Monarch game that has slipped in Neutral

[genghis_khev]

OK so here my situation:

English Civ. Monarch Level. 980AD.
Archy Map, 60% Water (allegedly!)
3rd Scorewise, 4th Power-wise (after all but taking out nearest enemy).
NO IRON!!!

Victory Conditions available:
Culture (no way), Space-race (best bet IMHO) and Diplo (possible)

Got 12 cities out of expansion phase (but 3 are on separate continent). Got 7 more of the Carthaginians and built 2 more in large gaps.

I've beaten monarch on all victory cons except culture (Regent) and this game started well but quickly faltered and then ground into neutral. Do I take my ancient era units into war against medieval or possibly gunpowder units or do I play nice and hope no-one notices I have spearman defending my cities (if they had Motorized Transportation I know I would be safe!)?

I know this game is winnable (even by me!). I'm just looking for a pointer or two in the right direction.

Ta!

 

[thetrooper]

Most fun: Get to Military Tradition and blitz the Indians. Get most territory and claim the resources for SR.
Easiest and most boring: Play like a diplomat.

 

[genghis_khev]

I do have horses but gunpowder could be an issue. And if I can't trade iron from the AIs I doubt I would be able to get gunpowder, unless I prise if from their cold dead hands! But this leads me back t the Iron issue. I've led cavalry against spears and longbows and it was very, very messy, for them!

 

[thetrooper]

Any civs researched gunpowder yet?

 

[genghis_khev]

Yes. Most of them!

But there has been a breakthrough. After disbanding all my archers (10 of them) I was able to up my research to 40%, Banking now in 14 turns not 18.

Also the Chinese will trade the science of Gunpowder to me for 3 Luxuries. It's steeper than I would liked but at least would may be allow for some kind of improved defenders, if I have gunpowder resourse in my territory or can trade for it (big IF!).

 

[genghis_khev]

Guess what. NO GUNPOWDER!!!! ARRRGGHH!

And no-one has any they can spare. Although the Indians do have it. And I am more powerful than they are. Sounds like its time to kiss the diplo victory goodbye and go chat to the Indians!

If only I had 10 Archers to help me. ARRRGGHH! At times this game more than bugs me!!!

 

[thetrooper]

Not many salpeter tiles in your territory I'm afraid (the visible part in your pic at least). 3 luxes for a tech that most civs have is steep indeed. Will you get monopoly on banking?

Edit: x-posted, the Indian elephants will eat you for breakfast. Some salpeter tiles in Indian territory though.

 

[gunkulator]

What version of civ is this? Do you have longbows and trebuchets available? They might be enough to wrest away the Indian saltpeter.

 

[genghis_khev]

gunkulator
Playing C3C vers 1.22 I think. The complete version of the patch of doom with the the patch for the patch of doom.

Longbows are available and now in production.

the trooper
Its gonna get messy no matter what I do. Assuming I can hold out 'til Nationalism for Riflemen (defence) and use bowmen and trebs (offence) until I found gunpowder (for cannons). Thinking ahead though, I had no jungle and little forest in my territory, so probably no rubber! This is gonna get real messy!

Oh! One last thing I think I should mention. The Maya have declared war on me. I just hope it doesn't become fashonable! Thankfully I have quite a few lux trades going on so I should be OK.

EDIT (for update - trying to avoid needless posts):
HA-HA! Foolish Maya. Defending a coastal city, WITH GUNPOWDER, with only 1 Longbowman and 1 Musket Man (Formally a spearman when my 9 Ancient Cavalry arrived). Needless to say I now have gunpowder!!! And the loss of a city cilled out the Maya no end! Now all I need is that Indian Iron!!!

Thanks thetrooper and gunkulator