Peace treaties/ceasfires don't scale with gamespeed

[peter450]

I noticed this one the other day, that if you offer a ceasefire/peacetreaty tribute etc it only lasts 10 turns regardless of game speed!

surely it should scale according to the speed so 20 turns epic, 30 marathon?, otherwise paying people off becomes useless on longer games as they can attack you again in like 10 turns which probably won't even cover the time to build a single archer on the longer game speeds

 

[Yakk]

Hmm. Scaling it with production would be interesting.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Speed scaling is very poor in civ, and it goes a lot further than just the peace treaties. A lot. Unfortunately, this is a gameplay issue rather than one with the AI...I don't think the betterAI team could/should package any such change into a mod that's only supposed to improve the AI performance and not alter gameplay rules.

 

[r_rolo1]

I agree with TMIT... if you go that way, there a LOT of no scalable things that should be scalable, starting by the grace period of events.....

 

[peter450]

Well i'm not advocating looking at everything, things like events does not really have a huge impact on a player

But having a AI bribe you to stop attacking and then 10 turns later which is nothing on marathon you attack again feels like a exploit, it works the other way too and effectively totally devalues any kind of tribute or tactic that involves paying someone off to buy you some time

 

[r_rolo1]

Well, it is discussible that 10 g = 10 turns of peace is not a exploit in it self , but you have a point....

But i just quoted the events grace period because it was the first one that popped in my head, There is a lot of potentially gamebreaking stuff that does not scale either with speed or with map size ..... The peace treaty duration is just one in many.

 

[peter450]

Well certain things like unit production was done intentionally i think, but something like a truce/peace treaty is not scaling is not something that really alters the game as such but just becomes of little value.

I'm not averse to some things not scaling and changing the way something plays, i've made plenty of mod's to units etc, so i like change, but when something does not scale and kinda becomes useless as a result thats when i think it could maybe use a look

 

[MadmanAtW]

Keep in mind that there are two scales for time. There is the actual year progression- if something scales by gamespeed, this is what it scales with. But there is also movement time, and that is what enforced peace treaties scale with. 10 turns on epic is no longer enough time to build as many extra units as it is on normal... but it is just as much time to move reinforcements around, and scaling it up to 15 turns means more movement.

Military time seems to go as much or more on "movement time" than "calendar time"... and I think that's why the enforced peace treaties stay on movement time, without scaling for game speed.

 

[Yakk]

I'd be tempted to make treaties square with the geometric mean of movement speed factor (which is 1x) and unit production speed (which grows slower than game speed) *. A downside is that the length of treaties would no longer be nice even numbers, and as it stands the interface for "your peace treaty is going to end" is pretty poor on the human end, and this is (not strictly) an AI thing.

* TreatyScale = sqrt( 1 * production scale factor )

I think unit production multipliers are 2:1 at quick, 1:1 at normal, 1:2 at epic and 1:3 at marathon. That would make treaty multipliers of 1.4:1, 1:1, 1:1.4 and 1:1.7 respectively.

 

[Woody1]

Rather than whine about changing something that is clearly outside the scope of Better AI, just mod it yourself if it bothers you so much:

In GlobalDefines.xml, change the lines:
<DefineName>PEACE_TREATY_LENGTH</DefineName>
<iDefineIntVal>10</iDefineIntVal>
to something you want.

You'll have to change them to correspond to whatever game speed you're playing with. But that's a far better option than messing up the Better AI mod for everyone else.

 

[peter450]

I'd hardly call pointing out a inconsistancy a "whine" and i doubt such a change would "mess" anything up for anyone...

I have already done this thanks, i was simply pointing out it's something that "could" maybe use a look, i don't mind if it get's changed or not i was just making a point that by not scaling it devalues the 10 turn truce on higher game speeds

This mod has made changes to the core mechanic's in the past (air combat), i was just making a suggestion no need to be so defensive about it