Uses for each religion
- Thread starter A Moon
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It might be problematic since this restriction would only apply to the last level.
About Guardian of Nature, I said that because it might not stick around...
You guys need to start using this when you say stuff like that.
Blehm. A Fellowship only lumbermill upgrade that... that... Blargyh. I don't know. Just please don't take away my ancient mills entirely! I love them so!
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
The biggest issue is with non-elves. At least in 1.31 where forests aren't removed by elves accidentally.
Not sure about that. Particularly with the spell changes planned.
You guys like the idea? *Melts*
Alright, how about we try and work it out to see what most people will like?
So far we have the standard camp:
+1
-1
+1
As opposed to the standard Lumber Mill:
What needs to be done is make it competitive to the LM on level 2 and superior on level 3. This is to give FOL civs a reason not to build LM's any more and to offset the fact that it requires specific conditions to happen.
So I propose omething like this:
Camp lvl 1
Camp lvl 2
Requires FOL
Camp lvl 3
Requires Guardian of Nature and Ancient Forest
Either +1 free specialist in city or if that is to powerful +1or +1
Personally I would have it give +1 free specialist in the city (with Guardian of Nature) and space them out like Pirate Harbors back in FFH.
And make lumber mills that are in a forest when it turns ancient automatically convert to a level 2 camp. This way, the FOL civs still have incentive to go for the LM or even mine if they really need the extra
What do you think?
One issue: It's already Camp->Yaranga, and the Yaranga is Doviello specific. Which means, in order to do this right, I'd like some kind of UniqueImprovement system. So don't expect it for 1.31.
Otherwise, I agree with Opera.
I love that site.
And I do not love them.
Torugu
Prince
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I hate Lumbermills on ancient forests with passion, it's one of the biggest crimes against lore and roleplay you can commit as a player.
Personally I would love to see Ancient Forest downgrade into normal forests if you build a LM on it, possibly with a chance to spawn some kind of pissed off tree guardian (similar to what happens when you scorch them). This would also solve the biggest (roleplay) problem with AFs, forests that have been captured by non FL civs.
Personally I would love to see Ancient Forest downgrade into normal forests if you build a LM on it, possibly with a chance to spawn some kind of pissed off tree guardian (similar to what happens when you scorch them). This would also solve the biggest (roleplay) problem with AFs, forests that have been captured by non FL civs.
I always saw lumbermills as one of the more forest friendly improvements. Instead of just hacking down a forest, you leave it standing, with just a sustainable amount of trees being collected each year. The Fellowship of Leaves isn't opposed to natural predation, and there's no law excluding trees from being eaten. (Assuming the humanoids, especilly Fellowship humanoids, are included in the cycle of nature, which I've never seen any implication that they aren't.) Heck, maybe they could just collect the dead trees.
Torugu
Prince
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The term Lumber Mill implies an industrialized use of the forest and that's something you can't do with an Ancient Forest.
Real world jungles are a fairly decent approximation for an Ancient Forest (not really, the jungle doesn't try to kill you if he doesn't like you, but you get the picture) and you know what the industrialized use of our jungles looks like. Ashen Veil approves.
Real world jungles are a fairly decent approximation for an Ancient Forest (not really, the jungle doesn't try to kill you if he doesn't like you, but you get the picture) and you know what the industrialized use of our jungles looks like. Ashen Veil approves.
The biggest issue is with non-elves. At least in 1.31 where forests aren't removed by elves accidentally.
It's good that we have Milaga's hot fix in the meantime.
So I it that camps are planned as saviors for non-elven FoL civs? When playing an elf civ, I haven't seen much use on building those.
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
Well, the old plans were for an Orchard improvement. I'd rather use camps, and not add a new improvement; However, to do that well we'd need to be able to create Unique Improvements (For the Doviello Yaranga; Doesn't need Ancient Forest, would be the difference).
Hmm, that could kick you in the nuts if you take some land with lumbermills and then ancient forest spreads there. One would have to raze those suckers really carefully. The AI might also be in for some derp moments if this was implemented.
You can summon angry trees by scorching ancient forests? Oh boy, I have to try this.
But in RifE, jungles can be lumbermilled to.
Torugu
Prince
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And that's weird. But as I said, that's something we're doing IRL as well, I doubt that those people are worshipping Succellus though, Mammon seems more likely.
That being said, it's not that big of a problem because lumberilling jungles isn't economically viable anyway.
PS: I sound like a tree-hugger...
And that's weird. But as I said, that's something we're doing IRL as well, I doubt that those people are worshipping Succellus though, Mammon seems more likely.
That being said, it's not that big of a problem because lumberilling jungles isn't economically viable anyway.
PS: I sound like a tree-hugger...
Ah, but in real life, the jungle is destroyed. In Erebus, it is preserved. Sustainable logging ftw.
Torugu
Prince
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And that's why it's weird. ^^
I don't think Erebus lumbermills work on the same scale as real life lumbermills.
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
In Erebus, they can just call the Priest of Leaves to bloom in some more trees, or move in close to the lizards and wait for their lands to turn into jungle, then conquer them.
Torugu
Prince
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Obviously it's not on the same scale as modern lumber mills. But the sustainable use of the forest requires a degree of organization that you can't achieve in a naturally grown forest let alone in an Ancient Forest. (You are aware that forested forests are vastly different from natural grown forests?)
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
Forested forests are orderly, lack much of the animal life, and just entirely different things; Fairly sure FoL would find it perverse.
Assuming FoL use the same type of lumbermills as the rest of Erebus.
[
]Why not just add a random event where units around a lumbermilled ancient forest get eaten by sharks?[/]
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