Low priority buildings?

[Grotius]

Do you all have any general thoughts on which non-Wonder city buildings are relatively low priority? I know it varies from game to game, and I know it depends on Victory Condition, but I'm still wondering whether there are some buildings with a generally high cost-to-benefit ratio.

By way of background, I usually play on Emperor, though I occasionally try Immortal. In general I try to focus on science-producing buildings (Library, University, National College, etc.), some of which I buy. I fear, though, that I end up building too much other stuff too. I almost never build barracks, but I almost always build monuments, shrines, markets, water mills (if available), workshops, stoneworks, windmills, factories, and other production/money focused things. I usually build a granary, less often the hospital; I don't build the stable unless the requisite resources are at hand. By necessity I build many happiness things. I tend to give cultural stuff lower priority unless going for a culture win.

Any thoughts on this? I apologize if it's been asked and answered; I found a couple older threads sort of on point, but they were pre-G&K. Thanks.

 

[Dan4GS]

Like you said, it's so victory condition dependant. What Civ you are playing also makes a huge difference.

Windmills are one building that is generally high cost for low benefit unless it's a production focused city or you're just trying to build every building in all your cities, which you probably shouldn't do.

Granary/aquaduct/water mill is great for tall empires, but less so for ICS if you'er wanting to keep a low pop.

I almost never build stables/forge unless I have at least two of the required resource. I rarely build happiness buildings as it seems more cost-efficient to get happiness elsewhere. I don't often build temples either unless playing culturally/with a religious civ.

Don't disregard culture buildings, though. The culture really adds up and having several more cultlure policies than you otherwise might is worth the upkeep, IMO.

That's just my $0.02. I've only beaten deity once but I do consistently beat Immortal, so other's may have better ideas.

 

[chmcclellan]

I agree with Dan4GS's comments. I would only add to keep in mind that the stoneworks also gives a happiness which may be worth it with only 1 stone/marble. Also obviously the Mint has no upkeep so can always be built.

One that can frequently be disregarded, especially at higher levels where it is difficult to get religion anyway, is the temple. Shrines are usually good for a pantheon and even with promptly constructed temples, you may not get a religion on higher levels.

 

[Atlas627]

Remember that the cost of a building is not just its upkeep, but the opportunity cost of building something else. So what you should do is compare the usefullness of each building with other options that would be available at the time.

For example, Monument most directly competes with Granary, Shrine and Scouts, while Libraries tend to compete with Watermills, Stoneworks, Workers, Archers, Spearmen, and Fishing boats.

The later in the game you get and the more options are available, the more competition each building has. When Windmills come around, they aren't just competing with units of that level, wonders of the time period, and other buildings that unlock at the same time. They are also competing with everything that was slightly less optimal than the path you chose. And then every building from then on will have to compete with the windmill if you don't build it (which you usually don't unless you actually CAN afford to build everything)


So buildings that I find to be chronically unused when I play (note: not never, they do have their moments) are:

Mint- flat gold, but this building costs as much as a market. And no specialist slot
Windmill- the bonus applies only to buildings, and is more expensive than a workshop
Forge- its nice, but if I only have 1 source of iron worked, not worth it
Military Base- usually don't need THIS much defense, units are probably better
Harbor- expensive building unless I have 3+ sea resources
Seaport- really expensive building unless I have 3+ sea resources
Nuclear Plant- if I happen to have uranium, goes to units
Bunker- never been nuked, the game usually ends
Medical Center (the late aqueduct thing)- late game growth...pretty useless

There are of course times to use each of these buildings, I just find that I don't more often than I do.

 

[Lord Yanaek]

Mostly playing Emperor (only a couple Immortal games with 1 win) and mostly Tall or semi-tall strategies on Epic speed.

The buildings i tend to forget most are constabularies and police stations (espionage buildings). If i'm really ahead in tech, i might build them in my capitol, but that's it. I only build them if i have few cities and want to get the CIA national wonder, then i sell them.
I try to build barracks in every city while i have few for the Heroic Epic, then i sell them (if i don't forget) and only build further XP buildings in my military city (the one that will produce 1 unit every 2-3 turns on Epic speed).
I build early culture buildings in every city for border growth (when i have few cities, i want my borders to grow so the AI won't settle right next to me) and policies, but one will be free in my core 4 cities (with Legalism). Later culture buildings are lower priority but will often be built for those great industrial era policies.
I tend to build/buy every production building to speed up further building. Never did any math to be sure it's wortht the time. One thing nobody mentionned about windmills is the engineer slot. I like to have as many enginners slots occupied to produce GE. Manufactures are often required for those high production cities (i try to have one for military and another one-two for wonders).
Gold buildings have no upkeep so i try to build them quickly in order to have more gold to buy more units/buildings.
I build happiness buildings only once luxuries/social policies/wonders are no longer enough to keep my pop30+ cities and pop40+ capitol happy (or if i have too many puppet cities).

