K-mod Deity Fun -- Collaboration of SGOTM teams

[Duckweed]

Rumors say there are upgraded smart robot leaders who were created by karadoc and hidden in a camp called K-mod. Out of curiosity, players from various SGTOM teams have decided to take a look.

Game settings as agreed



The start



If you think above is not good enough, there's a backup from 1st generation

Spoiler :

Roster

Duckweed
kossin
Tachywaxon
Mitchum
soundjata
pomthom
Folket

Last, this is NOT SGOTMs, so NO test file!

 

[kossin]

While we're trying new things, why not a new mapscript or seldom used one?

Global Highlands...
Tectonics...
Inland_Sea...
Hub...
Oasis...

Normal speed if we're not going to test

Leader... Mansa if we want casual . If not I wouldn't mind playing China.

I don't have much appreciation of events but I can live with huts.

 

[Manco Capac]

Oh hey! I'm honored to be in the roster. I certainly didn't expect that. Ok, tomorrow, I dl K-mod. Yep, weird I know so closely K-mod without even playing once: my experience come from both several followings of the log of changes and several inclusion of the up-to-date K-mod DLL into several mods. I tasted the ruthless AI and flipped many times the tables to the injustice those psychos inflicted upon me . Ah those eternal wars punctuated by 10 turns peace treaties, stacks rampaging everything ruthlessly, etc.

Ok, one setting I don't want to see the light: OCC. I suppose it may be possible on really peculiar maps combined with chances that the AI battle each other, but it's a huge pain to see everything destroyed and stoneaged forever.

Obsolete did such prime example of AW OCC where he basically had no improvements, but the level of difficulty was much lower than deity, meaning working unimproved tiles before the nice arrival of levees, NP, etc. was supportable. On deity+OCC, that might be more of a fun killer. Seeing 4-5 stacks of 20 units while they run away...

BTW, I wonder if we shouldn't bring back (if it's possible) the effect of resistance killer units. Drew showed us (and I also experimented it) that trying to kill the odds of revolt is almost impossible.

Kossin gave us a glimpse of a water map resembling to lakes mapscripts, but more sinuous and thus easier to create blockades. One thing is sure, the AI stacks do roam around a city to pillage, but it's mainly a particular city....

 

[Manco Capac]

Man, Kossin, don't tease me with Oasis. I like that unfair mapscript...

I'm surprised you proposed Tectonics, it's such an unfair map with large swathes of unfertile plains.

And why should we be limited to Mansa? Why not just take any leader and make 4 archers. Or Unrestricted Leaders. I dunno...

 

[kossin]

I'm up for different things so I don't mind.

Deity AIs need so little food to grow that tectonics isn't the end of the world for them.
We can try Maze map if you prefer

I'll try the mod whenever I have a bit of free time, some of those changes feel a bit strange, like the revolt one you points out.

 

[soundjata]

Map type: I prefer a single continent (does not need to be Pangaea though...) to avoid intercontinental nonsense.
A non-common map type would definitely be nice

Speed No strong opinion but isn't anything but Normal rather unbalanced?

Leader IDK, rather an easy one (creative, expansive, etc...) than a hard one.

Huts & Events No please. I don't like surprises. I would not mind barbs off as well (For the sake of unchallenged exploration early game) No-one complained about this last SGOTM did they?

I won't discuss the difficulty level as it is not part of your list

Hi everyone this is going to be great!

edit: cross post with everyone. 0_0 That's what you get for typing at the off ice, doing several things at the same time...

 

[lymond]

We did a Kmod succession game some time ago - past year or so. I think on IMM. Thing to note if not already known to yall, is the early game can be rather difficult as the AIs are far more aggressive. However, if you survive it, the game gets progressively easier and the AI dumber. Ofc, some improvements might have occurred over that timeframe.

Anyway, AI archer daggers are not out the question and I imagine on Deity Kmod it can be rather difficult even for the aces among this bunch. But hey, at least you got Tachy to codedive for ya.

 

[vranasm]

imo you should get the map checked because from what I remember if you start in like 9 tiles of AI your game ends at t40 with 8 archers stack at your borders...

@L it was emperor level...

and obviously lurker mode on!

 

[pomthom]

Ok, count me in!

I've been wanting to try K-mod since I was cunningly enlisted by force in the K-mod fan club...

---------------

Map-type: no particular taste, but choosing arid-type maps might be a further unnecessary complication... I don't mind several continents, but I do mind upsetting soundjata so single continent is fine

Speed: Normal is my preference.

Leader: I like kossin's suggestion of China. Cho-Kus versus 20 unit stacks could be fun. I'm feeling Industrious today for whatever reason so I vote Qin. Otherwise I'm really open to anything. Random personalities could be considered, since all AIs in K-mod seem to be murderous nutbags anyway...

Miscellaneous: not sure about huts, why not events

---------------

Let's roll

 

[soundjata]

I don't mind several continents, but I do mind upsetting soundjata so single continent is fine

Don't mind me being upset. We all have our triggers. Friendly discussion on the forums ain't one
My remark was linked with the tedious logistics of galleon chaining.

 

[Folket]

Would I be welcomed to join? I wanted to have a look at K-mod as well.

 

[LKendter]

Lurk Mode = on

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

KMod may be based on BtS, but looking through the change log, one can see numerous minor changes and several major changes.

