Graphical problem when editing Terrain1.gif

[Cassius Critzer]

There is no doubt either the problem is with the hidden gif commenting or the conversion settings which are:
255 colors
8 quantization
Dithering
Interlacing.

If I can get it to work, I'm happy to upload a new Terrain1.gif file so everyone can see a vastly superior map that is absolutely clear concerning the terrain.Otherwise you have to constantly "show hidden terrain".

It would then be relatively easy to compile multiple resources as tiny icons or color values so one could also use standard map symbology versus the cumbersome large icons.n

Similarly, multiple unit.gif files could gather together similar unit types so that say in the Sengoku mod, you could have eras like the Mongol invasion included far earlier in history.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Well yes, this would mean you have to replace the original civ.exe.
You can always keep it around under different name and as far as I know, file name doesn't matter as long as you have it in the right folder - you can start the game from either file.
As for the side effects - I haven't noticed any.

Thanks for this. This is the most stable version of civ 2 especially when doing modding. It causes far less cpu throttle issues and seems to remedy the ai hostility. Keep the original in a folder and keep this version in another folder. It works great for me.

 

[Knighttime]

Hi Cassius, I'm looking at this due to the link you provided in the thread about people.gif.

If someone would blank out a terrain.gif for terrain 1 and 2, then these can be edited with the built in editor and saved as a .bmp. I've easily found excellent terrain files but cannot fix two issues.
...
If there was a blank terrain file for these issues, I would be supremely grateful.

Here is the Terrain1.gif that I created. I converted a png file to a jpg, then converted that in another program to a gif. Note the difference in a typical terrain.gif file which is quite a bit smaller.

Here's the file as a jpg too.

I used the RGB values of 255 0 255 which should be the proper pink.

Here is the original TERRAIN1.GIF file as well.

I'm not sure I understand exactly what you want. However, I think it would be better (quality) to convert straight from PNG into GIF, instead of going through JPG (or JPG plus an incorrect GIF) as a middle step. Remember that JPG is a "lossy" format, therefore it's good to avoid that whenever possible. So if you have the PNG source file (or whatever file serves as your true source, BMP or PNG or whatever), and can attach it here, it wouldn't be much trouble for me to save it as a GIF file with the standard Civ 2 palette.

Your JPG image seems to have the following icons blanked out:

• irrigation
• farmland
• mining
• grassland resource

All of those seem to relate to the issue you labeled "One". For your other issue ("Two"), are you also asking for the new Terrain1.gif to have all of the resource icons blanked out, for every terrain type? I can do that as well, if that's really what you want, I just want to make sure I'm understanding your goal.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

You are immensely helpful. Thank you sincerely.

Here is the terrain.bmp which has what I want. There also is terrain1.gif in a png format.
1. Can you just do a version where the terrain.bmp is a proper gif?
2. Can you then do a version where the png is just a proper gif too?

The terrain.bmp has the idealized terrain that I borrowed from another existing mod.

Then and only if you have time...
3. Would you do a version with these same files have the resources blanked out? I will save that for version 2.0 because maybe I can find some tiny version of the existing icons versus the large existing ones. The resource icons should be scaled half as large so they don't obscure the terrain as much.

The way resources are allocated is very random, however metals (copper, gold, iron, and silver) and lumber can be very laid down much more frequently. That is how it's configured now with lumber from deciduous forests, conifers, and boreal forests.

The main goal is to eliminate irrigation, mining, and farming and I will come up with an icon symbology using the terrain editor that is built in.

The attached terrain.bmp has my ideal representation depicted for the base terrain.

The terrain.png has less desireable terrain types but allows these to be overwritten with what information is written in the bmp file.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

It appears that by using lumber in various types of forests, these then actually are several kinds of resources even when the land has been cleared and made into farmland. I'm still puzzling it out as it's cleverly constructed since you can't place resources in the map even with a hex editor.

Blanking the resource icons makes sense, then using say a small number overlay or a letter designation as it currently is very obscure.