Again, this is for tall/semi-tall empires, on Emperor level and Epic speed. Several buildings and many units are bought in my games and buying is more cost-efficient at slower speeds compared to normal speeds because of a 0.75 exponent in the formula (i read this here)

 

[Grotius]

Thanks for all the helpful comments. They give me some perspective on what I might be doing wrong. I think I tend to build too many buildings in general.

I do love games where a City State builds my units for me. Then I really can go nuts playing SimCity! But without an allied militaristic CS, I need to spend more time making units, I think.

 

[Matthew.]

Stables/Forge I put off unless city is on several grassland tiles without much production.

Granary/Watermill varies. Sometimes I get them up ASAP, sometimes I put off until I start using specialist slots. Really depends on how aggressive I need to be from the start. The boost in growth is pointless if you need military to defend or capture a key city.

Market/Bank when I get around to them.

Culture buildings vary. Ideally, I'd like to push culture as much as possible, as policies are a huge source of happiness and I like to puppet as much of the map as possible. But, they cost so many hammers and specialist slots compete with science.

Happiness buildings when I need them.

Religious buildings I am still working on finding a balance. Enough faith equates to 3+ GP's, but it takes quite an investment in the first half of the game.


There comes a point in later Industrial Era where my main cities start running out of to do, so I end up picking up most of the buildings eventually. Including barracks buildings. Double promotion on battleships/bombers helps get to the stupid powerful promotions.

 

[thegingerninja]

I tend to build barracks when i have some time when i don't need or can't afford more units of buildings. I almost never build stables

 

[Carazycool]

It all depends....with windmills, sometimes, if my economy is good enough, when I settle a new city later in the game, i will buy a workshop/windmill/factory and/or any other production building right away...that way, the small city already has a decent production to build things, like aqueduct and granary and before very long at all, the city is as large as the rest of them with lots of production...however, if a city already has good production and is not mainly focused on building buildings, the windmill is not worth it.

 

[Bandersnatching]

My low priority buildings are usually:
Watermill (I'm surprised by the fact that it is so popular amongst the forum-goers)
Windmill (always try to build on hills anyway)
Shrine/Temple if I'm not trying for a religion
Aqueduct
Garden (unless I have the capacity to get at least 4 GP points in the city, and want to use them)
Harbor/Seaport (unless 3+ resources present or on an Archipelago map)
Barracks
Stables/Forge (unless 2+ resources are present)
Constabulary/Police Station
Arsenal/Military Base

 

[vexing]

i tend to play a very focused game, only building what's necessary and winning quickly. for science or diplo win:
i rarely build temples,
stoneworks i build in any city that can. 1 happiness and generally at least 2 hammers for no upkeep is great.
stables if there are at least 2 pastures
other than that i just generally build most the non military buildings up to medieval, and only public schools after that and factories if a science win.
my capital tends to have significantly more production than other cities, so it'll occasionally build a bank, or a windmill if i'm trying to produce an engineer, and possibly a hospital (or i might buy that).

 

[loki75]

As I usually aim for very focused science victories (immortal, or deity if I want punishment), everything that helps growth is top priority on my list (granary, water mill), I will usually also build a shrine to get faith for an extra great scientist at the end of the game, then I focus on production (stables, stone work, workshop) and/or happiness (circus, colosseum), money is usually last as I get more selling luxuries. After I hit renaissance, culture buildings get a high priority too.
If I manage to get a religion, I will put some hammers in temples later, especially if they give happiness.
Once I hit industrial, factories are a must.
Things I almost never build: military buildings, forges, hospitals (by the time I hit biology, I have more than enough pop as I'm bulbing to race science victory), museums, stock exchanges, etc...

 

[bison21]

I like the honor tree and thus usually build military buildings (barracks etc) for the happiness. But I restrict that to 2 cities usually; the ones with high production and which will produce most units. Especially in the later eras I find bombers without 2 upgrades very difficult to use.

(I play emperor with ease and struggle badly on Immortal)

 

[mintcandy]

As a disclaimer, I still play vanilla, so take my list with a grain of salt.