The changes to culture are quite drastic for example. The spread culture mission increases plot culture and not city culture, so there will never be increases in city culture without actually owning the target city. The Great Works was modified to provide 800 x <era #> culture rather than 4000 culture (normal speed). It will no longer be possible for two or more lower culture cities to culturally pressure a city with far greater city culture.

There are also numerous BtS bug fixes mentioned in the change log. One of those fixes was global warming wasn't working as designed, but Kmod doesn't fix it as was designed in BtS, but made it very different; it is now fixed to trigger based on global unhealthiness compared to a threshold unhealthiness. Some healthiness buildings (mass transist) were changed to reduce unheathiness rather than increase healthiness. Global warming is now more "realistic" (assuming one even believes it can ever be proven/disproven) in that ice plots first warm up into tundra? the artic. The effects in the temporate and tropical zones comes later. It even caused land plots to turn into shore, until this was later reverted for technical reasons. Global warming will evetually cause unhappiness which is reduced/increased based on local success at combatting it. This is just one example of dramatic change from BtS.

As mentioned before city revolt can never be completely subdued, but a positive change in this game mechanic is a small garrison is now far more effective in eliminating revolt. Not being able to completely subdue revolt is not realistic in the sense that the populace must be wronged enough to revolt against all odds. This change does not take into consideration the local situation, abundance of food, happiness, etc. in determining what amount of garrison is sufficient to eliminate revolt entirely.

Although I didn't notice it is the change log, as pointed out by vranasm, the AI will dagger the player far more earlier in Kmod than in regular BtS. This is a huge change that requires early keen strategic focus in order to survive with enough power to eventually eke out a win.

A lot of the changes make Kmod more challenging, but not necessarily in a fun way. In fact, a lot of the changes take away from the fun of playing the game. Despite that, I may be willing to participate. Is this SG is open to any CFC member?

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[WastinTime]

lurking too.

 

[Mitchum]

Checking in...

I'm busy for the next two days but I'll comment as I'm able.

I prefer no events/huts. It adds another element of chance/luck that could greatly change the game.

I also prefer a single land mass.

Speed = normal only because that's what I'm most used to playing.

As for leader, we should pick a leader with a good early-game military UU. Persians, Milanese and Romans come to mind although we may not make it to Praets if we go with Rome...

 

[Duckweed]

Would I be welcomed to join? I wanted to have a look at K-mod as well.

You are welcome.

Here's the consensus of settings from what I read:

Map type -- kossin suggested a bunch of maps, there are all one continent maps that soundjata and Mitchum wanted. Except Oasis and maze, I had played the others. Tachywagon expressed his interest in Oasis. Are you sure that we want a map without navies and wonders like GLH and TC?

Speed -- All want Normal. The reason why I asked for this choice is because that I consider Epic to be a more balance speed. I mostly play normal speed simply because it's time efficient. Due to the OF bug, strong production cities might waste hammers after industrial era.

Huts and events -- I usually enable both of them for fun and surprise, I can still remember that I got a free GA after being DOWed. Since the majority said no, we'll disable them.

Leader -- pomthom likes China because of their UU. I am not sure as they are usually available too late for defense and too costly (beakers and hammers) for offense. I don't mind play China, Qin or Mao? Soundjata might want Mao due to expansive trait. Mitchum suggested some rushing-type leaders as well. Currently Mansa and Chinese leader both get 1.5 votes.

We need more inputs to decide the map type and leader.

 

[soundjata]

You are welcome.

Here's the consensus of settings from what I read:

Map type -- kossin suggested a bunch of maps, there are all one continent maps that soundjata and Mitchum wanted. Except Oasis and maze, I had played the others. Tachywagon expressed his interest in Oasis. Are you sure that we want a map without navies and wonders like GLH and TC?

Speed -- All want Normal. The reason why I asked for this choice is because that I consider Epic to be a more balance speed. I mostly play normal speed simply because it's time efficient. Due to the OF bug, strong production cities might waste hammers after industrial era.

Huts and events -- I usually enable both of them for fun and surprise, I can still remember that I got a free GA after being DOWed. Since the majority said no, we'll disable them.

Leader -- pomthom likes China because of their UU. I am not sure as they are usually available too late for defense and too costly (beakers and hammers) for offense. I don't mind play China, Qin or Mao? Soundjata might want Mao due to expansive trait. Mitchum suggested some rushing-type leaders as well. Currently Mansa and Chinese leader both get 1.5 votes.

We need more inputs to decide the map type and leader.

Great Lighthouse, Navy, Collossus. No thank you. Let's do something else

+1 for Mao, an interesting dictator. No fishing.

BTW Tachywaxon is already dangerously hostile (TM). Let's not make it worse by misspelling its name and assuming it has a gender.

 

[lymond]

Tachy - Why you so hostile, yo?

 

[vranasm]

if I may weigh in some lurker opinion, you really should strongly consider something with early game powerhouse unit.

It strongly depends on map layout (I think inland sea starts civs so far that the early dagger while still possibility isn't maybe that big of concern).

To me it seems like you should run Mansa since he has skirmishers and has solid traits.

@STW
If I remember right there was some rebalance of civics and tile improvements too as one of the bigger changes... didn't saw K-mod for long time so not sure about this, can have mixed memories.... I think karadoc wanted to really improve serfdom to make it more competitive with slavery/caste as one of the things.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

I agree with the choice of Mansa Musa. You will need his UU to survive Deity Kmod early game.

@vranasm:

Yes, there was a big change in serfdom: some commerce was added to farms as I recall. Can't find the reference in the change log right now, but I remember reading it.

Sun Tzu Wu