Vokarya's Workshop: Wonders

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Interventionism has been changed in latest revision. Right now you should have a 30% chance to be able to stop the war when you just started it. But I haven't tested thoroughly yet.

 

[Rezca]

Interventionism has been changed in latest revision. Right now you should have a 30% chance to be able to stop the war when you just started it. But I haven't tested thoroughly yet.

Recently I got called into a war against Rome due to him declaring on Greece (Defensive Pact) and the dialogue said "Will Make Peace" but he still refused to talk. Strange, but after three or so turns I could actually talk with him and made peace right there. Was the same when the Iroquois asked me to go to war with the English - three turns, then I could make peace. I like the three turn wait more than the same-turn peace, seems more balanced to me - but if it's just a "chance" and not always... Well, it's still better than it used to be

 

[zemlifr]

Reichstag is being worked on right now, and I've complained about Interventionalism's Magical Shield from warfare earlier as well - you definitely shouldn't be able to duck out of a Rebellion on the turn it flares up

Can those revolutions be excluded from Reichstag's calculations somehow? Like the nation has to have at least 1 ~ 3 cities when capitulated first? Would prevent abusing Revolutions for a quick and easy Golden Age?

Yes, disabling capitulation for civs with zero cities could help. At least it would stops golden ages from rebels and hopeless one city civs.

 

[<Nexus>]

I have "problems" with two Wonders:

Abu Simbel
Basically I love this wonder and its effect, but... I don't know what are the experiences of others, but I think this wonder is rather useless. By the time I finish building it, my state religion is already spread to most of my cities. Even if it is Kemetism, which has far the lowest spread rate!!! And I didn't even use a single missionary.

So a few ideas to make it a worthwhile wonder:

• +1 for state buildings
• reduce anarchy length
• +1 from priests
• +1 free priest

I think the first two would make sense and would be enough.

Silk Road
Now this one is a pretty useful wonder unquestionably. It just doesn't have the feeling of the Silk Road. The original Silk Road gave +1 trade route, but now it's "just" a +100% . It seems to be a super-bazaar and not a trading network.
It's also giving you +2 with Silk, what is quite funny, since it requires Silk anyway
My suggestion is:

• build Cart path to every civs capital on the continent on completion (something like Via Apia)
• establish diplomatic relations with every civ on same continent (I know we have this effect on Ishtar Gate too, but why not use it more than once?! Anyway, it's not a very powerful effect.)
• add +1 for each connected foreign capital (We have tag for that, right?)
• reduce bonus if needed
• remove the bonus from Silk
• make it provide you an extra source of Silk, so both your people could enjoy the benefits of silk and you can also trade it for someone else

What do you think?

 

[Samson]

The original Silk Road gave +1 trade route, but now it's just a +100% . It seems to be a super-bazaar and not a trading network.

Only a comment on the use of "just" in the above comment. I find this wonder to be incredibly useful. It comes at a time when I am frequently in money troubles, as I try to expand, do not have lots of sources of commerce. and am likely to be in or soon moving to a civic that has unhappiness for tax rate. The Silk Road, if available, can make a massive difference to the game.

[EDIT] I have never felt the need to build Abu Simbel, as you say if I have a religion by that time it likely has spread to most of my cities anyway.

 

[<Nexus>]

Only a comment on the use of "just" in the above comment. I find this wonder to be incredibly useful. It comes at a time when I am frequently in money troubles, as I try to expand, do not have lots of sources of commerce. and am likely to be in or soon moving to a civic that has unhappiness for tax rate. The Silk Road, if available, can make a massive difference to the game.

I did not question its usefulness. I questioned its design. It is a very powerful market/bank, instead of something representing a trade-network.

 

[gay_Aleks]

Besides, getting cart roads to all civs is a bit.. meh. By then you have Roads going.

 

[Vokarya]

At this point, I will say that I am listening and I do not hear anything that pushes my panic buttons. I have a lot of small building changes that I want to compile and upload as a new build before I start redoing wonders. There are several other Wonders that I would like to adjust: Copernicus' Observatory and Women's Suffrage are two of the big ones for me.

