[RD] Ask a trans person II: 2 trans 2 sexual

[Aiken_Drumn]

@schlaufuchs I am a little lost, you spent considerable time to answer an older comment, and avoided the additional newer context? Is not a discussion to react? I asked a question, appreciated the answers, but realised without the additional context the answers didn't really answer my question. It was not about debate or scoring points. I asked a question without it being personal, but got direct hostile response. That changes the discussion into a debate as I was required to defend myself.


The reality is, from both sides of the isle, physical attributes matter. Height, weight.. length.. are all things that can and have been asked. You state these are creepy and misogynistic questions, but they are relevant and experienced by both sides. It seems very disingenuous to park this problem on one gender.

Moderator Action: This is not a debate thread. Please restrict yourself to asking questions and remembering that not all questions may be followed-up.

 

[NinjaCow64]

How would you feel about someone who said "I am attracted to women, except when they are fat/old/ginger"?

Every man I have met who openly talks about what kinds of women they are attracted to and lists race, hair colour ect as things that make a women unattractive of has been a misogynistic creep.

All three statements are misogynistic, additionally "...except when they are fat" is fatphobic and "except when they are old" is ageist (and to be clear people who say "I am not attracted to old women" are usually creeps like Leonardo diCaprio who infamously won't date anyone older than 25, despite being nearly 50).

I get that people have preferences. And I'm not proposing that people be forced to date someone they don't find attractive. But to outright state "I will never find any woman who is fat, ginger, over the age of 25 or trans" is like...wow. Why not actually see what they look like before arbitrarily writing them off as unattractive?

 

[Samson]

Every man I have met who openly talks about what kinds of women they are attracted to and lists race, hair colour ect as things that make a women unattractive of has been a misogynistic creep.

All three statements are misogynistic, additionally "...except when they are fat" is fatphobic and "except when they are old" is ageist (and to be clear people who say "I am not attracted to old women" are usually creeps like Leonardo diCaprio who infamously won't date anyone older than 25, despite being nearly 50).

I get that people have preferences. And I'm not proposing that people be forced to date someone they don't find attractive. But to outright state "I will never find any woman who is fat, ginger, over the age of 25 or trans" is like...wow. Why not actually see what they look like before arbitrarily writing them off as unattractive?

I am generally with you in that to write off people because of these external features is a bad way to go about dating, but it seems inherently different and more morally acceptable than doing that in any other context.

With regards age, most dating apps have an age range option for a reason and I would suggest it is usually "someone close to my age" rather than Leonardo diCaprio style. It may not be expressed in quite that way, but the effect is the same. If using such a feature is inherently ageist one has to ask if being ageist is wrong.

 

[NinjaCow64]

The reality is, from both sides of the isle, physical attributes matter. Height, weight.. length.. are all things that can and have been asked. You state these are creepy and misogynistic questions, but they are relevant and experienced by both sides. It seems very disingenuous to park this problem on one gender.

lmao come on man. Asking about height and weight are extremely creepy and misogynistic questions. Asking about how long a trans woman's you-know-what is extremely creepy and transmisogynistic. Its not relevant, I can't imagine a positive response if you asked these questions in real life or on Tinder.

Have you seriously asked these questions to women on Tinder? Or in real life?

And yes a woman asking a man these questions is creepy as well but it isn't nearly as horrifying as a man asking a woman these same questions for what should be obvious reasons.

I know that if a woman started randomly inquiring about the size of your you-know-what on Tinder or even worse in real life you would be creeped out.

 

[NinjaCow64]

I am generally with you in that to write off people because of these external features is a bad way to go about dating, but it seems inherently different and more morally acceptable than doing that in any other context.

It does seem to be considered morally okay by society. I don't think it should be. But eh, what am I gonna do about it? There are more important things to worry about.

With regards age, most dating apps have an age range option for a reason and I would suggest it is usually "someone close to my age" rather than Leonardo diCaprio style. It may not be expressed in quite that way, but the effect is the same. If using such a feature is inherently ageist one has to ask if being ageist is wrong.

Saying "I don't find old women attractive" is very different to saying "I only want to date women close to my age".

