Infinite City Sprawl anyone?

[alpaca]

Well, despite the fact that a large and thriving colony is the last thing you want in this game, let's assume for a moment that you want one.

Each city that you found will yield the resources of the tile you build it on (food and a raw material) and give you a citizen to assign to resource gathering on top of that. Furthermore, there's no city maintenance in this game. So, unless your colony is really, really crowded: wouldn't you simply want to build as many cities as possible (except for the special resources which you'll want to work with a specialist) as close together as possible to get that free harvest from the city square, then ship away the raw material to one industrialized city where it's converted to goods? Oh, and before I forget it: each city gets a free hammer and cross, too.
Even worse, this isn't even prevented by having to buy land from the natives - at least not if you produce liberty bells - because you don't have to pay for land which is already in your own borders.

Now, I can already see Dralix' "this is perfectly alright because it was like that in Col1" post (j/k mate ), but does nobody else find this somewhat annoying? Or is the problem simply overshadowed by the even more broken REF and war mechanics?

 

[DarthVeda]

The REF is designed the way it is to combat this problem, but it creates all new ones in the process.

ICS could be easily combated by any number of mechanics already in the game.

For one, you could levy a tax each time the player creates a new city beyond some limit. "You're doing so well you could spare some additional coin for the crown..."

 

[Refar]

I don't think infinite city sprawl is a problem here. Yes you get some 'free' stuff from each city. Even some more free stuff with the right FF. You do not grow [signifcantly] faster because of this.

The point behind ISC is exponential population growth.
(And because in Civ small cities would grow faster than big ones, having - and keeping founding - lots of small cities would make your population explode).
This is not a concern in Col, because the Population growth mechanic is completely different. I.e. early in the Game (where ISC was commonly applied).

I even think the model of small, specialized settlements fit the idea of the Colonies better than megacities.

 

[Lord Chambers]

The REF is designed the way it is to combat this problem

The REF is designed to get it's ass kicked while sitting in your cities. Having more cities only reduces the tactical struggle to keep the fighting on a city tile.

So it's a boon to resource gathering, point generation, +2x indentured servants at declaration, and even gives a tactical bonus during the war of independance. The only downside I can think of is that your production is less centralized and so a marginal number of extra transports are needed to keep resources in the proper place.

 

[Freddy K]

A city also provides a free road.

I have a strong suspicion that "Your ways of life are threatening to ours! "in Diplomacy with the natives work to counteract expansion, isn't this concern proportional to the number of towns?

Sometimes it is necessary to send out people to settle early, to prevent the rival AI to occupying the sweet spots.

You'll have to be very apt with transporting, to prevent overflow, but this could be counteracted with chains of cities, built on grassland only, hills only, plains only etc, so a single tranport can serve a chain of towns in a single run.
Curious, if you have 3 towns connected by a straight road, then assign (move tobacco from Closevillage to Capital) and (move tobacco from Farvillage to Capital) to the Road Train, will the cart make just one run or will it head out to each city then return?

 

[Becephalus]

Yeah the colony size management mechanics were left rather empty. Right now the best number of cities to have I think is as many as you care to micro. Ideally you would want hundreds of size 1 settlements each with 1 statesman and 100 guns and 100 horses. Then just make each one into 2 men with all men are free, and fight a tiny REF since you were producing bells for like 1 turn...

 

[alpaca]

I don't think infinite city sprawl is a problem here. Yes you get some 'free' stuff from each city. Even some more free stuff with the right FF. You do not grow [signifcantly] faster because of this.

The point behind ISC is exponential population growth.
(And because in Civ small cities would grow faster than big ones, having - and keeping founding - lots of small cities would make your population explode).
This is not a concern in Col, because the Population growth mechanic is completely different. I.e. early in the Game (where ISC was commonly applied).

I even think the model of small, specialized settlements fit the idea of the Colonies better than megacities.

Well it's not as bad as in the early civ but the city square gives you at least two free food per turn, on top of what the colonist might gather. Don't forget the free resources, either, which make sure you grow faster economically. A free cross speeds immigration, and if you have some founding fathers that grant a bonus to your town center (+1 cross, +3 crosses, +3 production, +3 bells) the bonus becomes even larger.

A city also provides a free road.

I have a strong suspicion that "Your ways of life are threatening to ours! "in Diplomacy with the natives work to counteract expansion, isn't this concern proportional to the number of towns?

Sometimes it is necessary to send out people to settle early, to prevent the rival AI to occupying the sweet spots.

You'll have to be very apt with transporting, to prevent overflow, but this could be counteracted with chains of cities, built on grassland only, hills only, plains only etc, so a single tranport can serve a chain of towns in a single run.
Curious, if you have 3 towns connected by a straight road, then assign (move tobacco from Closevillage to Capital) and (move tobacco from Farvillage to Capital) to the Road Train, will the cart make just one run or will it head out to each city then return?

You get that attitude modifier if you have culture in a native settlement. It is removed if the natives gift you the settlement (which happens often if you're nice to them and with the right FFs).

And yes, you need some more carts but it's not a huge trouble to set them up so that they trade fairly effectively. You can set up a wagon chain by using both import and export in a settlement, then assign the wagon the small trade routes (it'll load, move, unload, load again and continue to move)

 

[Shurdus]

A city also provides a free road.

I have a strong suspicion that "Your ways of life are threatening to ours! "in Diplomacy with the natives work to counteract expansion, isn't this concern proportional to the number of towns?

Sometimes it is necessary to send out people to settle early, to prevent the rival AI to occupying the sweet spots.

You'll have to be very apt with transporting, to prevent overflow, but this could be counteracted with chains of cities, built on grassland only, hills only, plains only etc, so a single tranport can serve a chain of towns in a single run.
Curious, if you have 3 towns connected by a straight road, then assign (move tobacco from Closevillage to Capital) and (move tobacco from Farvillage to Capital) to the Road Train, will the cart make just one run or will it head out to each city then return?

No clue. Test it and let us know ok? thnx man.