Reading through some of the deity or A/B/C bonuses or other threads on what is effectively a justified "AI cheating," I want to raise a different question from another angle.
We all get the idea that the AI is realistically inferior and that's why some bonuses are there - however at the end of the day, were it possible - it would be wonderful to play against an AI that could "think" and had no cheating whatsoever, or in other words had the capability of a human player.
My realization is, of course, that we as human players are cheating all the time, particularly when we load a game. Sometimes it's necessary (e.g. the game crashes for some reason), and even understandable because we are in fact playing against cheating AIs, but in any case I've made it a sort of personal goal to not do this and just accept the reality of the game as it goes. I've maybe won half of my Immortal games by riding on this. While some might already play without loading, I think those who don't will agree that it is a merciless temptation and not easy to just not do it.
I get, of course, that anybody can do what they want and none of us has control over anyone else, hence my question of "dishonourable" for restarting a game, because it strikes me as a different category. When it comes to starting games, there's numerous "irritants," let's say - that motivate the desire to just re-launch. And some of them I think are actually correctable, but maybe some aren't. I'll illustrate what I mean.
1. I started a Continents game with a random leader and got Songhai. I was on the largest section of the island with very narrow paths to anyone else - and what I realized was that there was scarcely a Horse to be found anywhere on the continent, and none whatsoever in any place I could settle. This almost instantly makes Songhai an epicfail. I don't know what can be done about this other than restarting.
2. Some discussion has already been had elsewhere about the balance of various resources, because it can greatly change how a game starts. Sometimes, you start with a bunch of 2-yield tiles, other times, you get 5-yield tiles. This can have *massive* effects on the start of the game. I also don't know what can be done about this other than restarting.
3. City founding actually is imbalanced, in various ways. While a non-river non-hill start can have a Well, that loss of extra Food can put a city into mega-slug mode where it can barely grow or build anything, especially combined with situation #2. This, however, seems changeable/fixable. If all non-Hill tiles gave the same yields regardless (3 Food, 1 Production, 1 Gold) and all Hill tiles offered something else (2 Food, 2 Production, 1 Gold), the yields would be more standardized for cities and the beginning of the game less brutal if it was an otherwise "barren" start. This also would permit more flexibility in terms of where cities are laid because players would need to be less nit-picky about an exact spot. At the very least, the Capital strikes one as being a city that ought to be as balanced in yields as possible - with too much flux, half the game can be decided on the first turn, which isn't very much fun.
And so when I see a Plains tile with 5 more Grassland tiles around me and one more Plains tile and no river anywhere - yes, I restart, because I know I'm going to be creamed. I've engaged with it at times - but it never goes well.
So meh, this is part questionnaire, and part balance suggestion - but anyways - where do y'all stand in terms of saving and loading games, or just restarting them? How does this affect your interaction with the game and how much fun you have? Do you care? Does it matter? Something about this seems to me to be worth acting.
Cheers,
-G (the other G)
We all get the idea that the AI is realistically inferior and that's why some bonuses are there - however at the end of the day, were it possible - it would be wonderful to play against an AI that could "think" and had no cheating whatsoever, or in other words had the capability of a human player.
My realization is, of course, that we as human players are cheating all the time, particularly when we load a game. Sometimes it's necessary (e.g. the game crashes for some reason), and even understandable because we are in fact playing against cheating AIs, but in any case I've made it a sort of personal goal to not do this and just accept the reality of the game as it goes. I've maybe won half of my Immortal games by riding on this. While some might already play without loading, I think those who don't will agree that it is a merciless temptation and not easy to just not do it.
I get, of course, that anybody can do what they want and none of us has control over anyone else, hence my question of "dishonourable" for restarting a game, because it strikes me as a different category. When it comes to starting games, there's numerous "irritants," let's say - that motivate the desire to just re-launch. And some of them I think are actually correctable, but maybe some aren't. I'll illustrate what I mean.
1. I started a Continents game with a random leader and got Songhai. I was on the largest section of the island with very narrow paths to anyone else - and what I realized was that there was scarcely a Horse to be found anywhere on the continent, and none whatsoever in any place I could settle. This almost instantly makes Songhai an epicfail. I don't know what can be done about this other than restarting.
2. Some discussion has already been had elsewhere about the balance of various resources, because it can greatly change how a game starts. Sometimes, you start with a bunch of 2-yield tiles, other times, you get 5-yield tiles. This can have *massive* effects on the start of the game. I also don't know what can be done about this other than restarting.
3. City founding actually is imbalanced, in various ways. While a non-river non-hill start can have a Well, that loss of extra Food can put a city into mega-slug mode where it can barely grow or build anything, especially combined with situation #2. This, however, seems changeable/fixable. If all non-Hill tiles gave the same yields regardless (3 Food, 1 Production, 1 Gold) and all Hill tiles offered something else (2 Food, 2 Production, 1 Gold), the yields would be more standardized for cities and the beginning of the game less brutal if it was an otherwise "barren" start. This also would permit more flexibility in terms of where cities are laid because players would need to be less nit-picky about an exact spot. At the very least, the Capital strikes one as being a city that ought to be as balanced in yields as possible - with too much flux, half the game can be decided on the first turn, which isn't very much fun.
And so when I see a Plains tile with 5 more Grassland tiles around me and one more Plains tile and no river anywhere - yes, I restart, because I know I'm going to be creamed. I've engaged with it at times - but it never goes well.
So meh, this is part questionnaire, and part balance suggestion - but anyways - where do y'all stand in terms of saving and loading games, or just restarting them? How does this affect your interaction with the game and how much fun you have? Do you care? Does it matter? Something about this seems to me to be worth acting.
Cheers,
-G (the other G)
)
.