Regarding Abu Simbel: I guess this could use an additional lasting effect. I may have overestimated the sizes of early empires and the speed of religion spread in the early game.

Regarding Silk Road: I'm not happy with this one either. I would like to go even further, and move it up on the tech tree to Aristocracy + Calendar. Aristocracy is only because I think the tech could use a little more help, and Calendar to justify getting rid of Silk Farm as a separate improvement; as I see it, the only benefit to having Silk Farm as an improvement is to allow building Silk Road without having to wait for Calendar. I don't really like single-purpose improvements and would be happy if we could fold Silk Farm back into Plantation. I do remember when we consolidated the Orchard improvements it broke saved games, so I would be a little reluctant to do so, but I think it would be worth it in the long run.

 

[Arakhor]

I just want to say that rev 982 looks like it will be fantastic.

 

[Vokarya]

I have a question: with the changes to trade routes, how exactly does the Adam Smith's Trading Company ability of "Opens trade route with all other players" work? I did some playing around, and it seems to me that it causes all foreign cities to count as connected for all cities unless the player is running a "No Foreign City Connections" civic (such as Protectionism). Is there anything else that can turn this off or block this? We might need to rewrite the visible text, as it's kind of vague right now.

 

[<Nexus>]

Besides, getting cart roads to all civs is a bit.. meh. By then you have Roads going.

You build roads inside your territory. Anyway, this would be more a flavor effect, instead of something really strong&important. Anyway, I am happy if the +100% is replaced with some per connections thing. I'm sure Vokarya is up to something good in this case too

 

[gay_Aleks]

I've never seen the real effect that + per connections give. I'd prefer seeing how much gold I get, connections just confuse me.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I have a question: with the changes to trade routes, how exactly does the Adam Smith's Trading Company ability of "Opens trade route with all other players" work? I did some playing around, and it seems to me that it causes all foreign cities to count as connected for all cities unless the player is running a "No Foreign City Connections" civic (such as Protectionism). Is there anything else that can turn this off or block this? We might need to rewrite the visible text, as it's kind of vague right now.

Isn't that the same effect granted by a UN resolution? I haven't tried lately but I'd like to know what that resolution grants. Moreover there's another resolution (Single Currency?) which grants +1 trade routes if I'm not mistaken. We should change that one to, although I don't know how.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Also, while we're on the subject, I'm not sure I get how connected cities work sometimes. I thought that if your cities are all connected, they should have the same numbers of connections. But some cities display one or two connections more than others from time to time, and I haven't understood why.

 

[Arakhor]

I've never seen the real effect that + per connections give. I'd prefer seeing how much gold I get, connections just confuse me.

It tells you in the top left corner of each city screen how much you get from internal and external connections. That's a lot less confusing than trade routes.

 

[<Nexus>]

Isn't that the same effect granted by a UN resolution? I haven't tried lately but I'd like to know what that resolution grants. Moreover there's another resolution (Single Currency?) which grants +1 trade routes if I'm not mistaken. We should change that one to, although I don't know how.

+10% in all cities?

 

[Arakhor]

That sounds simple and easily applicable.

 

[Vokarya]

Isn't that the same effect granted by a UN resolution? I haven't tried lately but I'd like to know what that resolution grants. Moreover there's another resolution (Single Currency?) which grants +1 trade routes if I'm not mistaken. We should change that one to, although I don't know how.

Single Currency is +1 trade routes, so that doesn't do anything any more. I don't know if the UN Resolution for Free Trade Agreement and Adam Smith have the exact same effect. I could probably set up a game to test, but not right at this moment.

 

[gay_Aleks]

It tells you in the top left corner of each city screen how much you get from internal and external connections. That's a lot less confusing than trade routes.

Still, 100% feels more tangible than some commerce from connections.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

That sounds simple and easily applicable.

No, it's not that easy to tell the truth. Resolutions code is pretty complicated. I like the idea of +10% gold for everyone but it's not so easy to code it.