[RD] War in Gaza: News Thread

[Lexicus]

You are naive. And you forgot the way the Occupy Wall Street protests were crushed. Obama's White House, the FBI and probably other spying services coordinated the repression of that movement. The visibly dirty job was done by local police but the orders and the information came from up above.

I highly doubt that this is meaningfully true (indeed a google search brings up an article by known crank Naomi Wolf,so that bolsters my skepticism). Why would Obama get involved? Occupy wasn't nearly enough of a threat to the system for that.

Administrators of universities and local police don't posess the spying apparatus to know where to go to arrest people, and whom to arrest.

Dude these are people camped out in the middle of well-trafficked college campuses who have been yelling into microphones for weeks. The police don't need any fancy spying or surveillance to figure out who's doing this.

 

[Crezth]

I highly doubt that this is meaningfully true (indeed a google search brings up an article by known crank Naomi Wolf,so that bolsters my skepticism). Why would Obama get involved? Occupy wasn't nearly enough of a threat to the system for that.

This is really embarrassing. The real question is why wouldn’t he get involved? His people would have been yanking his ear trying to get him to shut up the communists. Indeed the movement ultimately petered out but how sure are you really that it petered out on its own? And that your consent for its suppression wasn’t manufactured, so that you could offer this very excuse here? It wasn’t a big threat to the system but it was the only movement to get that far.

And in any case, don’t tell us you don’t think Obama did anything about BLM.

Dude these are people camped out in the middle of well-trafficked college campuses who have been yelling into microphones for weeks. The police don't need any fancy spying or surveillance to figure out who's doing this.

I don’t think you actually understand what surveillance of counterterrorism operations is or how it works if you say this. Yeah in theory the organizers are “right there” in “the middle” of everything. But they don’t really believe that and they like to target the head honchos. That’s why BLM organizers have been disappearing into black sites for the last ten god damn years.

 

[Lexicus]

And that your consent for its suppression wasn’t manufactured

My "consent for its suppression"?? Whether I support the police breaking up the encampment surely would seem to be a separate question from whether I believe that effort was coordinated by the White House?

 

[Crezth]

I’m vicariously insulted by your blithe approval for the capitalist’s brutal suppression of your country folk. The fact you can just sit there and praise the police as a local institution and deride activism as pointless and doomed anyway, sealing the fate of the courageous fighting people who really only need standard cowards to stand up for them, is disgusting and shameful and you bring dishonor on our people.

 

[Crezth]

You consent to it, yes. A manufactured consent born out of despair and self-pity. Occupy Wall Street failed so who cares. BLM collapsed under its own weight. Of course! The only movement that gets anywhere is the one that storms the White House and somehow has friends in every police department in the country? How can you really believe that?

 

[lymond]

Moderator Action: Back to news please - lymond

 

[Lexicus]

praise the police as a local institution

...you interpreted that as praise? The misinterpretations and strawmen just get worse from there.

You consent to it, yes. A manufactured consent born out of despair and self-pity. Occupy Wall Street failed so who cares. BLM collapsed under its own weight. Of course! The only movement that gets anywhere is the one that storms the White House and somehow has friends in every police department in the country? How can you really believe that?

Short answer is, I don't, but I wouldn't want to get in the way of you having an awesome conversation with yourself, so pop off.

In Gaza-related news, meanwhile, there is now a bipartisan proposal in the US Congress to put Zionist commissars on college campuses:

Torres announces COLUMBIA Act to create ‘antisemitism monitor’ for select colleges and universities

Rep. Ritchie Torres (D-N.Y.) announced on Friday that he plans to introduce a bill that would allow the Department of Education to impose a “third-party antisemitism monitor” for any institution of higher education that receives federal funding. Torres coined the legislation the College...

www.columbiaspectator.com

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

In Gaza-related news, meanwhile, there is now a bipartisan proposal in the US Congress to put Zionist commissars on college campuses:

The Zionists and other friends and admirers have completely lost the plot. Of course the perfect way to deal with people upset about mass deaths and devastation is to tell them they're antisemitic and pro-Hamas. At some point these terms'll become meaningless (if they aren't so now) and people'll just default to saying 'so what'?

 

[Crezth]

...you interpreted that as praise? The misinterpretations and strawmen just get worse from there.

Have you never been to a protest action in your entire life? You literally don’t know what the federales are for. Anyway back to news. Commissars, as if that’s even necessary.

 

[Estebonrober]

the IDF was using the civilians killed on Oct.7 as human shields? I don't get what you're saying

anyway, the Gaza pier is already getting attacked, but no one claimed responsibility yet
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...lights-threats-to-us-pier-mission/ar-AA1nJ4lO

Israeli forces preparing for the U.S. military's pier to be built off Gaza's coast came under mortar fire this week, highlighting the threat posed to everyone involved in the plan to provide aid by sea.
On Monday, a "small number of mortars landed in the vicinity of the marshaling yard area" on the coast, according to Pentagon spokesman Maj. Gen. Patrick Ryder. U.S. forces who construct the pier and causeway will not be in Gaza. They will stay in the Mediterranean Sea and would not have been in the location where the mortars hit.
...
No militant group took responsibility for the mortar fire at the port site, and there were no casualties, though there were United Nations officials who had to scramble for shelter. A Hamas official seemingly threatened any outside military forces in a recent interview with the Associated Press.

