New NESes, ideas, development, etc

[Abaddon]

But that doesn't answer whether you support option 1 or 2. But I'd never have made it Earth anyway.

Hmm. I'm thinking 2.. but then a Pre-thread where us gods manipulate the world could be kinda fun too! Also help develope something about the gods character before we begin?

 

[zxcvbnm]

Hmm. I'm thinking 2.. but then a Pre-thread where us gods manipulate the world could be kinda fun too! Also help develope something about the gods character before we begin?

Stop stealing that stuff from my brains! What are you, a god?

(Exactly what I was thinking...)

 

[Abaddon]

What are you, a god?

Love manipulating quotes!

Glad we think alike.. i'd look at my post on the page before aswell since otherwise it might get lost

[hijack] Please get an avatar?[/hijack]

 

[das]

Basically, I agree with the pre-NES idea for shaping both the world and the gods until the world assumes a more or less definite physical shape (possibly end with some sort of an event that would partly separate the gods from the world, making power projection more complicated).

A prayer can call forth a god just as much as a idol.. but depending how many, how big etc effects the power of it.

How about a "no"? Different types of worship would lead to different results and enable different kinds of divine intervention.

I also want some thaumaturgy.

As another idea, introduce "artifacts" that allow gods - or better yet, their chosen mortals - to gain some sort of a genuine edge over the other gods, possibly even to the point of imprisoning or banishing them from the physical world until their followers could release them once more (preferably having been driven to do so by means of dream manipulation, ofcourse). Other artifacts might simply dispel their creations, damage their avatars or otherwise hinder them.

In addition to this, a consistent system of NPC great persons (heroes, but also great artificers, prophets and such) would be very nice.

 

[LittleBoots]

I think this has already been said (and I thought it was by you), but I think that at least some of the heroes and more or less all of the prophets of a god should be player controlled, or at least, player "heavily influenced."

 

[Abaddon]

Perhaps Gods should reside "earthwards" so that Heros have the ability to reach them and effect them?

God of the Seas.. in the sea, God of the Underworld... in a deep cave etc?

 

[zxcvbnm]

GodNES: DI

Divine Intervention points (DI) are the source of all the actions of the gods affecting the world. Every action beyond chatting with other gods takes DI and the amount of DI allocated will define the power of the action, although it will also be affected by how in-character the action is for the god.

Getting DI:
Every god gets some DI every season. The amount is based on the god's power and influence in the world, and can be improved by increasing the sphere of one's power.

Spending DI:
When you send your orders, you should tell what you want to use your DI for, the goals of the actions and the priority of the spending, ie in which order the actions will be carried out if you don't have enough DI to do them all. Also you should note that other gods will most likely try to get involved in your areas, and be prepared to defend yourself from it.

Consuming DI:
In addition to spending to do specific things, your DI gets consumed by your normal actions which need not be specifically included in your orders, only exceptions. These consuming things include the everyday actions keeping the world running (such as making the sun shine on days for the sun god, or giving rains to farms for some other one, and so on) and controlling your creatures. The cost to control your creatures is the total DI cost to create them divided by five, ie for every five DI you spend to create creatures you need to pay one extra to control them. You can also let them run wild in the world, but don't complain if they do something you don't want them to.

Regular communicating with mortals (your priests and prophets) also consumes DI.


Sample spending orders might be like this:
(for a god of nature or something)

8 DI to spend
-2 DI from regular actions (1 to control creatures, 1 to other)

1. defend the forests [add tactics here]
2. create a giant boar near my realm (3 DI)
3. give visions to a villager in Kerti, of the power of the nature (1 DI)
4. send wild beasts to hunt the cattle of the people of Argan (2 DI)

[the numbers mean priority order]

As another idea, introduce "artifacts" that allow gods - or better yet, their chosen mortals - to gain some sort of a genuine edge over the other gods, possibly even to the point of imprisoning or banishing them from the physical world until their followers could release them once more (preferably having been driven to do so by means of dream manipulation, ofcourse). Other artifacts might simply dispel their creations, damage their avatars or otherwise hinder them.

Seems interesting. I might hide that kind of stuff in places

Perhaps Gods should reside "earthwards" so that Heros have the ability to reach them and effect them?

