Hey so I usually play civs going down Tradition. But when playing Venice, is it absolutly necessary to get Liberty for the Great Merchant? I usually like single sprawling citys that make stuff fast but It's much easier with Tradition. I dont know. Can you guys post what you guys think?
Tips with Venice
- Thread starter Noxius
- Start date
tomplum68
Warlord
You may want to go down both Liberty and Tradition.
As Venice is going to be a OCC for awhile, going tradition and NC rush early isn't a bad start and then hitting up liberty for the GM.
I haven't played through as Venice but I'd be tempted to go deep into both trees.
As Venice is going to be a OCC for awhile, going tradition and NC rush early isn't a bad start and then hitting up liberty for the GM.
I haven't played through as Venice but I'd be tempted to go deep into both trees.
Randall_Flagg
The Evil One
Well I am loving them late game. Early game is boring!!! I am not going down Either tree in my games to be honest. I have been trying this build. Honor Opener- Full Piety Tree. Has been very awesome imho. My religion is hard to beat, if it gets in a city anywhere in the world, it eats the other.
With only one city, I felt I could skip needing the extra culture for border gorowth. Now I will state, I do not puppet CS's ever. So my MoV's are for dosh only. And as I just pointed out, you can live with only one the whole game.
You get a free one with Optics, that is enough to get your 1st 2 trade routes up and one building. Once you get 2 trade routes going it is a snowball effect on your Income.
With only one city, I felt I could skip needing the extra culture for border gorowth. Now I will state, I do not puppet CS's ever. So my MoV's are for dosh only. And as I just pointed out, you can live with only one the whole game.
You get a free one with Optics, that is enough to get your 1st 2 trade routes up and one building. Once you get 2 trade routes going it is a snowball effect on your Income.
Randall_Flagg
The Evil One
One City Challenge. It is in the roll down options.
AlazkanAssassin
Engineer
Liberty is not at all required. The one Great Merchant you get from Optics is enough to get trade routes going, both external and internal. I try to get a food and trade route going into Venice as soon as I can.
Using 2 (or 3 w/ the finisher) great merchants early to get puppets can actually be bad, if it eliminates the trade routes that are within range of Venice.
Using 2 (or 3 w/ the finisher) great merchants early to get puppets can actually be bad, if it eliminates the trade routes that are within range of Venice.
tomplum68
Warlord
so you're just staying with Venice and not puppeting any CS's?
How to keep up scientifically?
and re: AlazkanAssassin: you don't want to puppet close CS because you're losing early trading partners for gold, correct?
How to keep up scientifically?
and re: AlazkanAssassin: you don't want to puppet close CS because you're losing early trading partners for gold, correct?
Randall_Flagg
The Evil One
Not really keeping up per say. Staying not real far behind is the best I can do at this time. I am hopeful that my 10 over sea Trade routes will help me pull even, now that I have met the Tech leaders.
tomplum68
Warlord
So the basic idea with Venice is to build up a huge trading network, befriend every CS to gain votes for culture / diplo win?
At what point does buying CS get in the way of acquiring enough votes for victory?
budweiser
King of the Beers
You acquire the CS that are too hard to buy. Take them away from their AI allies.
northernscribe
Chieftain
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2012
- Messages
- 80
My Venice game was a disaster because of this issue. I bought three city states, the AI expanded like crazy and conquered a few more, and even though I was allies with every CS in the game, I didn't have enough votes for a diplo victory. I don't know what the forumula is for this, but it's worth paying attention to and it's worth keeping as many CS alive as possible.
Randall_Flagg
The Evil One
Well at the point you have 6 Naval routes, your gold issues are over for ever. I am able to buy a CS every 4 turns at this point. The gold from trading with Morroco and it's 3 coastal cities is over the top. I over loaded this map to make it so Diplo is not as easy. 22 civs and 41 CS's.
I am not real sure how I will play them going forward. But getting trade up ASAP is the way to go no matter what you plan.
I'm about halfway through my first game with Venice, and as it turns out, I closed out Liberty completely and only have two policies on Tradition (base and the wonder boost). I found the two free merchants from Tradition were a big boost. Despite what others have said about early purchase of CS's, picking them up early were very helpful for getting my empire going. While it is true you miss out on the external trade route possibility with CS's, once they are puppets, you can get them on internal trade routes to send food and production to Venice, greatly aiding your primary city's development.
tomplum68
Warlord
I'm not sure it becomes an issue or not. I finished an Indonesia game where the Huns had taken Budapest. I had gotten myself in good with trade and had no money issues and was able to ally with most CS but ended up winning on time because one CS had been bought like two turns before the vote and I overlooked repurchasing their love.
The votes needed to win was 28 for a long while and I ended up taking a CS that was allied to Egypt before myself and the Aztecs took them out and I puppeted the CS and the vote needed went down to 27.
Teaf
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2013
- Messages
- 108
I never bother with Liberty on Venice, at all. I did at the start when I was trying them out to get the Merchant of Venice, but I tend to get Optics near the start anyway which gives me a free one which I always use to buy a near-by City-State (preferably close water trade access) so I can bounce some food back to Venice. After that, I generate another naturally from the puppet CS as they default to gold focus and I use that to buy another City-State that gives me trade access to the Civs I'm not able to reach early game.
Depending on other factors like map size, map type and whether I'm going for a Cultural or Diplomatic victory I may buy out another City-State with another self-generated Merchant of Venice if I still need proper trade access or more food going back to Venice to keep growth up.
Unless you really want Liberty or want two quick City-State puppets, or maybe you're going for a Science or Domination victory then I wouldn't bother unlocking it.
Depending on other factors like map size, map type and whether I'm going for a Cultural or Diplomatic victory I may buy out another City-State with another self-generated Merchant of Venice if I still need proper trade access or more food going back to Venice to keep growth up.
Unless you really want Liberty or want two quick City-State puppets, or maybe you're going for a Science or Domination victory then I wouldn't bother unlocking it.
tomplum68
Warlord
Is the culture victory still the Utopia project?
Teaf
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2013
- Messages
- 108
No, gaining "Influential" status over all the other Civ's by massing Tourism is how you win a Cultural Victory in Brave New World.
tomplum68
Warlord
Which is more difficult as a small empire than culture victory was before. I guess you need more open border agreements to get archaeologists into other empires to plunder sites. And the OB agreements increase your tourism anyway. But as a small empire you only have so many buildings to put artifacts and works of art which could potentially stymie your tourism.
AlazkanAssassin
Engineer
Puppeting a close CS is OK if you have real civs to trade with. Puppeting a close city state is the way to send a food trade route back into Venice early.
GAGA Extrem
Emperor
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2008
- Messages
- 1,589
No. Instead your tourism must surpass the culture of every civ (seperately).
As for SPs, I'd stronlgy suggest to go tradition. Liberty can be useful, but for me the merchant from optics is usually enough. However, that being said: If the map setup is terrible and you find your capital to be placed in an inland sea or a cut-off part of the ocean, you will need a good city state or two to get those trade routes running.
I guess liberty might be the better option if you want to go for a science victory (and that is actually not that hard, considering that you will crank out a lot of beakers with your puppet cities).
Personally I stick to my tradition-super-wonder-city.
Similar threads
- Poll
