Graner sentenced to 10 years for abuses

[amadeus]

He was playing parlor tricks with the Iraqi prisoners. The prisoners themselves are in my opinion subhuman, but abusing them had no military intelligence purposes.

 

[Riesstiu IV]

"Subhuman"...? Maybe you should cut down on reading Mein Kampf.

 

[Ramius75]

10 years is ok, maybe 15. but this guys is just a small fry, a scapegoat for a larger coverup. Those ppl in the higher administration must be laughing their ass off right now.

 

[Knowze Gungk]

Riesstiu, it is a well known fact that anyone who stands against a powerful foreign occupation is subhuman. And, if they also practice a different culture, god forbid, they are subcompost.

[size=-4]in case you hadn't noticed, I was being facetious[/size]

 

[Stapel]

I think it is WAY too much. Let's keep it into proportions. Murderers aren't even locked up thsi long (here in NL, that is).
This guy slapped a man, forced him to masturbate, and piled humans naked.
Not so nice, and indeed a humiliating thing, and indeed a crime.

Is there any jurisprudence on Joe average prison guard in, say, Ohio, having slapped a prisoner, having forced him to masturbate and piled them naked?

I very much doubt ten years was given.

This guy, quite obviously, is a scapegoat, and therefor this criminal lawsuit is a shame for western civilisation. We (I feel part of westeren, civilisation, based on freedom and democracy) are supposed to treat people equally!

Apart from that, there are tons of evidence, nearly any regular, decent guy, can do these things in these circumstances.
That doesn't make this guy innocent, far from that. But it does give us a fair reason to be not too harsh.

 

[nonconformist]

He was playing parlor tricks with the Iraqi prisoners. The prisoners themselves are in my opinion subhuman, but abusing them had no military intelligence purposes.

Ja! Amerikane Ubermensch uber alles! Die Iraqi sind die untermentsc, herr Sturmfuhrer!

 

[Shaihulud]

He did beat up prisoners and abuse them, propablly more than what the photos revealed. What i'll like to know if there really were orders from above condoning or even encouraging the abuse. If he was really the scapegoat as he claims, then 10yrs abit harsh.

 

[The Last Conformist]

Apart from that, there are tons of evidence, nearly any regular, decent guy, can do these things in these circumstances.
That doesn't make this guy innocent, far from that. But it does give us a fair reason to be not too harsh.

Um, how is the apparent fact that almost everyone could do it in the right (wrong) circumstances a reason for leniency?

 

[CurtSibling]

It matters not if the American public can handle the verdict or not:

This ogre disgraced the uniform - And deserves the punishment.

Should I remind you all that overseas, our armies are the benchmark on which our societies are judged by other nations?

He is lucky to only get ten years and demotion.

...

 

[Marx]

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/01/15/graner.court.martial/index.html

WTF?!??! 10 years? Thats not much. He should have gotten much more.

In Holland you only get a couple of sexual abuse of young children (I would give them at least 25 years...)

But in my opinion this guy is sick in his head, who can do such inhuman things. 10 year is not enough..

 

[MarineCorps]

. Murderers aren't even locked up thsi long (here in NL, that is).

In America murders are locked up for 30 years to life. 10 years is not harsh.

 

[Erik Mesoy]

10 years is so horribly much for a guy who only took pictures, and they were bad people. The u.s. millitary is wonderful: blame everything on the little guy.

"Only took pictures" ??
"they were bad people" - Yes, you also need to cut down reading Mein Kampf. Go and read about what actually happened instead.

 

[Seanirl]

I'm not sure if 10 years is enough or not. It's hard to judge the amount of prison time and punishment for abuse but if anybody actually died from his attacks and brutality then he should defiantly be sentenced to more prison time and barred from any type of law enforcement agency.

Yeah I mean... it IS 10 whole years, if he serves the lot he'll be out in 2015. That seems enough depending on the level of abuse...

of course, I don't even believe in prison to start with...

 

[Seanirl]

In Holland you only get a couple of sexual abuse of young children (I would give them at least 25 years...)

Yeah, that's the biggest joke of all... especially if it's a celebrity of some form, they get away with a fine or a week in prison.

Personally I'd work them to death in a camp.

1. No more damage they can do
2. They make some form of contribution back to the society they ****ed up (of course, providing the amount of money required to sustain making people work didn't go over the amount gained by their working)

Well maybe not a camp but you get the idea... building a road or something. Of course, if you're constantly making a profit with them there's no need to kill them, you'll be better off just keeping them there. Because of course... the death penalty is SOOOOO inhumane (I'd much rather be locked in a small smelly building for 40 years with a load of wackos and die there than die right away) ¬_¬... yes, sarcasmorama.

 

[Mario Feldberg]

Ja! Amerikane Ubermensch uber alles! Die Iraqi sind die untermentsc, herr Sturmfuhrer!

Please stop raping the German language!

Jawohl NOT Ja

Amerikanischer NOT Amerikane

Iraker NOT Iraqi

Untermenschen NOT untermentsc

And you don't combine "Herr" (NOT herr) with "Sturmfuhrer" either.

 

[downtown]

There is a big difference between what happened here and what would happen if say, a warden in Ohio did the same thing..

In Ohio, you piss off a bunch of prisoners. You humilate people. But really, there isnt much in the way of long lasting consequences, other then a larger hatred of "the man".

In Iraq, this is a major national security concern. Remember how many beheadings and kidnappings there were right after this came to the press? These events had huge repercussions hurting the war effort, and endangering the lives of foriegners and people working with American troops in Iraq.

10 years is not enough. The higher ups who ordered this ought to be tried for treason

 

[Rhymes]

I wonder if the goal of this article is to put the blame on higher directions or to support the image of US military???

Anyway, I think its a very fair sentence. Its not like the guy is a cold blooded murderer....

 

[FriendlyFire]

Graner a man people followed
January 17, 2005

Fort Hood: Charles Graner's trial has revealed a paradoxical man, one who put a "What Would Jesus Do?" sticker on his truck yet boasted that beating Iraqi prisoners was a "good upper-body workout".

"He was kind of like an overpowering personality," testified Sergeant Joseph Darby, who gave investigators photos of the abuses. "Most people wanted to be around him or associated with him."

He also quoted Graner as saying: "The Christian in me says it's wrong, but the corrections officer in me says I love to make a grown man piss himself."

Graner made small talk and jokes throughout the trial, despite the severity of the charges he faced.

He also constantly changed his appearance, with hats, haircuts, or a moustache so that he looks far different in court than in the abuse photos. He had affairs with at least two women in Iraq, Private Lynndie England, with whom he later fathered a child, and Private Megan Ambuhl, who was present in a photo in which England holds a leash around the neck of a naked prisoner.

Graner repeatedly beat prisoners and boasted about it in emails home.

"Good upper body work out but hard on the hands," he wrote in an email with a photo from a now notorious night when he stacked seven prisoners into a naked pyramid. The prisoners were later forced into real and simulated sex acts.

Graner took issue with his portrayal in the court martial. "I've been bad mouthed about my religion, that I'm not a good Christian," he said.

What made him send emails and photo's home to hes parents ? As well as showing sexual acts ? I cant possibily imaginee those circulated images being send home in emails.