The Latest G.O.P. Temper Tantrum

[downtown]

Given Louisiana's shoreline and recent events, I don't understand how you can't.

The Oil Industry alone in Louisiana accounts for over 200,000 jobs, dwarfing the economic impact of a very strong seafood related industry. When you add in chemical refineries and other resource extraction, you're easily up to 20% of the entire state's economy.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying those are the facts. A statewide Louisiana officeholder can't really afford to play nice with the EPA.

 

[Formaldehyde]

It's not like they have a lot of pristine beaches and depend upon them for much of their tourism, like some of the neighboring states which suffer from their greed.

 

[Cutlass]

I would never oppose the EPA unless they did something insane like declare CO2 a pollutant which can be regulated through the Clear Air Act.

Why do you hate the private ownership of property?

 

[Kaitzilla]

Perhaps we are finding out what happens in a country when there are no good laws left to create and new effective environmental laws left to pass, yet there is still pressure to pass new ones.

It's the only explanation I can think of for what's happening lately.

 

[Cutlass]

Perhaps we are finding out what happens in a country when there are no good laws left to create and new effective environmental laws left to pass, yet there is still pressure to pass new ones.

It's the only explanation I can think of for what's happening lately.

If that's the only "explanation" you can think of then you aren't thinking very hard.

Environmental laws are about protecting people and property from the actions of other people that will harm them. Businesses and their pet politicians oppose environmental laws because they can make greater profits by harming other people than they can by acting in ways that do not harm other people.

In economics this is called a market failure. What these regulations are trying to do is to stop the markets from failing, and allowing some people to profit by harming other people or destroying the property of other people.

In other words, the EPA is pro-capitalist. Opposing the EPA is corporate cronyism.

The markets work more efficiently if the lives and property of all people are protected equally.

 

[Antilogic]

I would never oppose the EPA unless they did something insane like declare CO2 a pollutant which can be regulated through the Clear Air Act.

How dare the Environmental Protection Agency, charged with regulating the discharge of pollutants into the natural environment, regulate the discharge of a pollutant into the natural environment!?

Yes, that deserved an interrobang.

 

[History_Buff]

Exhibit #591867182 against the out-of-control EPA:
http://lfb.org/today/how-government-wrecked-the-gas-can/

Wait, do you seriously believe that's even a real problem, let alone one national legislatures should be concerned with?

 

[Kaitzilla]

Wait, do you seriously believe that's even a real problem, let alone one national legislatures should be concerned with?

When the day comes that the government controls your thermostat remotely, I will remind you of this comment.

 

[JollyRoger]

The day the thermostat becomes useless may come sooner.

 

[History_Buff]

When the day comes that the government controls your thermostat remotely, I will remind you of this comment.

My house is freezing most of the year anyway. If it's cold, you put clothes on.

Nor is that in any way similar to limiting the type of gas container you can buy.

 

[Bootstoots]

I certainly hope for your sake that you didn't breath any of its fumes, have any minor cuts on your hands, and thoroughly washed them afterwards.

Three elementary students hospitalized after playing with mercury

Mercury poisoning

The quantity of mercury I was playing with was 2.4 g or about 180 µL. I kept my mouth and nose fairly far above my hands and limited my exposure to ~1 min. I observed no cuts on my hands, but it would not have been particularly dangerous even if so - the metal itself is not particularly hazardous even in the bloodstream (there's even been a case of attempted suicide by mercury injection - he survived with only localized injury).

I'm not sure how those kids obtained a quantity "about the size of Elmer's glue bottle" but assuming that is a small bottle of around 2 oz or 60 mL then they had over 300 times the quantity I was playing with. Being kids, they probably did nothing to minimize their exposure to the vapor, played for much longer, and were small to begin with.

Past a certain level of reasonable safety precautions, I don't think the paranoia we have developed towards certain chemicals is necessarily helpful. I suspect that taking some of the perceived danger out of science results in less interest in science in the first place, which may be more harmful to our society than the occasional science-related injury.

This is all beside the point though - I do agree with heightened regulations against mercury emissions from coal power plants. They make up the largest single source of mercury pollution in the world.

 

[History_Buff]

It's just dumb is all. You're handling a chemical that you know could be quite dangerous should certain, admittedly unlikely, events occur. And your payoff is handling a heavy liquid.

 

[Cutlass]

When the day comes that the government controls your thermostat remotely, I will remind you of this comment.

And when you're private employer tells you what you can and cannot eat, how much you can weigh, that you cannot drink or smoke, and that you aren't allowed to get away from pollution, who are you going to turn to for help?

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

When the day comes that the government controls your thermostat remotely, I will remind you of this comment.

Power companies can already do that. Why does it only become tyranny when the government does it?

The Oil Industry alone in Louisiana accounts for over 200,000 jobs, dwarfing the economic impact of a very strong seafood related industry. When you add in chemical refineries and other resource extraction, you're easily up to 20% of the entire state's economy.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying those are the facts. A statewide Louisiana officeholder can't really afford to play nice with the EPA.

Fair point I suppose. I guess it's because Maryland has a very strong environmental lobby/movement (even the most ardent conservatives here are very pro-EPA and anti-pollution laws) that I expect a state hit by a recent oil spill to not vote for people who are friends of those responsible.

 

[Formaldehyde]

When the day comes that the government controls your thermostat remotely, I will remind you of this comment.

The utility companies already control the AC systems in many Florida homes. They occasionally shut them off during peak load times instead of having brownouts.

Past a certain level of reasonable safety precautions, I don't think the paranoia we have developed towards certain chemicals is necessarily helpful. I suspect that taking some of the perceived danger out of science results in less interest in science in the first place, which may be more harmful to our society than the occasional science-related injury.

So you are now advocating that children again be allowed to play with mercury during science classes to help promote this playful attitude with such toxic substances?

 

[Kaitzilla]

Power companies can already do that. Why does it only become tyranny when the government does it?

The power company would only use it for brownout reasons.

Politicians might use it to keep your house from being too cool in the summer or too hot in the winter to save energy and the environment. I'm thinking Jimmy Carter's "Put on a sweater" only with teeth.


Also, one can be sued if it causes a problem, the other is immune.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

The power company would only use it for brownout reasons.

Politicians might use it to keep your house from being too cool in the summer or too hot in the winter to save energy and the environment. I'm thinking Jimmy Carter's "Put on a sweater" only with teeth.


Also, one can be sued if it causes a problem, the other is immune.

Oh, so they would only use it for good and sensible things as opposed to business reasons.

Quelle horreur!

 

[JollyRoger]

I don't know how those poor soluls in parts of Alabama and Mississippi would deal with such an unknown adversary as teeth.

 

[Bootstoots]

So you are now advocating that children again be allowed to play with mercury during science classes to help promote this playful attitude with such toxic substances?

In small quantities, with close supervision and short exposure times, yes.

 

[JollyRoger]

Same standards for playing with uranus?