Resources
1. Gems
2. Silk
3. Pottery
4. Cloth
5. Handcrafts
6. Books
7. Copper
8. Dye
9. Rice
10. Tea
11. Silver
12. Perfume
13. Silver
14. Gold
15. Pearls
16. Mercury

 

[Knighttime]

Here is the terrain.bmp which has what I want. There also is terrain1.gif in a png format.
1. Can you just do a version where the terrain.bmp is a proper gif?
2. Can you then do a version where the png is just a proper gif too?
...
Then and only if you have time...
3. Would you do a version with these same files have the resources blanked out? I will save that for version 2.0 because maybe I can find some tiny version of the existing icons versus the large existing ones. The resource icons should be scaled half as large so they don't obscure the terrain as much.

Do the attached files work and look the way you'd like?

In another thread, you talked about a way to get Windows 3.11 running on Android. Personally, I really think you would be well-served by going down that road (or doing something similar), so that you're able to run a graphics editing tool like an old version of Paint Shop Pro that works well with Civ2-formatted GIF files. Your scenario creation work would be so much more straightforward if you had all of the tools you needed on hand, instead of relying on the community to overcome their absence. I don't mean that to be critical, and it's not that I mind helping out with a few simple things, but it just seems like you're hindering your own efforts by trying to work around the limits of Android instead of tackling the core issue and resolving it.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Thanks. You are most certainly correct.

The plan is to once again get Windows 3.11 loaded as a partition on my Android tablet. It worked once mysteriously. Ideally I could get Win 95 but I doubt that will work. Paint Shop Pro 3.12 is supposed to run under either Microsoft OS.

Right now there is an irritatingly simply few pixels on the Takeda flag for the radar colors on the map that would literally take a minute to fix, but I can't without solving this issue.

At first it was a challenge to see IF Civ 2MGE could run, and then actually modded under Linux.

Regardless to create a Title.gif, I need that much too.

I sincerely appreciate your help.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Yes, they look exactly how I wanted the terrain to be upgraded.

I hope you upload the files in the Scenario League and in the downloads as a very useful base terrain1.gif as now most modders and players can merely mix and match from existing terrain and resources and then create their own terrain.bmp.

It's superb and easily configurable. Now anyone can use a black loamy sort of tile for rich farmland or use the terraced Asian sort and edit in whatever irrigation, mining, or farms should look like on top of all the terrain tiles. Now it is readily apparent what the existing terrain is.

 

[Metro Polis]

I always used the MS Paint program within Windows (even Win10) and saved as the graphics as .bmp with 256 colours (Maybe you save it as a 24bit .bmp file, that's why you fail.

If I saved them as .gif files I had to run them through a special program and save again. I just can't remember its name. Maybe I still have that program saved on one of my older laptops. But it makes no sense really, just try out Paint.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

No, Photosuite for the Android has no gif or bmp export option. They did do a rotten Gimp release which was shocking as Gimp is ordinarily a fine program. The Gimp release was so abysmal due to being extremely buggy so they took it down from Google Play.

So Photosuite can export to a standard that everyone uses in the community now ie png or a lossy jpg. So I tried a conversion program that turned that into a gif with 256 colors but that failed to be recognized by Civ 2.

 

[Metro Polis]

I used a program which converted gifs to gifs Civ2 could use. I'll look for it later.

Edit: It's posted in the "Radar map" thread.

 

[Metro Polis]

Hi, Blasp, just a guess, maybe it helps.

I made a mistake myself recently and guess because Civ2-MGE used 8bit graphics and Civ2-TOT used 24bit. Maybe your files are 32bit or even 64bit. You can easily right-click on a gif that doesn't work and look for more detail. I don't think you can choose the 8bit mode for gif pictures anymore. But you can do that when you save it as bmp with 256 colours. And it works if you take an original 8bit gif from one of the old scenarios posted here in the forum and place your graphics right into that original one. It will lose some colours though. I still work with Windows Paint!
Maybe thinking about using Civ2-TOT will work better, because the graphics there are 24bit and you won't see any difference if you transform 32bit or 64bit into 24bit.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Yes but Photosuite won't export as a gif or a bmp so reguardless you have no options regarding the number of bits.

