Partisan Resistance

Good idea to have partisan resistance instead of city flipping?

  • YES----I think thats great!

    Votes: 17 53.1%
  • Hmmm good concept but needs some revising.

    Votes: 9 28.1%
  • NO----What a stupid idea!

    Votes: 6 18.8%

  • Total voters
    32
  • Poll closed .

Lieutenant Dan

Chieftain
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Messages
5
I think that instead of city flipping Civ 3 should have partisans uprise and revolt. For example...we all know and hate how our newly captured cities revolt and flip back to their original owners. Well instead of just magically flipping I think every time a city is about to flip enemy partisans (like in civ 2) should uprise in the adjacent city squares instead. This would still force you to keep a garrison behind in the occupied territories, to protect your interests...like the city itself and or vital roads and railroads. Kind of like the Germans having to keep many of its divisions in poland and france and etc. to fight the resistance. What do you guys think? Or has this already been suggested. Let me know thnx!
 
Good idea, but the resistance would have to be a lot stronger than it was in civ2 to justify leaving a significant force garrisoning.
 
Yeah, I agree. But it is a great Idea and I like it better than the flipping. I mean, honestly, how are citizens planning on overthrowing an army unless they form resistance movements(partisians)

Welcome to the fora Doc Mahem!
 
It would also do the job of slowing down advancing armour columns, because the partisan tropps would be in the way as they were in Civ2. Better than now....
 
yea, like when your advanceing and your too far from your own citeies so u use the conqureed one to heal them they flip and like 6 unints are gone to one rifleman
 
Yes, and they need to be strong enough to overcome weak garrisons. Perhaps they should ignore the city defensive bonus. After all, they know the streets better than the occupiers.

Also that would create situations like the Vietnam War where the better equiped American troops hunkered down in Saigon, while the Viet Cong controlled the countryside; or the American Revolution where the Continentals retreated into the wilderness, but attacked any stray British units who dared leave the comfort of the town.
 
Zachriel: good idea I think on the defensive bonus. I cut tile bonus to zero in my mod, and that changed the way you can wander into enemy territory a lot, and this partisan stuff might make it even better
 
A poke in the eye with a sharp stick is better than Culture Flipping cities OR borders.

That said, I like your suggestion. In my mod I already turned useless helicopter units into partisans.

Once again, we all see that the BEST ideas came from Civ 2. There was no reason to mess with success by adding crazy new concepts.
 
Originally posted by Zouave
Once again, we all see that the BEST ideas came from Civ 2. There was no reason to mess with success by adding crazy new concepts.

Except that the Partisans in Civ2 didn't work. I never lost a single city to AI Partisans, and only manage to retake one once or twice when the AI took a city by a single Paratrooper. They rarely slowed down my armoured columns in any meaningful way either. And they only figured in late Industrial and Modern times.

For Partisans to work in Civ3 (or in a future Civ4), the concept must be changed somewhat. In particular, it must not be ridiculously easy to kill the Partisans with a couple of tanks. I'd suggest that they are regenerated, Barbarian style, as long as there are unhappy foreign nationals in the city. This obviously would have to be combined with a rules change that prevents you from removing all the citizens from working tiles and thus starving the city, but that needs to be done anyway - why not have starving citizens be unhappy whether they work or not?

We'd also need a succession of Partisan units.
 
Originally posted by The Last Conformist
For Partisans to work in Civ3 (or in a future Civ4), the concept must be changed somewhat. In particular, it must not be ridiculously easy to kill the Partisans with a couple of tanks. . . .

why not have starving citizens be unhappy whether they work or not?

We'd also need a succession of Partisan units.

For instance, partisans could treat all squares as road (they know the back roads); and could be made hidden when in rough terrain, in the sense that you can only see them if you attempt to enter their square. This would allow them to avoid tanks, and to possibly mount an ambush at the risk of its position being revealed. In ancient times, the enemy could use roving horse to scout for partisans. In modern times, the enemy could use fighters to search.

Partisans could gain the advantage of defensive terrain, but might ignore defensive terrain when attacking an enemy unit. This would give them a chance of actually retaking the city, which should still be somewhat rare against any reasonable garrison. Partisans could hide in another Civs territory, relatively safe when the Civs are at peace. Unless they negotiate a RoP, in which case they could enter and wipe out the "terrorists."

Razing should not destroy the city, but should be an attack on the population, mostly attacking foreigners, but also attacking friendlies and improvements -- much like bombardment. The city is destroyed only when all cultural improvements have been destroyed. (When the pop is one, then you miss any attack on pop, as the priests and the remaining villagers are hiding in the temple. You must destroy the temple first.) When starving or razing, each pop could have the chance to become a fleeing worker, a scout/explorer, a partisan, a settler (entire families, 2 pop), unhappy or happy (depending on ethnicity), or dead.
 
I've said it before and I'll say it again, I have no problem with culture flipping. Just call me the anti-Zouave :D

Judging from the content of these posts, partisans sound very complicated, and this game has steered well clear of complication so far. There are many simplified things i would like to see made more detailed before this is addressed.
 
I agree with every thing what The Last Conformist and Zachriel is saying. Partisans need to be a credible nuisance, city flipping sucks not because it is just a nuisance but because its UNREALISTIC! I respectfully disagree with bogote, I really think that the civ III gaming would improve a lot through this change.
 
Lieutenant Dan:
I don't think it's entirely unrealistic, but rather it is just oversimplified. I think the resistance in the game shows it more accurately, as the resistance is not given a presence, ie something you can kill, but just as a concept, which i think is accurate. That's why i think it's good the way it is.

Oversimplified yes, unrealistic no.
 
We-ell, what wrote above was just what feel has to be done assuming that city flipping is to be replaced with Partisans. I'm not entirely happy with the way flipping works now, but it works, which Civ2 Partisans didn't.

The one thing with city flipping as it's now I can't stand is that I can lose an unlimited number of Elite military units to the revolting inhabitants of a size 1 city. I think flipping should only be possible when the city has more population points than units holding it. This'd force you to either leave large garrisons behind, or risk flipping, and would be much of an increase in complexity
 
Currently you have to leave about 2 units for every 1 pop point i think (depending on resistors and cultural difference between your civ and theirs).

Actually it's pretty good. I was neighbours with the Americans, and everyone was at war against the americans. One of their cities was taken by the english (they live a long way away) it was pretty close to their capital, but on my borders. Anyway, it culture flipped. TO ME!!!!1. Even tho it was right next to america, and it still had many american citizens in it, it went to me!

I love Culture Flipping :D
 
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