Non-Incan Deity BC Space
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T328 Fission
Now that Lisbon has prepared Notre Dame at 1933/1650 (283/3=94 extra base hammers), I should get rid marble, otherwise it will be 283/3.5=80
and overflow will be capped at 1650/3.5 instead of 1650/3. I give my four marbles to vassals and... But surely, Notre Dame receives its bonus from stone, not marble! Now I have to give away four stones too. It is not a problem, but it indicates that I lost all my marbles in a rather different sense.
I switch back to Caste/FR and after visiting every city one more time I have decent bpt - 21102
T329
Some of the thruster cities whipped industrial parks for extra ~90 in overflow and 2 from free engineer. Miraculously, I still have workers! Not for long: lost 22 units on this turn and will lose 22 more one the next turn.
Several cities return to building research: at the end of the turn beaker output is 22424
T330 Fiber Optics
Got a nice headstart at Cockpit with overflow from lab. There is also industrial park 899/600 to make it 4 turns. Not that I'm going to finish that soon, but it means that NY will be able to build research for a few turns.
Mostly done we overflow chains, building more research - 23304
Now that Lisbon has prepared Notre Dame at 1933/1650 (283/3=94 extra base hammers), I should get rid marble, otherwise it will be 283/3.5=80
and overflow will be capped at 1650/3.5 instead of 1650/3. I give my four marbles to vassals and... But surely, Notre Dame receives its bonus from stone, not marble! Now I have to give away four stones too. It is not a problem, but it indicates that I lost all my marbles in a rather different sense.I switch back to Caste/FR and after visiting every city one more time I have decent bpt - 21102
T329
Some of the thruster cities whipped industrial parks for extra ~90
in overflow and 2 from free engineer. Miraculously, I still have workers! Not for long: lost 22 units on this turn and will lose 22 more one the next turn.Spoiler :
Several cities return to building research: at the end of the turn beaker output is 22424
T330 Fiber Optics
Got a nice headstart at Cockpit with overflow from lab. There is also industrial park 899/600 to make it 4 turns. Not that I'm going to finish that soon, but it means that NY will be able to build research for a few turns.
Spoiler :
Mostly done we overflow chains, building more research - 23304
Last edited:
T331 Fusion
No cheating with bulbs - Fusion in 1 turn through plain hard work. Caesar commanded and it's been done.
I was a bit careless with overflow preparations and accidentally made some overflow gold. It proved to be useful, though.
Now, @WastinTime finished research 7 turns after Fusion. I did not expect my bpt to be much better, so my early plans included 8-turn Engines, with possibility to build them in 7 turns with another prewhipped building. That will be imprortant if I finish research a bit sooner than anticipated.
Remaining 4 techs cost 141960 or 114725 base. Clearly, I'm going to finish research in 6 turns, unless bpt drops bellow 19k. It will certainly go down as more cities start building spaceship parts.
Naturally, Great Engineer has been born in Timbuktu. I sent him to Lisbon: he will need to rush a WW for one more step in chain overflow if I have to do Genetics last and therefore Stasis Chamber in 1 turn.
T332 Satellites
Engine in Paris is 1257/4800 or 502/1920 base hammers. Industrial park and hospital will add some 140 each, because base production will be over 150 and overflow cap is 300 for both buildings. Two forests remain and one has been chopped on this turn, thats 270. That bring total to 502+140*2+270=1052. Need 1920-1052=868 in 6 turns (that will be 7 turns after Fusion) or 868/6=145 per turn, easy.
Docking Bay in 5 turns is very straightforward. You do the math if you like (the ws1 tiles a forests with workshops prepared to be built in 1 turn).
No cheating with bulbs - Fusion in 1 turn through plain hard work. Caesar commanded and it's been done.
I was a bit careless with overflow preparations and accidentally made some overflow gold. It proved to be useful, though.
Spoiler :
Now, @WastinTime finished research 7 turns after Fusion. I did not expect my bpt to be much better, so my early plans included 8-turn Engines, with possibility to build them in 7 turns with another prewhipped building. That will be imprortant if I finish research a bit sooner than anticipated.
Remaining 4 techs cost 141960
or 114725 base. Clearly, I'm going to finish research in 6 turns, unless bpt drops bellow 19k. It will certainly go down as more cities start building spaceship parts.Naturally, Great Engineer has been born in Timbuktu. I sent him to Lisbon: he will need to rush a WW for one more step in chain overflow if I have to do Genetics last and therefore Stasis Chamber in 1 turn.
