Why did Scottish secessionists lose the 2014 referendum?
- Thread starter Domen
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Rashiminos
Fool Prophet
More precisely: More "no" votes were counted than "yes" votes.
Alba
Chieftain
Here is a photo from yesterday's rally in Glasgow. People are demanding that Westminster honours the vow and to reiterate that the independence movement is still alive.
What did they want? Are they the type of people who would vote against devolution? I'm intrigued.
What did they want? Are they the type of people who would vote against devolution? I'm intrigued.
Well, I didn't speak to many, given I don't live in Scotland (I do have Scottish friends and relatives though), but not one of them said that they were going to vote No so that they could have 'devolution max'. That wasn't supposed to even be an issue until that ridiculous crawlfest during the weekend before.
Mostly, what I heard from No voters was opposition to the SNP's stardust policies and their promising the moon, particularly in places where they had no power to do so (e.g. the currency union which all three main parties categorically refused) or could not possibly be right (e.g. North Sea fuel estimates, which were far more generous than any other estimate released).
Mostly, what I heard from No voters was opposition to the SNP's stardust policies and their promising the moon, particularly in places where they had no power to do so (e.g. the currency union which all three main parties categorically refused) or could not possibly be right (e.g. North Sea fuel estimates, which were far more generous than any other estimate released).
brennan
Argumentative Brit
Eh? The OP mistakes correlation for causation and neglects the fact that the group it is highlighting is not large enough to cause the effect in the first place.
People just don't believe that Scotland will be better off going its own way.
People just don't believe that Scotland will be better off going its own way.
You mean the 100 spoiled votes? Well, if only that was the margin of failure, rather than, say, 250,000 votes (at a minimum).
Alba
Chieftain
I don't believe they could rig the vote with almost a 10% margin.
Even if they did rig the vote, it would had been minimal and the result would be the same. Then again, even my paper had no identification number. Usually they would stamp it and score your name off the register. When I declared my name the woman just gave me a random paper and didn't score off my name. After I voted, I folded it and noticed that it was blank on the back. Legally those papers would have been dismissed and unregistered as spoiled, if the polling counting officers wished to do so. To top that off, my local constituency had a lower turnout than expected. I asked 7 friends about this, 4 of them that voted SNP in the previous election had blank ballots and 2 of them who had voted Labour had normal ballots. The last one voted SNP but had a normal ballot. I just found it all a bit weird.
But I'd rather we just take defeat as it is; defeat. We will focus on the present and the future. It is only a matter of time now before the Union ends, and it will come sooner than you may think.
Even if they did rig the vote, it would had been minimal and the result would be the same. Then again, even my paper had no identification number. Usually they would stamp it and score your name off the register. When I declared my name the woman just gave me a random paper and didn't score off my name. After I voted, I folded it and noticed that it was blank on the back. Legally those papers would have been dismissed and unregistered as spoiled, if the polling counting officers wished to do so. To top that off, my local constituency had a lower turnout than expected. I asked 7 friends about this, 4 of them that voted SNP in the previous election had blank ballots and 2 of them who had voted Labour had normal ballots. The last one voted SNP but had a normal ballot. I just found it all a bit weird.
But I'd rather we just take defeat as it is; defeat. We will focus on the present and the future. It is only a matter of time now before the Union ends, and it will come sooner than you may think.
Are you insinuating that they gave people who voted SNP blank ballots so they would be dissmissed, and those who voted labour got ones with id numbers? That is very strong, and not exactly easy to do.
Alba
Chieftain
I'm not. Because it could have been a coincidental printing error or something like that. It is up to Police Scotland to decide what to do, as I am not in a position to cry foul. I am accepting the result as it is.
GinandTonic
Saphire w/ Schweps + Lime
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No. You did insinuate.
Still no answer on Salmond wanting criminal charges brought against those who, when asked, told the truth about the banks actions? He told everyone they were scaremongering abount the banks, and when it turns out it was simply a statement of fact he wants criminal charges brought against those who, when asked, told that truth to the people.
There is only one party on the record as wanting the people kept ignorant of the facts around the independence debate.
Alba
Chieftain
I'm not an expert on law, especially when it comes to money markets and the economy.
The fact that Alex Salmond has went to the police, then that must mean he has a case to stand on? Isn't there rules in place that is meant to protect market sensitive information from leaking out to the media?
And what do you mean by only one party in Scotland is being ignorant of fact?
The fact that Alex Salmond has went to the police, then that must mean he has a case to stand on? Isn't there rules in place that is meant to protect market sensitive information from leaking out to the media?
And what do you mean by only one party in Scotland is being ignorant of fact?
GinandTonic
Saphire w/ Schweps + Lime
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Not really. There may be an issue of the Royal Bank of Scotland having stated it's position before it had the final meeting that gave them the technical authority to issue such a statement. As it were your Mrs agrees you will go to a do before actually asking you, but since it was family you didn't actually have any choice it doesn't really have any meaningful impact.
The significant issue is that what the nos were saying was true. The EU law was the EU law. And thus the banks were, as was completely clear years in advance, the banks were going to have to comply. Everyone knew this as a rock solid fact. There was no debate. Salmond claimed it was scaremongering, and every politician and lawyer was wrong. He then sought to keep the fact from the electorate. He is now so cross that people were allowed to know the truth he wants technical charges brought - because if the news had been buried for a couple of days longer that would have been more expedient.
The significant issue is that what the nos were saying was true. The EU law was the EU law. And thus the banks were, as was completely clear years in advance, the banks were going to have to comply. Everyone knew this as a rock solid fact. There was no debate. Salmond claimed it was scaremongering, and every politician and lawyer was wrong. He then sought to keep the fact from the electorate. He is now so cross that people were allowed to know the truth he wants technical charges brought - because if the news had been buried for a couple of days longer that would have been more expedient.
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