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

lmao come on man. Asking about height and weight are extremely creepy and misogynistic questions. Asking about how long a trans woman's you-know-what is extremely creepy and transmisogynistic. Its not relevant, I can't imagine a positive response if you asked these questions in real life or on Tinder.

Have you seriously asked these questions to women on Tinder? Or in real life?

And yes a woman asking a man these questions is creepy as well but it isn't nearly as horrifying as a man asking a woman these same questions for what should be obvious reasons.

I know that if a woman started randomly inquiring about the size of your you-know-what on Tinder or even worse in real life you would be creeped out.

I was referring to women asking those questions of me, not me asking them.

 

[Samson]

It does seem to be considered morally okay by society. I don't think it should be. But eh, what am I gonna do about it? There are more important things to worry about.

Fair enough.

Saying "I don't find old women attractive" is very different to saying "I only want to date women close to my age".

It seems pretty similar in practice to me, except the later includes a lower cut off.

 

[NinjaCow64]

It seems pretty similar in practice to me, except the later includes a lower cut off.

It is possible to find someone attractive without wanting to date them.

 

[NinjaCow64]

I was referring to women asking those questions of me, not me asking them.

Okay, so?

When women asked you those questions did you think "Oh boy I am so glad that they asked this question" or were you creeped out?

And if they are such relevant questions then why haven't you ever asked them?

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: This thread is for questions to the LGBTQ community. Please do not stray into other areas not related. Thanks.

 

[Manfred Belheim]

quite another to ask invasive, dehumanizing questions about a person's (especially a woman's) body

Why especially a woman's?

I am in agreement that asking invasive, personal questions about a person's body is not, in general, a good thing to do, but I am genuinely curious about what thought is behind the qualifier, because to me it doesn't become a better or worse thing to ask dependent on gender.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: One can also ask questions to specific people via pms. No one is required to answer everything publicly or at all, and you may or may not get better results privately.

 

[dragonprobably]

What would you say is the best depiction of a transgender person written by a cis person?

 

[NinjaCow64]

What would you say is the best depiction of a transgender person written by a cis person?

That’s a really good question and a hard one to answer. Most of the best works depicting trans people are written by trans people themselves, unsurprisingly.

The low hanging fruit answer is Bridget from the Guilty Gear series. She was a character who was a man who presented female for convoluted plot reasons. In the most recent instalment of the game, Guilty Gear Strive, she came out as a woman.

Admittedly I have not played Guilty Gear Strive, but I have watched the relevant cutscenes on YouTube. Also, her theme song The Town Inside Me was such an poignant exploration of gender dysphoria and coming out to oneself, it made me cry the first time I heard it.

A far more obscure but personally meaningful example for me is the Anime Sickos Podcast, which is my favourite podcast. It is mostly a non-fiction podcast but every now and then they do audio fiction. In their magnum opus, Sicko Shock 2, one of the protagonists is Tor Client (everyone has silly names in this story) and they are nonbinary. Tor is played by a nonbinary voice actor and I believe that they had input on the script, but the main writers are both cis men. Tor’s subplot is an incredible metaphor for gender transition, state repression of queer people and how liberating the internet can be for trans people in particular.

Off-topic - did you used to frequent IOT? If so, hi! Long time no see!

 

[fy00sh]

What would you say is the best depiction of a transgender person written by a cis person?

off the top of my head, Mad Mew Mew from the Switch port of Undertale comes to mind, tho to be fair I'm having a hard time coming up with trans characters written by cis people.
I suppose i don't know if anyone from GB Patch is trans; if theyre all cis then I'd say Qiu Lin from Our Life: Now and Forever prolly beats out Mad Mew Mew even with that game only having a demo out so far. (Our Life is a fantastic series btw highly reccomend.) tho my gut tells me at least someone on GB Patch is probably trans, so ill stick with mad mew mew as my answer for now while i continue to think of what characters im familiar with qualify

 

[NinjaCow64]

off the top of my head, Mad Mew Mew from the Switch port of Undertale comes to mind, tho to be fair I'm having a hard time coming up with trans characters written by cis people.

I can’t believe I forgot Undertale!

That game has some great trans characters written by a cis man including Mad Mew Mew, Mettaton