would react if someone's leader suddenly turned round and said america is bad, we're ejecting all american businesses and turning to communism/fascism? We've all been conditioned since birth in the western ways of freedom and democracy. Communism and Facism are almost synonymous with evil. That would lead to revolutions.
I hope that sheds a little light on it, though really its all open to interpretation, and you can agree or disagree with it as you see fit
Muskie
Warlord
Suck it up buttercup.
You have to adapt. Instead of always playing one way, one civ, one ideology, you have to show some flexability. You may be Polynesia as I was in my last game. You may be going for a peaceful cultural victory involving lots of beach parties in the shadow of stone idols, but when Greece and Carthage ganged up on me and I finished my 3rd Factory, I took Autocracy.
I beat back the invasion, gained several cities in the peace process, gave back Washington to the Americans which was probably a mistake in the long run, but it would have been near impossible to defend. And although Autocracy isn't ideal for cultural victory, by having a high culture and enough strength of arms to protect my Maoi covered beaches, it was the AI who had dissedents, it was the AI who had to switch ideologies.
You have to have more flexibility. It isn't always the best to be the first person to adopt and ideology, sometimes you are better taking the same ideology as a key neighbor/ally to ensure more friendly relations. You also need to have a reasonably strong culture so you don't get dominated.
Muskie
Warlord
Contra is beatable. It takes more than a few quarters. I beat it in Georgia, a family friend had it in their basement so you could play for free, we spent a lot of time practicing until we finally beat that game.
I made one post in this thread. (now two)
You may want to check before you accuse people.
Muskie
Warlord
I've seen the build guilds in different cities advice before and I followed it for a while, but in my big cultural and tourism games, I'm pretty sure I overloaded my capitals with cultural buildings. I took pictures of my losses, but I have no screen shots of my victory as the Autocratic beach partying Polynesians.
"You've got to fight, for your right, to party."
I think it is the "Olympic" games that gives you plus 100% tourism, timing that and winning that is a big deal, raw culture production such as my maxed out Paris wasn't enough. I also think having some of your opponents eliminated or weakened by the sword helps with a cultural victory.
Diplomacy or Scientific is the peaceful victory, Culture is war. Going hard for cultural victory will piss off the neighbours.
The Piety reformation belief can be very useful to a cultural victory as is making your holy city the world's holy city. That is a good example of a peaceful tactic that will anger a lot of natives.
I'm tempted to go for domination in my next game, but if I went for cultural again I'd still make Tradition my focus, but I'd consider dipping into Piety once I have a relgion to get the reformation belief. Often the AI goes hard relgion so the best beliefs can be hard to get. I don't think relgion should be your 100% primary focus, it should be used as sprinkles on top of the cupcake that is your strategy.
True_Candyman
Emperor
Apologies, i misread the last guys username as yours, despite it's extensive differences XD Oops! My post history is littered with extensive error checking mistakes, so I am truly sorry, but until i turn a corner i hope you can accept my flaws!
You did follow on very plausibly from his last post though
3drawegroeg
Chieftain
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2009
- Messages
- 77
There should be one combined thread that all posts along the lines of "x is completely broken and needs to be fixed" are modded in to.
poom3619
Ping Pang Poom!
Actually, someone needs to change, I guess.
Well, everyone I have a short story to tell.
I played as Celts on King (It's my challenging diff. for now), fast-forward to the point where ideology kicks in. Ahmed al-Mansur of Morocco went to the way of Order, I choose Freedom because I thought I having hope in Cultural Victory by conquer Morocco. End up everyone but "latecomer" also go to Order and my subpar culture can't resist the pressure so I have to change to Order too. (Having -12
isn't good when you're fighting a evenly matched war few tiles deep in your land)Guess what? I got 4 free tenet as "compensation" and choose "Patriotic war" and "Worker's Faculty" that even boost my tech lead, I later grabbing "Five-year plan" which also gave me good amount of hammer. Last thing I done before save the game is stationing a nuke near Marrakesh, How irony. and I can say this is my most entertaining game ever since I play CiV.