God of the Seas.. in the sea, God of the Underworld... in a deep cave etc?

Yes. They can have a realm partially in the physical world (think of mount Olympos of Greeks) which can be reached by mortals. The area around it would be especially powerfully under the god's control, but infiltrating it would seriously undermine that god, so it's another strategic choice.

 

[The Strategos]

Not forgetting Temples, pilgrimages etc?

Most temples are built to house idols and pilgrimages will almost always involve sacrifices to the gods (whether animal or monetary) so those are merely subsets to the “Big Two.”

An what history is there of people carrying Idols to war?

Just virtually every culture and time period. Japanese sohei were reported to have carried mikoshi (a portable shrine that acted like a divine spirit’s car) with them in battle. I unfortunately returned the book, but read in a sourcebook of Ancient Near East of a country asking Egypt to send an idol of a particular god to them so that they would be successful in battle. The Jewish practice of carrying the Ark as well as Christian practice of carrying relics such as pieces of the true cross or Lance of Longinus are similar in idea.

I wouldn't see sacrifice as a seperate thing.. Idols, sacrifice, worship, temples etc all the same. A prayer can call forth a god just as much as a idol.. but depending how many, how big etc effects the power of it.

A prayer acts as a petition. The person is asking for the god to intervene, it does not cause the god to intervene or give the god the power needed to intervene. This can be seen by the common ancient practice of “bribery” in prayers. “O God if you do x I will sacrifice to you y.”

As for worship, I wonder what you are thinking of when you use the word “worship.” For the ancients, sacrifice is worship and worship is sacrifice. Anything else, music, chanting, incense, is merely a sideshow, either a celebration (or party if you will), a ritual used to bind the worshiping community together (as used especially in various mystery cults), or an attempt at magic to force the god to do what the worshippers want (the act of temple prostitution as part of a fertility rite).

 

[das]

Perhaps Gods should reside "earthwards" so that Heros have the ability to reach them and effect them?

God of the Seas.. in the sea, God of the Underworld... in a deep cave etc?

Maybe they should simply have a "projector" of sorts in some specific area after their exile? The closer to this hidden "projector", the stronger their power, and the area increases as the gods gain more power in the world. They may be present there in a nearly-godlike physical form, while relying on avatars in more distant areas (100% pure divine presence post-event shouldn't be possible, at least until we launch the Gotterdamerung or some other major era change (I think the essentials of the Aztec eschatological system may be best here, with passing ages that possess different rules and begin after a climatic battle of the gods - possibly represented by a temporary lapse or weakening of most usual limitations)).

Anyway, that "projector" could ofcourse be somehow damaged, corrupted or even captured. Not completely destroyed, though.

Just virtually every culture and time period. Japanese sohei were reported to have carried mikoshi (a portable shrine that acted like a divine spirit’s car) with them in battle. I unfortunately returned the book, but read in a sourcebook of Ancient Near East of a country asking Egypt to send an idol of a particular god to them so that they would be successful in battle. The Jewish practice of carrying the Ark as well as Christian practice of carrying relics such as pieces of the true cross or Lance of Longinus are similar in idea.

On the other hand, there are ofcourse also examples of idols being placed under close guard and kept away from the battlefield to avoid their loss or destruction. Which should be a viable tactic, ofcourse, especially in the great wars between pantheons.

 

[Abaddon]

GodNES: DI

Divine Intervention points (DI) are the source of all the actions of the gods affecting the world. Every action beyond chatting with other gods takes DI and the amount of DI allocated will define the power of the action, although it will also be affected by how in-character the action is for the god.

Getting DI:
Every god gets some DI every season. The amount is based on the god's power and influence in the world, and can be improved by increasing the sphere of one's power.

Spending DI:
When you send your orders, you should tell what you want to use your DI for, the goals of the actions and the priority of the spending, ie in which order the actions will be carried out if you don't have enough DI to do them all. Also you should note that other gods will most likely try to get involved in your areas, and be prepared to defend yourself from it.

