Éa, The Ageless and the Divine (phase 2, alpha)

[ls612]

I definitely want to add dungeons and things like that (similar to FFH). We don't need an adventurer class. Any GP could go explore a dungeon in theory, but you would want to use classes that can deal with the baddies that appear. Either a Warrior or spellcaster of some sort. (Think of Warriors more like Conan in the original books. He was sometimes a lone adventurer, sometimes general, sometimes king.)

Dungeons could be special features (Natural Wonders?) which can be explored with an EaAction to give goodies (or spawn monsters).

 

[BrokenSky]

Hmm.. yeah that makes sense. Maybe then have some subclasses of warrior, or at least promotions be more personal combat oriented than leadership orientated. Not sure what would be an explorer then... merchant perhaps?

 

[Pazyryk]

Most likely give goodies AND spawn monsters. Which is why you want a class that can deal with them.

It's easy to do. We just need a dungeon graphic (improvement). Some more monsters (besides the ones that spawn now) would also be nice.

 

[Killzerslaul]

I always found FFH2's dungeons a bit lacking. maybe it could be made more interesting if there was a bit of background text and a choice, like the random events where you got a little narrative and have a list of options that can have both obvious and hidden consequences. possibly even a small event sequence which would allow you to briefly follow the hero's adventure and make the right decisions to maximise safety or profit.

 

[Pazyryk]

Dungeons certainly won't be there for phase 3 release. But after that, anything is possible.

I'm open to different ideas. Someone has to write text if that is an integral part of it. The other consideration is whether these are just "goody huts for GPs", or if there is something more to them. (Or for that matter, if we still need "goody huts" after dungeons are added.) We don't want anything too complicated. The focus of the mod should stay on developing the character of your civ (though an "adventuring civ" that sends its Warriors and Wizards off to dungeon crawl is certainly a civ flavor).

I haven't set down any hard plans here. But my basic idea is that they could act somewhat like encampments, as a spawning plot for various dungeon dwelling monsters. An army can kill the guardian on top of the dungeon, but only a GP can "clear" it. (This could be permanent or for some number of turns.) Clearing a dungeon has somewhat unpredictable risk versus reward. There would be some typical range of gold haul (from somewhat disappointing to very nice) and monster spawning. But every once and a while you get some scary boss monster or some nice artifact, like a magic sword, a spell scroll, etc.

 

[Pazyryk]

From the Sword and Sorcery Manual, Classes and Subclasses...

Thaumaturges learn and cast arcane spells. Only Thaumaturges can take promotion levels in the eight schools of magic -- Divination, Abjuration, Evocation, Transmutation, Conjuration, Necromancy, Enchantment and Illusion -- thereby boosting power, range or other aspects of spells in each of these schools. Any Thaumaturge can advance in any of the eight schools by selecting promotion levels at level advancement, but most gain additional power in these schools based on subclass as indicated below. As civilization leader, a Thaumaturge's Leadership Modifier is applied as a mana percent boost to all cities. As city resident, this modifier is applied only to a particular city. Adept specialists and buildings with Adept slots increase the likelihood of Thaumaturge appearance. All Thaumaturges belong to a subclass below:

• Witches [Thaumaturge] are arcane spellcasters that appear in civilizations that have not learned any of the techs that enable other subclasses listed below. Witches have immediate special access to a set of "witchcraft" spells that they can learn without knowing the spell's prereq tech and without adopting the Witchcraft policy. (Other subclasses can learn these if they know the tech prereq or have adopted the Witchcraft policy.) Witchcraft spells include Hex, Scrying, Slow, Death Stay and a few others that fall in all eight magic schools. Witches gain +0.25 Mod per level in Divination and Enchantment and +0.1 Mod per level in all other schools. Note that "Warlock" is an alternate name for this subclass sometimes used by males.
• Wizards [Thaumaturge] are arcane spellcasters that appear in civilizations that have learned Thaumaturgy but not Sorcery or Necromancy. Wizards gain +0.2 Mod per level in all magic schools except Necromancy and Illusion.
• Sorcerers [Thaumaturge] are arcane spellcasters that appear in civilizations that have learned Sorcery. Sorcerers gain +0.2 Mod per level in all magic schools except Abjuration and Enchantment. Note that the word "Sorcerer" is often used to indicate any spellcaster that consumes mana (in other words, any spellcaster in a Fallen civilization). Likewise, "Sorcery" describes any form of magic that consumes mana. Yes, it's all a bit complicated, but you're used to that if you've gotten this far...
• Necromancers [Thaumaturge] are arcane spellcasters that appear in civilizations that have learned Necromancy (a player with both Sorcery and Necromancy can choose either of the two subclasses). Necromancers gain +0.5 Mod per level in Necromancy.
• Illusionists [Thaumaturge] are arcane spellcasters that appear in civilizations that have learned Illusion and are more advanced in this branch (Illusion, Greater Illusion, Phantasmagoria) than in any other arcane techs. Illusionists gain +0.5 Mod per level in Illusion and start with -2 Mod in all other schools.
• See also Druids and Fallen Priests [dual-class Devout/Thaumaturges] above.

Remember that:

total mod = 5 + (level / 3) + promotion bonuses + other bonuses, rounded down

So all spellcasters are advancing in everything as they level up, but magic school promotions (selected) and subclass bonuses together drive specialization.

