Shoshone discussion

[pineappledan]

Vox Populi Mod Central Discord

Vox Populi Discord I'm advertising a Discord on the intent for modding and modmodding purposes. This hopes to centralize modmodders efforts into one server where modmodders can share and inquire on code specific questions along with new mods to tease and release. With this intention, the Discord...

forums.civfanatics.com

It's stickied in the mod repository, because it started out as a place for modmodders and then grew from that. Hasn't been moved over into the main forum

Well, good to see we’re all on the same page re: moving the tile claim from the Huns at least.

We haven’t had a robust discussion about what the Huns should get to compensate, but I proposed an idea in the Congress proposal workshop:

Spoiler Hunnic UA Change: Round 2 :

Congress 5 Hunnic UA: Scourge of God
+10% Combat Strength for each subsequent attack against a single target during a turn.
Inflict +100% and receive -50% War Weariness.
Claim adjacent unowned land tiles when Cities claim a tile of the same type.

Proposed Change: Scourge of God
+10% Combat Strength for each subsequent attack against a single target during a turn.
Inflict +100% and receive -50% War Weariness.
All tiles with Gold or Culture gain 1 more for 1 turn for each Citizen you kill.

Note: Things that kill Citizens:

• Capturing cities (cities lose population)
• Razing cities (lose 1 per turn)
• Nukes

Losing population by Starving cities does not count.

Reasons:

• Huns and Shoshone are too similar:
  • skirmisher UU
  • flatland unique tile improvement that unlocks in late ancient era and gives
  • UA ability that gives a combat bonus and free tiles. Not cheaper, specifically tiles at no cost.
  • They're both Grey
• Additionally, every civ from the Eastern European Steppes in the game (Huns, Mongols, Russia) has a bonus to border expansion and it is both repetitive and creatively bankrupt
• Huns could benefit from a unique angle, and we don't have a Razing civ in the game.
• New bonus is very 'Scourge of God'.
• The tile claim bonus is interesting, and stronger than the Shoshone's current bonus. I think it could find a good home there.

 

[azum4roll]

All tiles with Gold or Culture gain 1 more for 1 turn for each Citizen you kill.

I'd just give them on ALL tiles. It's new code regardless so why not save some words?

 

[Rekk]

I imagine the intent is to piggy-back off of Golden Age code.

Definitely an awkward sentence, though.

 

[pineappledan]

The intent was golden age piggy-back, yes.

 

[Recursive]

It doesn't seem like the discord is advertised in any kind of sticky

There's probably a better solution, but I'm a little hesitant to make people not have to work a bit to find the link, given that the server's been raided before and people on a notorious far-right internet forum are aware of this mod.

 

[hokath]

>the server's been raided before
What does this mean?! People joined and posted pictures of cats/frogs/nazis?

 

[Recursive]

>the server's been raided before
What does this mean?! People joined and posted pictures of cats/frogs/nazis?

Shock images, some of which were illegal.

 

[notque]

Possibly flavorful Shoshone bonuses

Environmental Harmony: Enhanced benefits from natural wonders or bonuses to appeal, symbolizing their reverence for nature. Works nicely with their extra land.
Mobile Warfare: The Shoshone were known for their horsemanship. A bonus to mounted units' combat strength or movement could reflect this.
Natural Resource Utilization: Bonus yield from resources like deer, bison, and fish, reflecting their hunter-gatherer lifestyle.
Adaptation: Ability to gain additional yields from unimproved tiles, reflecting their adaptability to various environments.
Nomadic Lifestyle: Ability to move settlers faster, reflecting their historical mobility.

Not sure if this is helpful, but tried to come up with some ideas.

 

[azum4roll]

If you give bonus to unimproved tiles, one of the two below will happen:
1. The bonus is weak -> the bonus obsoletes as soon as you get workers out improving
2. The bonus is strong -> why bother with the UI then

 

[Rekk]

The current UA touches on several of these points:

Mobile Warfare: The Shoshone were known for their horsemanship. A bonus to mounted units' combat strength or movement could reflect this.

Their UU is a mounted unit.

Adaptation: Ability to gain additional yields from unimproved tiles, reflecting their adaptability to various environments.

Their UI makes bad/mediocre tiles into good tiles.

Nomadic Lifestyle: Ability to move settlers faster, reflecting their historical mobility.

Currently abstracted out as gaining large amounts of territory.

 

[usadefcon1]

Just curious what the current proposal(s) are at the moment?

 

[pineappledan]

This one still, I think:

Great Expanse

• Gain 2 additional tiles when you gain a city or your borders expand.
  • tiles on border claim either are random adjacent tiles to the one claimed or picked by the tile picker
• Land Units gain +20% Combat Strength in friendly territory.
• Clearing Barbarian Encampments also gives an Ancient Ruin reward.

Encampment
Requires flat land and not adjacent to another Encampment
+15% Tile defense
5 damage to adjacent enemies each turn
+21
Nearby city gains +1 for each Encampment if it has a Smokehouse, +1 if it has a Customs House, and +2 if it has an Interpretive Center.

Tech upgrades:
1 at Drama
1at gunpowder
1at rifling
1 at advanced ballistics

I've swung back around on the idea of just using the tile picker for all of the events. I think that might be the best way to do it. If you give random adjacent tiles then a) that's a different mechanism than the on-settle/conquest bonus, and that's complicated to describe, and b) random tiles being picked could end up in some really weird shapes for border tile expansion, create closed loops of unclaimed land surrounded by claimed tiles, etc.

 

[azum4roll]

That'll become "when your borders expand, gain 3 tiles instead of 1". That's strictly better than +200% border growth.

 

[pineappledan]

Yes, except you only get the yield on expand for 1

 

[azum4roll]

I still prefer "gain all adjacent tiles of the same terrain type". Tile picker can handle it too.