T332 Satellites
Engine in Paris is 1257/4800 or 502/1920 base hammers. Industrial park and hospital will add some 140
each, because base production will be over 150 and overflow cap is 300 for both buildings. Two forests remain and one has been chopped on this turn, thats 270. That bring total to 502+140*2+270=1052. Need 1920-1052=868 in 6 turns (that will be 7 turns after Fusion) or 868/6=145 per turn, easy.Docking Bay in 5 turns is very straightforward. You do the math if you like (the ws1 tiles a forests with workshops prepared to be built in 1 turn).
Spoiler :
BPT is a bit lower this turn 22639. Now that I'm getting closer to finish line, I can estimate more accurately when I finish research and whether Ecology can be the last tech or it must be Genetics.
Composites, Genetics and Ecology cost 34125, 31850 and 21450 base respectively, 87245 in total. Research rate will drop a little after Composites - because I start building 5 Casings - and a bit more after Genetics. There is also at least 2000 overflow from Satellites. Suppose I make 2000+22500+22500+21000+20500=88500 over next four turns. In that case I will get Composites with 2000+45000-34125=12825 overflow, that's enough to do Genetics in one turn
So, its 5 turns after Fusion (or t336) instead of 6 or 7 which I anticipated. T337 (130BC) launch? Nope. Unfortunately, several parts can't be finished sooner than t338.
T333
Antony van Leeuwenhoek (GS) has been born in Hamburg. I forgot what I did with him. Probably, academy for +51 in Hamburg. Does not matter.
Going a bit faster than necessary - 22512 this turn.
T334 Composites
Another looters event, this time in Amsterdam. Gold mine was destroyed. It can be rebuilt, but it should not be relevant: I think I planned everything with sufficient margin not to have my plans upset by such accidents.
Everything seems to be fine except that I hit a snag with Timbktu.
Now that industrial park has been released it could not be more clear that the Engine is not going to be finished by turn 338. It would not have been finished before t339, even if I did not lose that gold mine.
My plan after I decided to move palace to Timbuktu was made for 159 per turn. As you can see Timbuktu is actually producing more than 159 at the moment and I'm still about 20 base hammers short! Why would that be?
Engine with palace (and Bureaucracy) costs 4800/(1+0.25+0.5+0.25+0.5+0.5)=1600. Maximum overflow from lab is 750/2.5=300. So, in 7 turns with a chop: 1600-159*7-90-300=91 is left. This is easily covered with a prewhipped industrial park. Can you spot a problem?
Research is a bit lower than I thought it would be - 20020, thats because I'm building workers to rebuild the mine. Anyway...
T335 Genetics
Notre Dame is a useful WW. Usually, I build it for this
T336 Ecology
How do you build a Casing in 3 turns with mere 2 forests?
T337
Some parts have been finished.
T338 Flight
All parts but one Engine are finished. BPT has gone up a bit - 26141.
T339 or 110 BC launch
How very disappointing.
. Now that I'm getting closer to finish line, I can estimate more accurately when I finish research and whether Ecology can be the last tech or it must be Genetics.Composites, Genetics and Ecology cost 34125, 31850 and 21450 base
respectively, 87245 in total. Research rate will drop a little after Composites - because I start building 5 Casings - and a bit more after Genetics. There is also at least 2000 overflow from Satellites. Suppose I make 2000+22500+22500+21000+20500=88500 over next four turns. In that case I will get Composites with 2000+45000-34125=12825 overflow, that's enough to do Genetics in one turnSo, its 5 turns after Fusion (or t336) instead of 6 or 7 which I anticipated. T337 (130BC) launch? Nope. Unfortunately, several parts can't be finished sooner than t338.
T333
Antony van Leeuwenhoek (GS) has been born in Hamburg. I forgot what I did with him. Probably, academy for +51
in Hamburg. Does not matter.Going a bit faster than necessary - 22512
this turn.T334 Composites
Another looters event, this time in Amsterdam. Gold mine was destroyed. It can be rebuilt, but it should not be relevant: I think I planned everything with sufficient margin not to have my plans upset by such accidents.
Everything seems to be fine except that I hit a snag with Timbktu.
Spoiler :
Now that industrial park has been released it could not be more clear that the Engine is not going to be finished by turn 338. It would not have been finished before t339, even if I did not lose that gold mine.
