Legendary Start

[Rellin]

Do you guys think legendary start is cheap or cheating or cheesey? I imagine tons of people restart quite often looking for a nice start on normal settings. I know some of you don't, and I am sure some restart more times than others. But we all like a nice start. So, is it wrong to just turn on legendary start and remove the need to restart? Additionally, do you think it helps or hurts the AI to have legendary start turned on?

 

[Gamling]

I almost always play with legendary start. I think it´s make more games fun early. And it´s not cheating since the computer civs also gets their sites pimped.

 

[Seabastian Civ]

I almost always play with legendary start. I think it´s make more games fun early. And it´s not cheating since the computer civs also gets their sites pimped.

Every player gets a great start, so no, I don't consider it cheesy or anything. If anything, I think it helps the AI, since your luxuries are dilluted and not worth as much when trading (if the AI needs any of them at all). More than anything, I think it hurts some civs more than others, such as Arabia and the Netherlands, who rely on early trading. But that's just my two cents.

I prefer strategic balance.

 

[Rellin]

Why do you prefer strategic balance?

 

[joncnunn]

Legendary starts are often missing one of Horses and Iron.
No Iron means in addition to the Warrior being stuck that way (unless it gets promoted to Spear), that you can't build Frigates (nor update the first bombard ships to them)

 

[LuCypher73]

If your concern is just starts, I would check out the Reseeded mod, which allows you to go through maps until you find one to suit your purposes. I have been doing abundant lately and shaving down the sea levels that doesnt seem to bad either

 

[RedFuneral]

I don't see it as cheating but I don't use it myself. I also don't restart no matter what the game throws at me, I like seeing what I can do with a poor start(hence why I usually leave the resources on standard or sparse) it gives more of a challenge without directly giving the AI an advantage.

It really depends on how you like to play, that's one thing I really love about Civ. You can have completely different games depending on how you set the map(and how it generates them). I'm not a fan of games where there is a definitive strategy to do this or that, I like adapting to what the game throws at me.

 

[Xahz]

I sometimes play with it on. Sometimes you get games where you not only have a crappy starting location (no river, one luxury, plains tiles, no strategic or bonus resources) but there's also no redeemable location to settle in a five mile radius. It's frustrating to play 10-15 minutes only to realize you're pretty screwed no matter what.

Legendary Start gives you a powerhouse capital and a bunch of viable locations to settle early on. I don't see how it could be considered considering the AI gets the same bias. You could even say they have more of an advantage since they can spam cities and mop up all the resources.

 

[joncnunn]

If your concern is just starts, I would check out the Reseeded mod, which allows you to go through maps until you find one to suit your purposes. I have been doing abundant lately and shaving down the sea levels that doesnt seem to bad either

Restart in 4000 BC now available in base G&K. Plus use of any mod turns off achievements.

 

[Seabastian Civ]

Why do you prefer strategic balance?

I like strategic balance because every civ gets horse, iron, coal & oil in their borders. Some get one tile with 3 iron, other get four tiles, etc. But nothing is worse than getting a start with no iron... or no coal... or no oil... and you've already invested so much in the game and you're basically at the mercy of the AI for an entire era.

 

[Napoleonbuff]

I like strategic balance because every civ gets horse, iron, coal & oil in their borders. Some get one tile with 3 iron, other get four tiles, etc. But nothing is worse than getting a start with no iron... or no coal... or no oil... and you've already invested so much in the game and you're basically at the mercy of the AI for an entire era.

I'm often without one or more of these resources. Gives reason to trade with civs and/or cozy up to CSs.

 

[omnishakira]

Its not cheating by any means but it gives you an advantage over the AI since the AI doesnt really need luxury ressources and you do. But no big deal

 

[Xahz]

Its not cheating by any means but it gives you an advantage over the AI since the AI doesnt really need luxury ressources and you do. But no big deal

Yea that's a fair point. I always considered it okay since the AI gets the tile bonuses from having a 4 lux city. But each lux is also worth 8gpt if you can find a trading partner, so that's definitely a huge bonus the AI doesn't get.

I usually play warmonger on legendary start; it's so painful to have 5-7 of every lux and no one to buy them Wish I could trade them with city states or something.

 

[joncnunn]

I think my recently started game on Legendary is good for the Legendary vs Strategic Resource debate:

Pro of Legendary: It's much more likely to have enough of given resources to make the specific ones good (as opposed to just picking the same old Fertility Rites by default when no more than one or two each of given resources appear)
This start actually had enough tiles of both sea resources & camp resources to make either God of the Sea or Godness of the Hunt worthwhile (I went with God of the Sea since there were sea resource tiles)

Con of Legendary: No horses on my landmass. In addition, only a 2 Iron on my landmass.

 

[omnishakira]

Yea that's a fair point. I always considered it okay since the AI gets the tile bonuses from having a 4 lux city. But each lux is also worth 8gpt if you can find a trading partner, so that's definitely a huge bonus the AI doesn't get.

I usually play warmonger on legendary start; it's so painful to have 5-7 of every lux and no one to buy them Wish I could trade them with city states or something.

Also the AI doesnt face real hapiness problems, if any. So those luxury ressource are basically just better tiles for them

Usually I tend to exchange luxury for gold with AI I dislike(aka : AI who are ahead) because I know that the AI doesnt need those ressources but they do need gold.
I tend to exchange (when I want) horses and iron with AI who are losing or fighting the stronger AI of the game. Sometime I even give them for free if I've a good diplo with this AI, a good economy and no need of that strategic ressource

 

[General Tso]

I like legendary type starts so much I created a mod that lets me adjust exactly how good the start is.