Yes. The IDF moved a lot of security forces off the Gaza Border over the years, to automated systems and to reinforce the West Bank settlers... So yea, they are at least as guilty as Hamas of using civilians as human shields... I think the entire premise is dumb in the first place, so the real point was to mock the nonsense claim of Hamas using civilians as shields.

You live in the real world? There are civilians nearby. If China nuked Fort Bragg, I would not claim the US was using the city of Fayetteville NC as human shields... Its dumb.

 

[Estebonrober]

You are naive. And you forgot the way the Occupy Wall Street protests were crushed. Obama's White House, the FBI and probably other spying services coordinated the repression of that movement. The visibly dirty job was done by local police but the orders and the information came from up above.

The repression of this one is obviously also being coordinated. Administrators of universities and local police don't posess the spying apparatus to know where to go to arrest people, and whom to arrest. Yet they're showing up at those places, and have their targets pre-defined. You country does have a "deep state". It's doing its thing, as it does frequently.

I'm not sure how strongly the linked story supports your argument, but it was a compelling story nonetheless. thanks

 

[Estebonrober]

Pro-Israel Agitator Shouts ‘Kill the Jews,’ Gets Everyone Else Arrested

Around 100 protesters were arrested on Saturday at a pro-Palestine encampment at Northeastern University, but not the one whose hate speech got everything shut down.

www.thedailybeast.com

More and more agitator and false flag behavior being found all the time, now this excellent example... The fascist playbook never really changes, does it?

 

[pigswill]

No surprise that the US of A is trying to suppress protests against Israel's conduct of its offensive in Gaza. I wonder if they're going to trot out the argument that criticising the Israeli government is racist. One potential flaw in that argument is that there is widespread condemnation of the Holocaust (which I do happen to share). However the Holocaust was the policy of the German government of the time and if you're saying that criticising the policy of a government is racist then by the same token you're saying that criticism of the Holocaust is racist against the German people.

 

[Estebonrober]

No surprise that the US of A is trying to suppress protests against Israel's conduct of its offensive in Gaza. I wonder if they're going to trot out the argument that criticising the Israeli government is racist. One potential flaw in that argument is that there is widespread condemnation of the Holocaust (which I do happen to share). However the Holocaust was the policy of the German government of the time and if you're saying that criticising the policy of a government is racist then by the same token you're saying that criticism of the Holocaust is racist against the German people.

Yea I'm not looking for any sort of logical consistency with any of this, but I am ashamed that the "beacon of the Free World" is so willing to smash free speech in the name of USA Inc.'s stock returns...

god money. Nothing makes money like men's blood. We (humanity) have to stop, and the US has long been a population not interested in this type of warfare for these types of reasons...

 

[damunzy]

If China nuked Fort Bragg

I'd be seriously impressed because they went back in time.
The US Army renamed it Fort Liberty in 2023.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/02/politics/fort-bragg-liberty-renamed-base-us-army/index.html

"The change follows a branch-wide push to rename bases that bear the name of Confederate leaders. It is currently named after Gen. Braxton Bragg, an unpopular Confederate general who garnered a lot of criticism for his hot temper, combative personality and often subpar performance on the field."

DeSantis and Pence weren't happy about it.

https://www.npr.org/2023/06/26/1184268004/presidential-campaign-talking-point-fort-braggs-name-change

RON DESANTIS: And I also look forward to, as president, restoring the name of Fort Bragg to our great military base in Fayetteville, N.C.
MIKE PENCE: We will end the political correctness in the hallways of the Pentagon, and North Carolina will once again be home to Fort Bragg.

Just an FYI. I was stationed at FT Bragg so it is near and dead to my heart - but even so, I am glad that it was renamed. And by near and dear to my heart, I mean I enlisted back when I was propagandized into thinking that I was a good American and that's how I "protected and served" my country.

 

[innonimatu]

Yea I'm not looking for any sort of logical consistency with any of this, but I am ashamed that the "beacon of the Free World" is so willing to smash free speech in the name of USA Inc.'s stock returns...

god money. Nothing makes money like men's blood. We (humanity) have to stop, and the US has long been a population not interested in this type of warfare for these types of reasons...

The lone anti-war presidential candidate was arrested for the crime of being present at a site with protesting students?

About the most notorious university, that set the example to be followed in all others, the web of financial interests in the continuation of the genocide is being denounced by its own faculty. I take Tooze as a good weather-vane of how things are gong. They are not going well for the zionist-military interests.

Emblazoned with a stirring quote from Charles A Beard, the diagram seeks to capture the flow of power in the institution where I have worked since 2015. One of the interesting effects of the diagram is to contextualize some of the figures - notably President Shafik - who have become so central to reportage. Instead, the student analysts seek to focus our attention on corporate power structures and flows of capital and control that spread out beyond the University.
What the flier makes clear is that at least for a substantial part of the protest, the issue at stake is political economy in the full sense of the word. What they seek to highlight is the way that a powerful educational institution like Columbia is embedded in networks of power and influence, which range from global high-finance, to the military-industrial complex, “Zionist cultural organizations” and local real estate development in Manhattan and specifically Harlem, our immediate neighbor.