So, I'm going to list two buildings that I rarely build for each era, and why I don't build them often.

Ancient

Water Mill: 2 gold per turn for a flat 2 food and 1 hammer? Yeah, that's way too rich for my blood.

Walls: For the hammers, I'd rather have an Archer/Warrior and a Scout. I only build Walls for happiness when I unlock the appropriate social policy.

Classical

Courthouse: I rarely annex cities. Typically, I puppet them or raze them if I don't have enough excess happiness.

Okay, I don't have a second one for Classical...but then, the Classical era's pretty short as it is.

Medieval

Castle: Similar reasoning to Walls.

Forge: I don't build these anywhere near the amount of times I build the Stable. Why? Because Iron is much rarer than Cattle, Sheep, or Horses, which means that it takes a lot longer to make up the hammer cost of a Forge than it does for a Stable.

Renaissance

Military Academy: Unlike the Barracks and the Armory, the Military Academy doesn't grant another promotion. Heck, I don't even build this in a city that is pumping units, because the hammer cost is equal to two Musketman units. Personally, I'd rather have two more Musketman units.

How...odd. I expected there to be another Renaissance era building that I tend to avoid.

Industrial

Arsenal: For the same reason as the Castle.

Hospital: Since I don't tend to settle cities after the early Medieval era, I also don't have a huge need for rapidly growing a city.

It's been awhile since I've played a game past the Industrial era, but I don't recall building the Spaceship Factory or the Medical Lab very often.

 

[budweiser]

I tend to build anything that gives me more food or more hammers first. Then culture, faith and science. I try to get my Nationals up fast. I rarely build barracks or military buildings. I only build happy buildings when I need the points.

 

[civfan986]

I almost never build military barracks but at the beginning of a game it is a wise idea to build a monument as the bonuses it provides are far greater than the extra time that could be spent on a scout or soldier. I generally try an build a shrine however if you have an aggressive neighbour like attila it is not a great idea as he will spend all that time producing units and try to conquer your civ early. try to buildas many production buildings as you can as during war they will help build up your army when preparing for a sneak attack and during will really help mantain your fronts.

 

[joncnunn]

This is also difficulty level dependent; higher levels require more focus. (Such as when going for Science, the science faster but delay cultural; especially if Rationalism isn't going to be available when you get your next policy)
This is also when going for conquest, less buildings and more units. (But here if you want to be peaceful and have a neighbor you'll need more military units to assure victory when your neighbor "sneak attacks" you; focusing a city on units is good)

I love Water Mills; that extra 2f is enough to redirect a worker to a mined hill on top of the base bonus.
I also like Granaries and also use it for more hammers.
And I also love Stables and other cheap improvements that improve yields of local resources.

Here's the only low priority early buildings for me:
Any pure cultural building more expensive than a Monument.
Walls (and later defense structures) unless I anticipate that city being on the front lines.
Early on Court Houses also fall into the low priority: If you've just discovered Court Houses; chances are the city you got is so small it may well be better to build raze and replace.
Later in the game there's more reason to actually build it.

 

[wannabewarlord]

My low priority buildings are usually:
Watermill (I'm surprised by the fact that it is so popular amongst the forum-goers)
Windmill (always try to build on hills anyway)
Shrine/Temple if I'm not trying for a religion
Aqueduct
Garden (unless I have the capacity to get at least 4 GP points in the city, and want to use them)
Harbor/Seaport (unless 3+ resources present or on an Archipelago map)
Barracks
Stables/Forge (unless 2+ resources are present)
Constabulary/Police Station
Arsenal/Military Base

I agree for most, but the watermill can be quite nifty, as it comes early. Early production and food without needing a citizen? Yes please.

And I am surprised to find aqueduct on your list. Maybe you play wide but as a tall player myself, aqueduct is the only way to go.

 

[Matthew.]

Yeah, watermill and granary lose much of their value if going wide. For those going tall with specialists as soon as possible, they are great.

Depending on the conditions, I use them like Joncnunn as well. The overall difference between a game with high production cities and a game with average production cities is huge. Tech means nothing if you can't bust out the buildings, units, and wonders.

 

[Donaskme]

Aqueduct

I recommend you revisit your thoughts on Aqueducts, they are essential to good city growth in my experience. With the Tradition finisher, you can get them for free.

Likewise, I highly value Watermills for the same reason. Food+production early is very nice. I attempt to always settle on rivers precisely so I can have one in every city.