Discuss the New Leaders

[Gaius Octavius]

According to this preview, the new leaders in Colonization II are:

England
George Washington and John Adams

France
Samuel de Champlain and Louis de Buade de Frontenac

The Netherlands
Peter Stuyvesant and Adriaen van der Donck

Spain
Simon Bolivar and Jose de San Martin


For comparison, these were the leaders in the old Colonization:

England
Walter Raleigh

France
Jacques Cartier

The Netherlands
Michiel de Ruyter

Spain
Christopher Columbus


What do you think of the new choices? Assuming there will be Civ 4-style traits in Col II, what traits do you think each leader will get? This is speculative, of course, since we don't know what Col II's new traits will be (if it has any) but you can probably make some rough guesses. Washington, for instance, will likely receive some kind of military bonus.

 

[allunderheaven]

It seems that all the new leaders are revolutionaries and the old leaders in the original are founders of the colonies...

 

[xmen510]

I would like to see the originals added as well.

 

[Greybriar]

I would like to see the originals added as well.

I agree. I would like the original leaders to be retained.

 

[GeneralMatt]

George Washington as a Revolutionary Leader is interesting, I view him more of a general. And considering he toasted the King for a period even after the war started..

And I also do wonder why they never make a game on becoming a democracy in the non-violent way as some countries in this world, not to mention North America, did.

 

[Ace of Gold]

Most of those names listed, i have never heard of.
The only ones I have heard of are the English and one of the french guys

 

[Gaius Octavius]

George Washington as a Revolutionary Leader is interesting, I view him more of a general. And considering he toasted the King for a period even after the war started..

Washington was the first president... and he isn't called "Father of the country" for nothing. I suspect that's why they chose him. "First in war, first in peace, first in the hearts of his countrymen."

And I also do wonder why they never make a game on becoming a democracy in the non-violent way as some countries in this world, not to mention North America, did.

You're just too much of a monarchist, GM.

 

[Soneji]

It seems that all the new leaders are revolutionaries and the old leaders in the original are founders of the colonies...

Quoted for truth.

I'd hope that firaxis go for historical accuracy and not their usual efforts.

 

[Onagan]

It seems that all the new leaders are revolutionaries and the old leaders in the original are founders of the colonies...

Michiel de Ruyter has very little (if nothing) to do with the North-American colony of the Dutch.

Cornelis Jacobsz May was the captain of the ship New Netherlands who delivered the first boat load of colonists to New Netherlands on Governors Island in June 1624. Having so transformed the New Netherlands territory to a province, he was named the province's first director. In 1624 De Ruyter was active in Dublin for a Vlissingen-based Merchant House. His fame came much later.

Peter Stuyvesant was the last Director-General in New Amsterdam. He build the City Wall, and the Canal (which are remembered by Wall Street, Canal Street & Broadway)


In that case he is a far better person than De Ruyter

 

[Elhoim]

I LOVE that San Martin is a leader in Colonization. First Argentine leader in a Sid Meier game!

 

[Edgecrusher]

I am just curious if they will be 3D LH's Like in Civ4, or a "photo"

 

[Gaius Octavius]

If they are just pictures, many people will be mad. But since it is a Civ 4 platform, I suspect they will be animated. (At least it saves Firaxis the extra work of having to do Washington again.)

 

[Onagan]

And we can mod them into CIV

 

[Tullaris]

Michiel de Ruyter has very little (if nothing) to do with the North-American colony of the Dutch.

Cornelis Jacobsz May was the captain of the ship New Netherlands who delivered the first boat load of colonists to New Netherlands on Governors Island in June 1624. Having so transformed the New Netherlands territory to a province, he was named the province's first director. In 1624 De Ruyter was active in Dublin for a Vlissingen-based Merchant House. His fame came much later.

Peter Stuyvesant was the last Director-General in New Amsterdam. He build the City Wall, and the Canal (which are remembered by Wall Street, Canal Street & Broadway)


In that case he is a far better person than De Ruyter

Both Stuyvesant and van der Donck are not really good choices. In Dutch history both are seen as rather unimportant. I get the feeling they were only chosen because they were involved in what later would become New York.

All Dutch activity in the Americas was through the Dutch West India Company. A company that was pursuing profits above anything else (such as simple colonization). Primarly the most important activity of the WIC was the conquest of Brazil (1624-1654).

In my opinion Johan Maurits, count of Nassau Siegen and Piet Heyn would be far better choices.

Johan Maurits was the govenor of Dutch Brazil and was enlightened in the full sense of the word. He established the first representative organ in the new world. He tolerated free practice of all religions in his colony (something that was not allowed in the Dutch republic itself). He funded scientific research of natural environment in Brazil. He stimulated contact and studies of the native population. He brought Dutch painters with him who painted the first real sceneries of the new world (at location).

Stuyvesant was a repressive tyrant. Local Dutch colonists hated him and the WIC wanted to get rid of him. New Amsterdam was a little enterprise of the WIC but all its resources were going towards Brazil and the war fought against the Spanish and Portuguese there (The Dutch left in 1654 because investors thought it was a unprofitable venue. The WIC needed money but nobody wanted to invest in a expensive war anymore and it went bankrupt).

Piet Heyn conquered the Spanish silver fleet in 1628. This conquest is still celebrated in the Netherlands. This victory funded ten years of colonial expansion into the new world.

I get the feeling that Firaxis, as an American company, takes a United States point of view historically.

 

[Ekmek]

And we can mod them into CIV

I hope so. but we'll see what the shader 1.1 does. but I'm sure it can be exported to blender then reimported without shaders. atleast I'm hoping.

 

[Flymancan]

And I also do wonder why they never make a game on becoming a democracy in the non-violent way as some countries in this world, not to mention North America, did.

Yay Canada

There should be some sort of diplmatic victory where you join a commonwealth or something.

I sorta don't like how the only victory option inevitably leads to warfare.

 

[Ball Lightning]

I would like to see the originals added as well.

More leaders the better.

 

[cairnsy44]

Originally Posted by allunderheaven View Post
It seems that all the new leaders are revolutionaries and the old leaders in the original are founders of the colonies...


De Champlain is definitely not a revolutionary. He was an explorer who spent a lot of time scouting Quebec and northern New England. Lake Champlain divides NY and VT and is obviously named after him.

 

[Zenon_pt]

-25

Most of those names listed, i have never heard of.
The only ones I have heard of are the English and one of the french guys

You are lucky, I only know 2 of them. George and Bolivar.

It's to bad that Christopher Columbus isn't a leaders, with him the game was more real.

(Add Portugal)

 

[Gaius Octavius]

It's to bad that Christopher Columbus isn't a leaders, with him the game was more real.

Maybe he will be one of the Founding Fathers this time around. I could easily see some kind of exploration bonus connected with him.