 

[Estebonrober]

The lone anti-war presidential candidate was arrested for the crime of being present at a site with protesting students?

About the most notorious university, that set the example to be followed in all others, the web of financial interests in the continuation of the genocide is being denounced by its own faculty. I take Tooze as a good weather-vane of how things are gong. They are not going well for the zionist-military interests.

thats a great link, thanks again!

 

[Broken_Erika]

Ohio State University says it legally can't divest from Israel - here's the law behind that​

After a series of protests calling for Ohio State University to divest from Israel — which led to more than three dozen arrests this week — Ohio State University spokesperson Ben Johnson released a short statement Thursday night.

"Ohio Revised Code Section 9.76 prohibits the university from divesting any interests in Israel and prohibits adopting or adhering to a policy that requires divestment from Israel or with persons or entities associated with it," Johnson said in the statement.

Here's what you need to know about OSU's legal ability to divest:

What the law says about Ohio State divestment from Israel​

Johnson is referring to Ohio Revised Code (ORC) Section 9.76 — which was signed into law by then-Gov. John Kasich in 2016 and later amended in 2022 — which prohibits state agencies like universities from contracting with companies that are boycotting or disinvesting from Israel.

While this section of the law doesn't explicitly state that universities are prohibited from divesting from Israel, Ohio Attorney General's Office spokesperson Bethany McCorkle said the law has that effect anyway.

"The university cannot do itself what it is prohibited from doing through others. Allowing a wholesale boycott and divestiture by a university would circumvent the law and render it meaningless," she said.

The sponsor of the 2022 revision to ORC 9.76 that explicitly includes public universities as state agencies, Republican State Sen. Jerry Cirino, also said that section of the law prevents schools from divesting.

"The general intent is to make sure that we are accommodating to our allies and friends, strategically certainly, and we don't want things that are coming up today with these requests on our campuses that students are making, they may or may not be students, but protesters are asking for our universities to not do business with Israeli companies or companies in any way associated with Israel or those that are friendly to Israel. We just don't want to have that," Cirino said.

ORC 9.76, which received overwhelming bipartisan support in the Ohio legislature, has not been challenged in court.

While no Ohio universities have divested from Israel, they have divested or attempted to divest from other nations in the past.

Related Gaza protest article:Why are college students protesting? Ohio State, Miami University join Gaza protests

During apartheid, Ohio University divested $60,000 of its investments from South Africa in 1977, according to a 1982 report from the American Committee on Africa.

In 1978, Miami University's board of trustees voted to divest from corporations that do business in South Africa before reversing their decision after the state Attorney General warned them their action may violate state law, according to a June 1978 New York Times article.

There is no federal law prohibiting universities from divesting from Israel, although some have been proposed.

What is divestment?​

Divestment is the act of withdrawing investments in Israel, Israel-affiliated companies and other organizations that support Israel, according to the Boycott, Divestment, Sanctions website.

Divestment is one third of the Boycott, Divestment, Sanctions (BDS) movement that calls for boycotting Israeli companies and international companies that support Israel, disinvesting from similar organizations, and for governments to issue economic sanctions on Israel.

Ohio is one of 38 states that have similar anti-BDS laws on the books, according to the Jewish Virtual Library.

The main target of OSU Divest, one of the groups spearheading this week's protests, is OSU's Office of Investments, which handles the school's endowments.

The OSU Office of Investments manages a long-term investment pool made up of endowments — which are donor gifts to the school — and university funds to "protect the financial health of the university and Wexner Medical Center," according to its website.

The office's investment strategy for these funds is "designed to produce steady growth over the long term while mitigating downside risk," according to its website.

More on Ohio State student protests:Ohio State faculty adviser: Student protest arrests show start of 'A wave of repression'

OSU Divest wants Ohio State's investment office to divest its investments in Israeli companies or companies that support Israel, according to its website.

In an email to OSU student newspaper The Lantern in March, OSU spokesperson Chris Booker clarified the role of the Office of Investments.

"Ohio State utilizes a diversified investment strategy to grow the resources available to support our academic mission, such as student scholarships, faculty positions and educational resources," Booker said.

"The university follows all applicable laws regarding investments, including state laws specifically addressing this issue. Ohio State's endowment is not funded with tuition or fees."
https://www.dispatch.com/story/news...-protests-hamas-war-osu-students/73466833007/

 

[Lexicus]

ORC 9.76

Wow, Ohio state laws are referred to as ORC? You couldn't make that up

 

[Klaus Hergersheimer]

What is divestment?​

Divestment is the act of withdrawing investments in Israel, Israel-affiliated companies and other organizations that support Israel, according to the Boycott, Divestment, Sanctions website.

They'd probably have more of my sympathy if their objective wasn't the complete isolation of Israel as a nation. But I doubt very much the BDS membership sees much distinction between governmental and civil society there.