Still no late game uses for iron and horses

[Winston]

I'm really looking forward to BNW and have already pre-ordered a copy on Steam but one little niggle I have is that iron and horses become redundant in the late game and I would've liked a couple of buildings to consume them so that they remain useful in the late game e.g. race track and steelworks.
I also notice the same thing with oil a little in that the modern units switch to aluminum as a requirement instead of oil.
There are some good mods that deal with these issues but you can't gain achievements with modded games so I was hoping that Firaxis would do something official. I guess it would have to be micro DLC now if they were to change it.
Is it just me or do other people want a little tweaking to strategic resources?

 

[Evie94]

just trade them to the AI for a little Gold

 

[DemonMaster]

Iron and Horses can at least sometimes be traded away to a civ that have been stuck in history. Perhaps not so you get rich, but better than just sit on them.
Oil is still used by bombers and battleships. Yes, I know about stealth bombers , but they (in most of my games9 come in late so you still have use for your bombers and battleships.

 

[Giskler]

Glue Factory: Requires Horses. There you go

 

[DemonMaster]

Since we have horsemeat in almost everything in EU nowadays it seems, perhaps we could let horses be converted to food during the late game.

 

[AlazkanAssassin]

These days, most people (in the US) that have horses use them for recreational purposes. Perhaps horses could turn into a luxury when you discover combustion.

 

[Glassmage]

I think horse is already useful through all eras because of Circus. Iron really need some more work on though.

 

[bcaiko]

They will be useful to the extent that they will be unique resources used in calculating the value of a trading route.

 

[Babri]

I think that all strategic resources should be important. Just like faith (purchasing GPs in industrial era onwards) , all of them should have a usage across all the eras. After all you are allocating a part of your interface to display their quantities.

There could be a steel mill for example which consumes iron & gives production bonuses. Similarly horse could have a modern building consuming it & giving a happiness boost.

Sent from my HTC One V using Tapatalk 2

 

[VainoValkea]

Horses, as a strategic resource, are obsolete as the modern "cavalry" is either comprised of motor vehicles and helicopters or a ceremonial unit with no actual combat purpose. They are still useful for their work, meat and recreational value but not in military terms anymore.

 

[bouncymischa]

Horses, as a strategic resource, are obsolete as the modern "cavalry" is either comprised of motor vehicles and helicopters or a ceremonial unit with no actual combat purpose. They are still useful for their work, meat and recreational value but not in military terms anymore.

It has to be admitted, the production bonus from Pastures and the benefit from Circuses do seem to reflect the modern usage of horses fairly well...

 

[wigwam]

Horses are fine. You could slap a little culture yield on Horses, and as somebody mentioned, there are always Circuses.

Iron's a little weird, considering how important it still is and how much of it we use. But it's important not to overcomplicate the game.

 

[VainoValkea]

I think what needs to be fixed is the fact that the AI will still gladly pay the player for horses and iron even after they start to lose their relevancy.

 

[bouncymischa]

Iron's a little weird, considering how important it still is and how much of it we use. But it's important not to overcomplicate the game.

I suppose my viewpoint of strategic resources has been affected by Civ 3. I remember back when "Saltpeter" was a strategic resource necessary for gunpowder units... and then, eventually, alternatives to saltpeter were developed and units no longer needed it, using other chemical explosives for their guns.

So I always saw the eventual obsolecence of a resource as just indicating that technology had progressed to the point that it was commonly available. I do have to wonder -- is there any first-world country that worries about having enough access to iron for steel these days? So sure, we do still use tons of iron for things, but it's readily accessible to anyone. I'm pretty sure nobody goes to war over an iron mine.

 

[Dunkah]

I think that once you have a resource you should "have it". No more counting how many Irons you have etc.

Once you have Iron you can trade it or give it to whomever you want. Build as many of whatever you want as well. (It would also be neat to have two categories, like limited allows you to build stuff yourself and unlimited would allow you to trade).

However I would also like to see it needed as a prerequisite in many more items. Any modern buildings, any modern unit etc. Then I would add in many more resources like Rubber, Steel, Zinc etc... and make all units rely on certain ones then gain bonuses if they have others.

Example: an modern era tank would require Oil and Alloy which would require you to have Iron, Alluminum and an Alloy Factory somewhere. Then if you had Copper you would get a bonus to Accuracy or Rubber would give you a bonus towards speed Perhaps Tungsten would give you strength. If you didn;t have the Copper tungsten or Rubber you could still build them just wouldn't get the bonuses.

This would have to be combined with a better set of Trading parameters with the AI but this would make those late game Oil wars or Alluminum wars an actuallity.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Iron is still very much in use, but we've become so good at mining and recycling it that it no longer has a strategic value due to its relative abundance. No one is jealously protecting their sources of iron these days.

Strategic value only stands so long as the demand is high and the supply is low. The late game should really have aluminum go the way of iron and coal too. Modern armor, aircraft, and other such things are increasingly being made of composites and exotic alloys. Titanium and Rare Earth Metals (actually quite common, but difficult to extract) should be the last tier of strategic materials.

 

[VainoValkea]

@Dunkah: I prefer the current Civ V model to the Civ IV model. Having some scarcity is a good thing, and modeling scarcity as a binary distinction (those who have vs those who don't) isn't as appealing as a more varied scale. It also makes resource warfare much more interesting: sapping an enemy iron source will hurt them even if the source isn't their only one, and grabbing that source for oneself makes sense even if one has a mine of their own.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Well, unusable resources aren't very good aesthetically, but they don't break the game in any way. This doesn't cause balance problems, doesn't limit strategies and so on.

The best solution would be in having some late-game resource-consuming buildings (am I correct that Horses aren't consumed by Circus, you just need one near the city?), but I don't think it has high priority.

 

[Kruppe]

Well, unusable resources aren't very good aesthetically, but they don't break the game in any way. This doesn't cause balance problems, doesn't limit strategies and so on.

The best solution would be in having some late-game resource-consuming buildings (am I correct that Horses aren't consumed by Circus,you just need one near the city?), but I don't think it has high priority.

you just need one near the city

 

[VainoValkea]

Actually they do cause a "balance" problem - albeit a minor one, in that the AI overestimates their value in the late game when trading. They should fix that aspect of the AI, but it's not very important.

And you are correct about the Circus.