Consuming DI:
In addition to spending to do specific things, your DI gets consumed by your normal actions which need not be specifically included in your orders, only exceptions. These consuming things include the everyday actions keeping the world running (such as making the sun shine on days for the sun god, or giving rains to farms for some other one, and so on) and controlling your creatures. The cost to control your creatures is the total DI cost to create them divided by five, ie for every five DI you spend to create creatures you need to pay one extra to control them. You can also let them run wild in the world, but don't complain if they do something you don't want them to.

Regular communicating with mortals (your priests and prophets) also consumes DI.

All makes sense to me

What other stats will a God have?

 

[Abaddon]

Maybe they should simply have a "projector" of sorts in some specific area after their exile? The closer to this hidden "projector", the stronger their power, and the area increases as the gods gain more power in the world. They may be present there in a nearly-godlike physical form, while relying on avatars in more distant areas (100% pure divine presence post-event shouldn't be possible, at least until we launch the Gotterdamerung or some other major era change (I think the essentials of the Aztec eschatological system may be best here, with passing ages that possess different rules and begin after a climatic battle of the gods - possibly represented by a temporary lapse or weakening of most usual limitations)).

Anyway, that "projector" could ofcourse be somehow damaged, corrupted or even captured. Not completely destroyed, though.

Perhaps this "projector" should be the first Idol that is built for you?

 

[Shadowbound]

Divide the world into ages, and make gods spend more and more DI every age in order to directly affect the world, making it preferrable to influence events and create avatars rather than just appear and throw a mountain at what's bothering you?

 

[zxcvbnm]

All makes sense to me

What other stats will a God have?

Character, basically what the god usually does. (used to be aspect but I like this idea better)

Influence, how much power a god has in the world

Heroes, that god's most important followers

Creatures, what kind of, and how many, creatures the god has / can create

Realm, what kind of a "heaven" the god has and where it's entrance is located (or the Projector)


anything else?

I'd like to have the Pre-GodNES thread up quite soon

 

[Abaddon]

I'm guessing we start with no Hero's and have to convince them to side with us?


How are you going to control a god doing OOC things...I mean, stick to the type of god they are.

 

[The Strategos]

Maybe they should simply have a "projector" of sorts in some specific area after their exile? The closer to this hidden "projector", the stronger their power, and the area increases as the gods gain more power in the world. They may be present there in a nearly-godlike physical form, while relying on avatars in more distant areas (100% pure divine presence post-event shouldn't be possible, at least until we launch the Gotterdamerung or some other major era change (I think the essentials of the Aztec eschatological system may be best here, with passing ages that possess different rules and begin after a climatic battle of the gods - possibly represented by a temporary lapse or weakening of most usual limitations)).

Anyway, that "projector" could ofcourse be somehow damaged, corrupted or even captured. Not completely destroyed, though.

I think this is essentially the idol idea. Idols are like radio transmitters, the closer you are to the transmitter, the better the signal (power), the farther away, the weaker the signal (power) To get a a signal farther, you have to build more idols, which then act as "boosters" allowing your signal to reach farther places. Larger idols give bigger boosts but are stationary and would be harder to hide, smaller idols give smaller boosts but can be movable and are easier to hide.

If you want to go beyond these limitations, you could make yourself an avatar, but this will make you significantly more vunerable. Unlike idols, which if you lose you just lose the cost of making, if an avatar is destroyed, you yourself will be damaged.

 

[zxcvbnm]

Yes, no heroes in the beginning. Ocassionally some mortals might raise to be powerful on their own and if a god can gain him/her as his/her/its follower, it can be really beneficial.

And I quite like the idol/projector idea.

 

[das]

Realm, what kind of a "heaven" the god has and where it's entrance is located (or the Projector)

"Heaven"?

I think this is essentially the idol idea.

It is connected to it, ofcourse, but idols are plural and ultimately destructible. This is the central node of the idol network, if you will.

 

[zxcvbnm]

"Heaven"?

My Fall from Heaven influence is getting on me. Basically the place where the god and its servants (yes, you can create yourself a lot of supernatural servants) reside.

 

[erez87]

His great Temple? The city which he is the patron of?

Anyway I like the god NES idea

 

[zxcvbnm]

That, or a sacred cave, or the greatest statue to that god or something.