 

[Knighttime]

I should probably clarify that I didn't exactly "convert" (as in, simply open and re-save) your files into GIF format. Instead what I did was: using Paint Shop Pro, open up the game's default Terrain1.gif, open up your file separately, then copy the entire image from your file and paste it into Terrain1.gif. This not only forces the source image into 256 colors, but also into the exact palette (the specific set of colors, each with a specific index) that Civ2 requires/expects in GIF files. I also had to pay attention to the usage of the final palette slot (255) which is treated as transparent by the game, and this took some final editing or cleanup.

The same process applies to people.gif and cities.gif which were handled in separate threads.

None of this was too difficult, but I think the problem is slightly more complex than "convert any PNG or JPG to an 8-bit GIF" due to the palette issues.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

I should probably clarify that I didn't exactly "convert" (as in, simply open and re-save) your files into GIF format. Instead what I did was: using Paint Shop Pro, open up the game's default Terrain1.gif, open up your file separately, then copy the entire image from your file and paste it into Terrain1.gif. This not only forces the source image into 256 colors, but also into the exact palette (the specific set of colors, each with a specific index) that Civ2 requires/expects in GIF files. I also had to pay attention to the usage of the final palette slot (255) which is treated as transparent by the game, and this took some final editing or cleanup.

The same process applies to people.gif and cities.gif which were handled in separate threads.

None of this was too difficult, but I think the problem is slightly more complex than "convert any PNG or JPG to an 8-bit GIF" due to the palette issues.

Well I sincerely appreciate it because even IF I had windows and paint shop pro working and had migrated Civ 2, that sounds like quite a bit of work.

It explains why the Gif Convertor is not working. It explains why numerous converters are not working either. This is why I need an experienced artist to help.

How badly is this title.png mangled?

 

[Knighttime]

It's not "mangled"... looks pretty decent, just gets a little more pixelated when converted.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Thanks! I actually was looking at Dos paint programs since I can do Dos emulation...but that is an act of desperation as there likely will be the same sorts of compatibility issues.

In the cities.gif file, nobody that I know of has ever taken a city type and turned it into a fort. Most just have taken a very basic corner structure. I have seen starforts though and they are aesthetically pleasing for the historical time period they were used.

Is anyone up for taking one of the Japanese city types and making a fort and airfield from them? Then everything would "match". At very advanced levels hundreds of turns later, as ninja are air units that attack ground units, but far later they can build ninja houses that can be defended.

In the cities.bmp, you can see what forts look like. It works as the color matches up but was taken from another mod and doesn't look Japanese at all. I've tried a couple of things but nothing actually looks correct.

Several of the walled city types would look excellent...if say the top two sections are trimmed off.

Otherwise I can butcher it in Photosuite but then it will be screwed up pallette wise and just have to be redone and then exported properly to gif.

Then graphically everything is DONE. I'm so close to release:
1. Units done
2. Map is done
3. Tech is done
4. Events work but nine more will be added

Right now it's perfectly playable.

Then it will be added to dropbox so anyone can beta test it like I am now.

I'm going to have several versions to people can play the whole period or just the final action period with thousands of units prebuilt so war can be waged straight away: both single units of battallions and various kinds of armies and ships.

Whoever controls the Imperial Court of the Emperor has many wonders within so I thought of having several saved games where the player begins with that gained. That sounds easier but is actually way harder. Obviously every tribe wants that but the Mori and Oda are poised to strike.

 

[Blasph23]

I have a minor update related to this. I was trying to get some help on the GIMP forums but in the process I've found the answer on my own.
https://www.gimpusers.com/forums/gi...files-corrupts-color-information#message92459
The last message details the definitive process I use now to modify the graphical files in civ2.
It works fine with the CIv2UIA Launcher, which is also somewhere on civfanatics.

 

[Blasph23]

Thought I'd drop this here, since it feels like the definitive, final fix for the terrain edition issues (or in fact any Civ2 .gif file edition).
I have created a thread on the gimp forums and with a bit of advice from people, managed to overcome the grey triangle issues, here's the link with the process and instructions in the last post:

Exporting .gif files corrupts color information. (2022) — Help & Support — gimpusers.com