When to attack
- Thread starter MeatUnit2
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s.bernbaum
Mostly lurking
I hope you don't really expect the other empires to like you for attacking them. Either put up with the negative diplo hits or do your best to do a little diplo work to make yourself more popular and your target less so. Things like getting the target to piss off his friends by stopping trading or switching into an unpopular religion using a spy mission, or getting them to like you by giving in to requests for aid and sharing their favorite civics and current releigions.
SamSniped
DJ Goodboye
If you want people to not care, have anyone that you want happy with you share your religion and have the target be of a different religion.
The Wimp
Chieftain
I say don't attack near the beginning of the game, when playing at a reasonable speed. Try to get technologically ahead of the other civilizations before you attack them. Build up alliances during the begining of the game, and then, near 1750-1800 AD, you can wage full out wars, that wouldn't cause you as much harm as it would harm ur opponent
SamSniped
DJ Goodboye
An optimal time to build your army is after getting your UU, too. Get all the techs for the UU, build an army with those and give it good supporting units. Example-if playing as France, use Flanking II Knights or Cuirs with your Musketeers instead of using Siege units to have a highly mobile army (this works on Warlord with enough Knights).
Ghpstage
Deity
Late game the diplo lines are often quite entrenched meaning the -1 diplo hit you get for attcking someones friends often doesn't amount to much, and after you swallow up an empire or two you aren't really going to care about what other civs think about you anyway.
You do want to be aware of any defensive pacts, and if another neighbour dislikes you enough to declare during your war and cause trouble.
Attack when you have an decisive advantage in one or more of tech, numbers, or your planning.
The three of these can really open up in the lategame where you can really ramp up production to dedicate to units (the AI doesn't adjust to this), tech gaps lead to big differences in strength and abilities (Cuirassiers/Cannons/Rifling/Physics/Flight/Fission etc), and the AI really doesn't adapt well to the use of many late game units, in particular air units and nukes.
UUs can help, but timing wars specifically for them is often far from 'optimal'. Numerous UUs such as Musketeers offer too little advantage to justify relying on them, others may be unavailable due to resource requirements, and at times even the best attacking UUs may be marginalised by circumstances.
You do want to be aware of any defensive pacts, and if another neighbour dislikes you enough to declare during your war and cause trouble.
Attack when you have an decisive advantage in one or more of tech, numbers, or your planning.
The three of these can really open up in the lategame where you can really ramp up production to dedicate to units (the AI doesn't adjust to this), tech gaps lead to big differences in strength and abilities (Cuirassiers/Cannons/Rifling/Physics/Flight/Fission etc), and the AI really doesn't adapt well to the use of many late game units, in particular air units and nukes.
In the case of Musketeers you would probably stand to gain more by spending hammers on more Cuirassiers instead! They don't even need seige to smash pre-Rifling civs, if they need any help at all you can take spies.SamSniped said:
UUs can help, but timing wars specifically for them is often far from 'optimal'. Numerous UUs such as Musketeers offer too little advantage to justify relying on them, others may be unavailable due to resource requirements, and at times even the best attacking UUs may be marginalised by circumstances.
God-Emperor
Deity
If the first part is true, then the answer to the question is "frequently".
It really helps to start your diplo process early. If you can get a small tech advantage, chances are you can use a tech like Alphabet to bribe someone to attack someone else. Sow those seeds of AI-AI hatred early. Make sure you form a bloc with 2 or 3 buddy civs and keep them at the throats of the infidels as often as possible. This makes them not care if you conquer the other civs and by the time you swallow up the infidels, your buddies are too small and in your pocket to care.
MeatUnit2
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2010
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- 174
Avoid Strength, Attack Weakness.
The AI seems to follow this concept. It always attacks the weak. Asks you to help attack the weak, even when you are involved in other wars. If you don't join in you are hit with "you didn't help".
I'm not "timid" I'm fighting a war with the biggest empire in the world. The AI doesn't care. It asks then when you refuse it is angry with you. Forever. The only way to change the AI's hate is to destroy that empire. So I do that. But there must be a better way.
AJ11
Emperor
Then say "yes". What are the chances of that weak civ attacking you in retaliation?
Zx Zero Zx
Deity
When you have a good enough stack to take multiple cities while whipping out more units for the rest of the empire.
reddishrecue
Deity
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2009
- Messages
- 6,228
To prevent all the civs from getting mad, attack early when there are less civs around so they wont know you declared war on a friend.
SamSniped
DJ Goodboye
Or get the others to convert to your religion 
Turquoiside
Emperor
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2008
- Messages
- 1,552
I'm starting to realize that the time to attack is 10 or more turns after I think I should attack.
MeatUnit2
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2010
- Messages
- 174
Declaring war, even on a weak empire, often yields a slew of "You declared war on our friend" results among the other empires. I believe refusing to declare war is less harmful (diplomatically) unless you are trying to suck up to the requesting empire (i.e. if requesting empire is powerful and right next door to you).
It seems to me that the diplomacy element in Civ4 is geared to make as many of the other empires hostile to yours as possible.
AJ11
Emperor
There is generally two or more camps that will appear as the game progresses. If declaring war annoys one camp, you just have to let it go and be resigned to the fact that you won't be friends with them. Refusing to declare war will just annoy everyone as every idiot from either side of the war will ask you to join in and throw a tanty when you refuse. You have to pick a side or be hated by everyone.
You can't be Switzerland in Civ4, unfortunately.
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