My plan after I decided to move palace to Timbuktu was made for 159
per turn. As you can see Timbuktu is actually producing more than 159 at the moment and I'm still about 20 base hammers short! Why would that be?Engine with palace (and Bureaucracy) costs 4800/(1+0.25+0.5+0.25+0.5+0.5)=1600
. Maximum overflow from lab is 750/2.5=300. So, in 7 turns with a chop: 1600-159*7-90-300=91 is left. This is easily covered with a prewhipped industrial park. Can you spot a problem?Spoiler :
Research is a bit lower than I thought it would be - 20020
, thats because I'm building workers to rebuild the mine. Anyway...T335 Genetics
Notre Dame is a useful WW. Usually, I build it for this
Spoiler :
T336 Ecology
How do you build a Casing in 3 turns with mere 2 forests?
Spoiler :
T337
Some parts have been finished.
T338 Flight
All parts but one Engine are finished. BPT has gone up a bit - 26141
.T339 or 110 BC launch
How very disappointing.
kostja
Chieftain
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2021
- Messages
- 23
Thank you very much for the write-up! I enjoyed every bit of it.
Why did you say that?
That's irony. Although for a game that took about a month of lifetime the result is a bit underwhelming, especially as I messed up rather badly in a few moments and missed opportunity to get much closer to the record. It easily could have been 2 turns faster, if I played the last 30-40 turns more carefully; and the further back you go the more turns you can win. Without random events - they cost me a couple of turns - this map might have been good enough to beat @WastinTime 's legendary game.
The remainder of the game was uneventful save one extraordinary incident.
On 15 March 44 BC a group of senators - for reasons best known to themselves - turned up at a session of the Senate with daggers. Incidentally, this very day new security device called metal detector was to be tested a the entrance. It so happened that among the offenders were some of the most outspoken critics of Julius. They were displeased with his politics, and above all his "wasteful space programs". There is no courthouse in Rome, justice is swift and harsh. It was taken as obvious that they were conspiring to assassinate Caesar and by the time he arrived at the scene the senators were already sentenced to death. But he was kind and decided that these noble men could continue serving Rome...
T359
RNG is having a laugh
On 15 March 44 BC a group of senators - for reasons best known to themselves - turned up at a session of the Senate with daggers. Incidentally, this very day new security device called metal detector was to be tested a the entrance. It so happened that among the offenders were some of the most outspoken critics of Julius. They were displeased with his politics, and above all his "wasteful space programs". There is no courthouse in Rome, justice is swift and harsh. It was taken as obvious that they were conspiring to assassinate Caesar and by the time he arrived at the scene the senators were already sentenced to death. But he was kind and decided that these noble men could continue serving Rome...
Spoiler :
T359
RNG is having a laugh
Spoiler :
Congrats! Any other non-Inca leader you think would do better? Or was it all about the Praets? Or maybe Org or Exp are of great value?
Augustus, perhaps? Praets are certainly a big part of it but traits are important too. I'm not sure about Organized vs Industrious. Only 11 courthouses and 9 lighthouses... Saved thousands of gold on civic upkeep and about 30000 on factories, though. Also saved ~12000 on settlers, and most were built before factories. Industrious and Organized (Roosevelt) is an interesting combination, so is Financial and Philosophical (Elizabeth); I think Victoria could be even better than Liz. But is there life without UU?
on factories, though. Also saved ~12000 on settlers, and most were built before factories. Industrious and Organized (Roosevelt) is an interesting combination, so is Financial and Philosophical (Elizabeth); I think Victoria could be even better than Liz. But is there life without UU?May be, Ramesses? Great starting techs and UU + Industrious, Obelisk might be useful for getting early GP. Perhaps, we underestimate Spiritual? It might be interesting in the context of a huge empire prior to first Golden Age.
Normally I would only adopt slavery and religion, thats 3 turns. Does not seem like much at the point when the key limiting factor is whipping anger.
Switching religion and civics for diplomatic bonuses: useful when you have like -10 with everbody for declaring on their friends. It might help get some techs which otherwise would have to be extorted or stolen.
It opens a possibility of Caste windows before GA. Could also use Pacifism with Paya. How good is that? No idea, it will require some thinking over and planning.
Paya also allows relatively early use of Theocracy and OR. Might even plan for very early Paya to get the Theo bonus sooner. It would not hurt to run Free Religion when the slider is up.
Police State for cheaper military units? Yes, please! And I would not mind Vassalage either.
Normally I would only adopt slavery and religion, thats 3 turns. Does not seem like much at the point when the key limiting factor is whipping anger.