Moderator Action: Please remain civil in your interactions with others, and please also confine non-Civ5 related discussion (e.g. discussion on why the USSR collapsed) to the World History or Off-Topic forums of CFC.
On this topic I just finished a game with Sweden which turned out to be a peaceful-ish culture win. I did kill my neighbour (Dutch) to establish my position. Curiously enough the Aztecs were my other neighbour and expanded towards me but we had peace for the whole game (I managed to found and spread a religion quickly and because of our diplo status he took my ideology).
The Shoshone were the leaders for most of the game strong in tech and ironically tough on warmongers dispite nearly annihilating the Celts. They got the first ideology, Order. About this time my culture was getting pretty strong and I was spitting out GWAMs with the bump from WC. I also managed to get my religion as world religion which upset a few. The Dutch with their one remaing city declared war on me along with the Shoshone and Siam (Autocracy). I beelined dynamite and played havoc with artillery and managed to capture two Shoshone cities before they developed flight and we called it a day. About this time I managed to force through Freedom as world ideology and the Shoshone were really suffering @about -15 happiness. I only noticed because of the steam acheivement popup that they'd 'converted' to Freedom. Within a few turns they were asking for a DoF! I had to squash Siam for the win since their culture was so strong, but since the three strongest powers were Freedom nobody minded.
All in all a fascinating and enjoyable middle to end game. All the things the previous iterations of CiV weren't. This was all on Emp, standard, pangaea.
The Shoshone were the leaders for most of the game strong in tech and ironically tough on warmongers dispite nearly annihilating the Celts. They got the first ideology, Order. About this time my culture was getting pretty strong and I was spitting out GWAMs with the bump from WC. I also managed to get my religion as world religion which upset a few. The Dutch with their one remaing city declared war on me along with the Shoshone and Siam (Autocracy). I beelined dynamite and played havoc with artillery and managed to capture two Shoshone cities before they developed flight and we called it a day. About this time I managed to force through Freedom as world ideology and the Shoshone were really suffering @about -15 happiness. I only noticed because of the steam acheivement popup that they'd 'converted' to Freedom. Within a few turns they were asking for a DoF! I had to squash Siam for the win since their culture was so strong, but since the three strongest powers were Freedom nobody minded.
All in all a fascinating and enjoyable middle to end game. All the things the previous iterations of CiV weren't. This was all on Emp, standard, pangaea.
Polisurgist
King
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2011
- Messages
- 630
deleted after seeing mod warning
Didn't think this deserved a new thread.
For anyone curious like me - tested and observed that switching ideologies does NOT cost you your ideology wonder, so OP could have switched and kept his Statue of Liberty
bonus. You also lose two tenets - not sure if these represent a flat number, my 2 early adopter tenets, or some percentage of total ideological tenets (which was 5 - 2 = 3).
Yup.
For anyone curious like me - tested and observed that switching ideologies does NOT cost you your ideology wonder, so OP could have switched and kept his Statue of Liberty
bonus. You also lose two tenets - not sure if these represent a flat number, my 2 early adopter tenets, or some percentage of total ideological tenets (which was 5 - 2 = 3).Yup.
Didn't think this deserved a new thread.
For anyone curious like me - tested and observed that switching ideologies does NOT cost you your ideology wonder, so OP could have switched and kept his Statue of Liberty
Yup.
wasent about the statue of liberty, was about the freedom bonuses that meant i had so many specialists that switching to order would make the unhappiness problem just as bad as if i just stayed freedom, lose lose all around
Save your game, and just try switching. Take Socialist Realism (+2
from Monuments), Academy of Sciences (+1 from science buildings) and Young Pioneers (+1 from Workshops, Factories, etc.). Just try. I promise you you'll be swimming in happiness instantly, far negating Universal Suffrage.The only thing you will actually lose is Civil Society and the food bonus it gives you. But if you're unhappy, your cities won't be growing anyway.
Similar threads
