1.9 Beta Feedback

Idea: At the moment culture can only extend to tiles that are potentially workable by a city.
?
Not sure what you're talking about. If I have a single city and enough culture, its culture radius will end up extending 6 or 7 tiles in every direction.
There is no requirement that the tiles be within the BFC of a city.

This is determined by the cultural boundaries (eg amount of culture needed to reach fledgling, developing, refined, etc.). We messed with those a while ago to add more culture boundaries than vanilla. I forget offhand which XML file they're in.
 
Its Civ4CultureLevelsInfo.
We have:
None, fledgling, developing, influential, refined, dominant, legendary.

So a legendary culture city will have 7 radius culture.

This is the main benefit of culture; it extends your territory out into the desert, letting you get more spice.
 
They shouldn't expand across ocean though, with the only exception the tiles that are workable by the city.
If normal people can simply walk through that ocean/dessert terrain then culture should also expand there, otherwise it would make more sense to leave it as it is.
 
If I have a single city and enough culture, its culture radius will end up extending 6 or 7 tiles in every direction.

Not across ocean tiles it won't. In vanilla and Dune Wars at present the cultural border will never go more than 2-tiles into ocean (desert) plots. In other words, culture only extends to tiles potentially workable by a city. In the screenshot above you can see it extending more than that, 3+ tiles into the ocean (desert). See this screenshot of RogerBacon's Borders Over Ocean modcomp.
 
Ah, I understand now. Yes, I would make this change.
I had assumed this was how it already worked. I hadn't noticed it wasn't, because most tiles are within 2 tiles of *some* land, somewhere.

Very surprised I'd never noticed this.

There is no need for an artificial restriction, culture should extend freely in all directions. If we need to change the culture boundaries again (higher thresholds, and/or fewer thresholds) after playtest to reduce spice income, we can do this.

*edit*
Actually, this might be a really helpful way of keeping spice economy competitive with Paradise in the late game.

*edit2*
Idea: since we have the Convention breached mechanic, maybe we should remove the anti-nuclear Landsraad vote?
Otherwise no-one is ever going to get any atomics unless they defy the Landsraad all game.
 
I'm getting a consistent CTD at the end of turn at this save. Playing at 1.9 patch 3
 

Attachments

  • db0 AG-10587.CivBeyondSwordSave
    625.6 KB · Views: 150
I'm getting a consistent CTD at the end of turn at this save. Playing at 1.9 patch 3

It's highly likely this is the stranded settler bug reported by three others and fixed in patch 4. Based on a quick read of the changelog, I believe that a patch 3 game should come up and play OK in patch 4.
 
I had a game started patch 3 that seems to work fine under patch 4.

*edit*
I would bring the Chamber of visions and guild research faciltily down to +2 espionage/beakers per spice. Even that can get pretty high, with boosters. I have 44 spice in my current game.

*edit2*
The AI doesn't seem to be able to chop rock outcrops (especially polar rock outcrops).
I wonder if this is something to do with having to chop it first before building another improvement, whereas the AI normally when chopping forests doesn't separately chop the forest, it just builds the desired improvement, which adds the chop time to the improvement construction and does both at once.

I wonder if there is a way to make the outcrop functionality more precisely the same as forests? So you (and the AI) could for example still issue a "build solar farm" command while on a land tile with an outcrop?
 
Ah, I understand now. Yes, I would make this change.
I had assumed this was how it already worked. I hadn't noticed it wasn't, because most tiles are within 2 tiles of *some* land, somewhere.

OK, I'll do it. It should boost spice income in the later game as you say.

davidlallen said:
It's highly likely this is the stranded settler bug reported by three others and fixed in patch 4. Based on a quick read of the changelog, I believe that a patch 3 game should come up and play OK in patch 4.

Confirmed. I tested db0's savegame with patch 4 and it works fine.

Ahriman said:
I wonder if there is a way to make the outcrop functionality more precisely the same as forests? So you (and the AI) could for example still issue a "build solar farm" command while on a land tile with an outcrop?

Yes, this can be done in the XML so it's easy. Just need to add the FeatureStructs list from BUILD_REMOVE_OUTCROP to all improvement builds.

Edit: It was slightly more XML - I had to remove the bNoImprovement restriction from Outcrops. It works fine now though - see screenshots:

Spoiler :


 

Attachments

  • Civ4ScreenShot0005.JPG
    Civ4ScreenShot0005.JPG
    132.6 KB · Views: 340
  • Civ4ScreenShot0006.JPG
    Civ4ScreenShot0006.JPG
    125.2 KB · Views: 377
Idea: At the moment culture can only extend to tiles that are potentially workable by a city. If we take this restriction off, then cultural borders will extend out across the desert as shown so that more spice can be harvested. What do you think?
I like it! (just envision me as Weyoun talking about the Cardassian orbital defense platforms initially defending the Chin'toka system)
 
Is it just me or is Face dancers' "Poison water" so much poorer an ability than "Foster unhappiness"? I take into account there is not really a surplus of happiness for most of the time, though extra health is still easy achievable (Deliverator pronounced it will be changed).
Let's take an example: city with Pop 8, all the producing fields are down, all the water (-16 or -20!), hammers, solaris... diminishing pop follows very quickly. With poison water (-15 MAX), it is only a good chance of loosing one citizen, with all face dancers' bonuses - maybe two, production unaffected. First effect lasts for 8 turns, the second - 5 turns (or more with bonuses?).
Now, with a, say, 16 pop city, unhappiness still halves the city production, and poison does what? with a water tank so full at this level, there is a thin chace of causing anything but a stagnancy of growth! Big deal, horrible Tleilaxu plagues! The price of both missions is just the same, so posioning is an option for hard-core role-players only?

I would suggest doubling the severity of all the posioning and still maybe it shouldn't wear off gradually? Increased cost may be necessary, though making "unhappiness" more expensive seems more like it.. Why to destroy production if you can just slow it so much for so many turns? (gov will preserve water as a priority).
 
@Kwis: I can tell you are not playing the 1.9 Beta version because the Facedancers missions have been changed to these:



The Poisoner promotions do not exist anymore - the Facedancers get Instigation I,II and III instead. You should try out 1.9 Beta I with Patch 4 and let us know what you think of the reworked espionage.
 

Attachments

  • facedancer_missions.jpg
    facedancer_missions.jpg
    16.4 KB · Views: 359
Sorry for that.. I will certainly do as soon as I have time. And good it is resolved, although I liked the previous idea.
 
Mediafire's site is down. So of course the link to the patch does not work.

It does go down from time to time. It seems to be back now though.
 
I still haven't really observed the AI using espionage missions against me yet, except for counter-espionage.
I wonder if espionage costs need to be reduced further (or provide more espionage boosters in the early game), and/or the counter-espionage mission needs to be removed, or if we need to re-examine how espionage mission AI choices work.

Will keep testing, but feedback from others would be very helpful on this point.
 
I still haven't really observed the AI using espionage missions against me yet, except for counter-espionage.
I wonder if espionage costs need to be reduced further (or provide more espionage boosters in the early game), and/or the counter-espionage mission needs to be removed, or if we need to re-examine how espionage mission AI choices work.

Will keep testing, but feedback from others would be very helpful on this point.

I'have got some harvesters that have been destroyed by an infiltrator (seems to come from Ordos House, that was at war against me)
 
Top Bottom