Switching religion and civics for diplomatic bonuses: useful when you have like -10 with everbody for declaring on their friends. It might help get some techs which otherwise would have to be extorted or stolen.
It opens a possibility of Caste windows before GA. Could also use Pacifism with Paya. How good is that? No idea, it will require some thinking over and planning.
Paya also allows relatively early use of Theocracy and OR. Might even plan for very early Paya to get the Theo bonus sooner. It would not hurt to run Free Religion when the slider is up.
Police State for cheaper military units? Yes, please! And I would not mind Vassalage either.
konata_LS
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2021
- Messages
- 424
Congrats on the victory! Epic write-up 
Almost 27000 per turn at the end game 
Combined with -50000
It seems Space game under Marathon speed is quite different from Normal speed (typical examples are Fish Man's space games), even both at Deity level
.
Apart from Vicky or AC, maybe Mansa is a potential choice? ... SPI + FIN + Skirmishers are not bad.
Almost 27000
per turn at the end game Combined with -50000
It seems Space game under Marathon speed is quite different from Normal speed (typical examples are Fish Man's space games), even both at Deity level
. Apart from Vicky or AC, maybe Mansa is a potential choice? ... SPI + FIN + Skirmishers are not bad.
Pangaea
Rock N Roller
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2010
- Messages
- 6,390
Sorry for not being ecstatic, but I genuinely don't like it when the game is broken like this. It feels too much like culture by espionage, and how the HoF had to come up with a new category for it, because it's a completely different way to play the game than everybody else. Which means that games can't possibly be compared.Combined with -50000
Oh well, it's a great achievement ofc, I just don't like this type of gameplay.
konata_LS
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2021
- Messages
- 424
@Pangaea
Certainly people can have their own preference; you have yours as well
. There are many ways to play a game. But still, it's exciting to see people in their playthrough do something that I've never done, such as wonder-bread or strike economy .
PS: Good luck for your shadow game. I'm not competent enough to help you (as you see, I still struggle around Monarch level) and you've already got excellent advice from very good Deity players. With GM, CoL and Currency, you economy would be fine, though some zealots around you look dangerous.
Certainly people can have their own preference; you have yours as well
. There are many ways to play a game. But still, it's exciting to see people in their playthrough do something that I've never done, such as wonder-bread or strike economy .PS: Good luck for your shadow game. I'm not competent enough to help you (as you see, I still struggle around Monarch level) and you've already got excellent advice from very good Deity players. With GM, CoL and Currency, you economy would be fine, though some zealots around you look dangerous.
Pangaea
Rock N Roller
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2010
- Messages
- 6,390
It is certainly impressive, don't get me wrong. It takes immense skill to actually pull off these amazing feats. It's just not a type of gameplay that particularly interests me, because the basis of it is to break the game's mechanics apart. I don't like that in general in games I play, so this isn't just a Civ4 thing.
jnebbe
Prince
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2019
- Messages
- 352
I swear I see you playing immortal on NC games@Pangaea
Certainly people can have their own preference; you have yours as well
PS: Good luck for your shadow game. I'm not competent enough to help you (as you see, I still struggle around Monarch level) and you've already got excellent advice from very good Deity players. With GM, CoL and Currency, you economy would be fine, though some zealots around you look dangerous.
Personally, I think the way corporations are 'broken' is one of the most realistic features of this game. This is how real corporations and billionaries (soon to become trillionaries) get rich: abuse the system, let someone else carry the burden while you add billions (or dozens of billions) of dollars to your wealth every year.
Pangaea
Rock N Roller
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2010
- Messages
- 6,390
I can sort of agree with that, but I still find that from a gameplay perspective it makes for a broken game, and that isn't something I like in any game. But I'm sorry for raising this here. It's just one of those things I can't ignore so my heart aches out from time to time. Like I wrote above, it's a fantastic achievement. Guess I just wish it wasn't possible to break the game like this. Potentially it makes all space games in the HoF pointless in comparison. But I'll shut up now and go back to my corner 
Everybody has their own view of which game mechanics ar fine and which are broken. For me the most broken is probably begging/demanding one gold or a resource for ten turns of peace. Such a dirty trick! And in this game I abused it to extent that would make even Ostap Bender blush.
konata_LS
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2021
- Messages
- 424
I swear I see you playing immortal on NC games
Do you mean that NC 274 with Hatty? I only played some turns at Emperor to encourage another player to War chariots rush a neighbour
.