Edit 2: I changed things a bit so any Thaumaturge can learn the ~8 witchcraft spells if they have adopted the Witchcraft policy. Witches still have a special ability in that they can learn these spells even without that policy. And I bumpted up there Mod progression a little.

 

[Webrider]

Dungeons could work like they did the underground if Faerun (sp) teleport to a different section of map. You could make several that way.

 

[BrokenSky]

The thaumaturge subclasses sound good, though I would prefer it if witches remain available to civs which have the witchcraft poicy even if they have techs to unlock otheer subclasses, or else let the other subclasses unlock a "witch" promotion from witchcraft which lets them learn witch spells? Possibly at some drawback, but really I think having to use up a promotion with no immediate benefit is probably drawback enough?

Dungeon-wise, could it be possible for certain barbarians (e.g. barbarian mages) to make towers, which once beaten can be cleared as a special dungeon, giving magic-themed rewards?

 

[Pazyryk]

The main point of the Witch subclass (and witchcraft spells) is access to arcane magic without dedicating any research in this area. It's partly just flavor for your "primitive magic civilization". But it is also a good strategic alternative since it allows you to research elsewhere.

Still, I think I like your suggestion of opening up these few (maybe 8) spells to anyone who has the Witchcraft policy. Keep in mind that these 8 spells are not super powerful. But they are spread out in the tech tree in such a way that it is hard to get many of them. So opening them to all subclasses would make this policy really matter. There is the cost that you have to open the Arcana branch and adopt Witchcraft.

Probably the most valuable of the witchcraft spells (at least for non-Sidhe) is Death Stay, which doesn't prevent aging but it does hold off death from it for a while. I had its prereq tech as Invocation. But now I'm going to move it to Necromancy where it belongs. Since it's witchcraft, any Thaumaturge can bypass the tech prereq and learn it if they have the Witchcraft policy.

My initial post had Witches as quite inferior in magic school progression (Divination and Enchantment are fine but will never be uber-powerful schools). Since I'm giving their special ability to all Thaumaturges, I'll bump them up in school progression so they are only a little bit inferior.

If you like witches, then play The Graeae:

Spoiler :

 

[Pazyryk]

Updated my GitHub repository. Everything is there to compile a functioning phase III build, if you know what you're doing. (No, that does not mean phase III is ready yet. Just that it's running.)

 

[ls612]

I have sent a pull request for the Natural Wonder Discovery Happiness changes. However, there is a small problem. The function to get NW happiness is not exposed to lua, and can not be exposed, because it is only defined when a #define in EaModding.h is enabled. If I attempt to forward the method to lua (for the UI) the game will crash when the #define in EaModding.h is disabled. For now the UI simply adds the happiness to 'Difficulty level' on the hover-over.

Progress is coming along OK so far with Lua events, there have been a couple issues I have experienced so far, but those should be fixable soon. I have undefined them for now.

 

[whoward69]

If I attempt to forward the method to lua (for the UI) the game will crash then the #define in EaModding.h is disabled.

You can test for the existence of the method, note the lack of brackets on the use of someMethodThatMayNotBePresent in the condition

if (pCity.someMethodThatMayNotBePresent) then
  local value = pCity.someMethodThatMayNotBePresent()
end

 

[ls612]

You can test for the existence of the method, note the lack of brackets on the use of someMethodThatMayNotBePresent in the condition

if (pCity.someMethodThatMayNotBePresent) then
  local value = pCity.someMethodThatMayNotBePresent()
end

Thanks, I knew that worked in C++, but I didn't know that it worked with Lua as well.

 

[Pazyryk]

@ls612,

In general, let me handle the Lua side when we are doing a "New-dll-functionality-to-replace-existing-Lua-kludge" kind of change. You don't even want to try to figure out some of these kludges, and they are often very tangled up with UI.


I always get a bit of satisfaction finding an error by whoward69. Should be:
pCity:someMethodThatMayNotBePresent

 

[Pazyryk]

New "Developer's Thread" here. Everyone is welcome to follow along. But I want to keep that thread focused on what we need for Phase 3 release or soon after, with posts by contributors or potential contributors.

Crazy ideas should stay in this thread.

 

[whoward69]

I always get a bit of satisfaction finding an error by whoward69. Should be:
pCity:someMethodThatMayNotBePresent

Looks like I omitted

local pCity = Game

 

[Tuvok99]

Is there a time schedule for publishing a first version of P3?

 

[Pazyryk]

Ask and you shall receive...

Éa III Sword & Sorcery initial release date: April 13th.

All the usual caveats. The mod content has more than doubled in every way: number of civs, techs, spells, etc., and things we didn't have before like victory conditions. So we will have to go through some versions to work out the kinks.

 

[BrokenSky]

Really Can't wait!

It looks like it will be really good!

edit: For reasons regarding my access to the internet on and after the 13th of April,

how big, approximately is the mod going to be, file-size wise?

 

[Pazyryk]

how big, approximately is the mod going to be, file-size wise?

The non-media mod is not much bigger than before.

The required Media Pack is currently just under 1 Gb and may grow a bit. I know folks have had problems with the single file at ge.tt. What I think I'll do for release is open up an alternative download from MediaFire where it is broken up into 6 or 7 separate files (the free account with them has 200 Mb max file size). So you can pick whichever download works easier for you.