New unit: Galleass

[aaglo]

For those whom might find this interesting news.
- arrow attack is now available (see the 1st post).

 

[tjedge1]

Thanks aaglo, that will help me a bunch.

 

[jzsf]

A Fantastic Medieval Galleass!! GREAT WORK!

 

[jzsf]

...BTW it looks too big in game! can u resize it?

 

[aaglo]

Does it? I haven't noticed...

But don't you think also, that u is quite powerless to do any resizing?

 

[tjedge1]

Who is u?

It looks fine to me.

 

[jzsf]

Well it is about the same size of the battleship... a small resizing can worth it...
@tjedge: me is me

 

[unscratchedfoot]

Stunningly audacious and spunky!

 

[Smoking mirror]

Ive done a resized version of the heavy galleass, am about to post it.

 

[Civinator]

Here is the civilopedia entry for the galleass in CCM 2.5 with an image of the used unit in that mod.

 

[timerover51]

Here is the civilopedia entry for the galleass in CCM 2.5 with an image of the used unit in that mod.

View attachment 664313

View attachment 664314

That is not bad, but a galleass did not have the bow spur of a galley. See the following images.

Edit Note: I checked my copy of Bjorn Landstrom' Sailing Ships, and he shows an image of one of the galleasses that fought at the Battle of Lepanto with a short spur.

 

[Civinator]

It seems there were existing different versions of the galleass. Here is an image from the French Wikipedia:



This looks very close to the unit aaglo did create:

New unit: Heavy Galleass!

Hi! It's bigger, longer and uncut. The heavy galleass. :king: Thanks for all participating the fun creation process :) Download heavy galleass UPDATE! Here are included the alternative arrow attack for this ship (it could be useful in some fantasy scenarios). Download arrow...

forums.civfanatics.com

New unit: Galleass

Hi! This ship was used in the mediterranean between 1400-1800 AD. It was designed to take advantages of both galeon (sails) and galley (oars). Though they could out-maneuver the galeon, they were no match for them in the firepower. UPDATE! This unit can now be downgraded to have an arrow...

forums.civfanatics.com

As the English Wikipedia is somewhat poor in describing the weaponry of the galleass, here is the more detailed description in the German Wikipedia (not so detailed in the Spanish Wikipedia, too):

(For the battle of Lepanto, Venice added a "towerlike" bastion at the bow (fitted with nine canons) and a ram to 6 not used merchant galleasses).
May be some of those ships were constructed differently.

 

[timerover51]

Adm. Rogers, in his book Naval Warfare Under Oars, gives a description of the armament of the Venetian galleasses at Lepanto. I will see about transcribing it and posting it. His information is taken directly from the Venetian naval museum.

 

[Civinator]

Sorry drmihnea for filling in my eyes too much posts in your thread with a discussion about the galleass unit created by aaglo - a unit that not even is existing in your mod.

May be here a moderator can add the posts about the galleass in this thread (in my eyes starting with post 10) to the place where I think these posts are belonging to: The thread of the galleass unit, started by the creator aaglo, that can be found here:
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/new-unit-galleass.75951/

timerover51, I hope that you agree to this suggestion, too, to move all these informations about the galleass to the thread about the galleass unit.

 

[timerover51]

Sorry drmihnea for filling in my eyes too much posts in your thread with a discussion about the galleass unit created by aaglo - a unit that not even is existing in your mod.

May be here a moderator can add the posts about the galleass in this thread (in my eyes starting with post 10) to the place where I think these posts are belonging to: The thread of the galleass unit, started by the creator aaglo, that can be found here:
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/new-unit-galleass.75951/

timerover51, I hope that you agree to this suggestion, too, to move all these informations about the galleass to the thread about the galleass unit.

I was thinking that this should be moved as well.

 

[Quintillus]

Moderator Action: In a thread for a new mod (which doesn't feature a galleass), there's been a burst of enthusiasm and discussion about the galleasses. At the suggestion of both of the primary participators in that discussion, I'm moving those posts here, where that discussion would be more at home.

Those posts now appear above this one, in chronological order.

 

[r16]

to the attention of anyone to use Ottomans in their mods . Never heard of a Mahon as shown in the 'pedia page above . But there is a Mavuna or more modern Mavna (barge in English) . Said to be higher and wider compared to "other ships" . 26 "benches" for rowers , possibly "briereme" or whatever the hell . Should make 104 oars . 600 overall crew , 364 of them rovers . And 30 gunners for 24 guns . Requires the double amount of timber to build when compared to an ordinary galley .

edit: Though , ı imagine the true equivalent should be the "baştarda" . Biggest ship , remained in production after the entire galley effort was abandoned and costs 3 times in timber .

edit2: From Galea Bastarda in Italian , it seems limited to 5 guns only . Mavna presumably still better .

 

[timerover51]

to the attention of anyone to use Ottomans in their mods . Never heard of a Mahon as shown in the 'pedia page above . But there is a Mavuna or more modern Mavna (barge in English) . Said to be higher and wider compared to "other ships" . 26 "benches" for rowers , possibly "briereme" or whatever the hell . Should make 104 oars . 600 overall crew , 364 of them rovers . And 30 gunners for 24 guns . Requires the double amount of timber to build when compared to an ordinary galley .

edit: Though , ı imagine the true equivalent should be the "baştarda" . Biggest ship , remained in production after the entire galley effort was abandoned and costs 3 times in timber .

edit2: From Galea Bastarda in Italian , it seems limited to 5 guns only . Mavna presumably still better .

To the best of my knowledge, the Ottomans never used anything like a galleass. They preferred the galley, and an analysis by John Guilmartin in his book, Gunpowder and Galleys, the Ottomans were looking for speed as a raiding vessel, the Venetians were looking more at gun power, and the Spanish were looking at the galley more as an amphibious vessel. The galleass under oars was slower than a galley, and they had problems getting them into position in the advance at the Battle of Lepanto. The galleass was derived from the large merchant galley, which was used a lot by the Italian city-states, and picked up by the Spanish. Four of them were part of the Armada in 1588.

 

[timerover51]

Here is an image from the book, A History of Naval Architecture, published in 1851, depicting a galleass used at the Battle of Lepanto. I would not guarantee the Battle of Lepanto part. There is also a model of a galleass in the Venice naval museum. I will work on transcribing what Adm. Rogers has on them.

 

[r16]

a thesis of graduation or whatever ı found online says

The ship type known by Ottomans as mavuna was actually galea grossa. These ships were actually the transformed form of galea da mercanzia, which were designed as huge galleys to carry pilgrims. However, galeazzas in Lepanto, which were bigger than galea grossas especially for their [weight] of broadside, have been named with the same name by Ottomans as mavuna.


first 2 mavunas ordered in December 1571 and they were some in use in 1574 . But yes , probably not as big as galleas .


speed is also a tactical thing , useful if you are trying to board hostile warships and stuff . The Spanish built larger platforms for arquebus troops ... A fully historic mod will probably limit the power of Ottoman warships . Even if the primary ships "had to be larger than what opponents fielded" . Weak in defence , perhaps not too brilliant in attack but enslaves smaller ships ? Spanish the best all-rounder and the Venetian the best bombard ratings ?