Deliverator
Graphical Hackificator
From this thread:
I thought now was a good time to start a discussion about what a playable Native game might look like, and dump out some ideas and thoughts.
First, I think it is important to address Wheldrake's comment that a native victory is anachronistic. I think a lot of the fun of Civ is the 'What If?'. No one seems to complain that Romans wielding rifles or Babylonians building space rockets is anachronistic. However, I do think it's worth thinking about 'What would it have taken for the Native Americans to repel the Europeans and establish their own nation?' Yes, it might be far fetched, but this is a game not a history lesson. I would expect playing as the Natives to be a big challenge whichever way you cut it. But can it be made a fun challenge?
Thoughts and ideas in no particular order (I know many of these things would be tricky to implement but it is worth having the discussion):
1) The massive technological gulf between natives and europeans is clearly the biggest obstacle. Knowledge is the biggest commodity they lack. The only conceivable way that the natives would be able to repel the europeans would be if they had the technology to compete economically and militarily. Gameplay wise it would be great if natives could have technological advances, perhaps triggered by totals in the Education yield. The more educated your population the more you are able to have specialists and build an economy/military. Technological advances could also be obtained from Europeans somehow.
2) Some kind of enslaving mechanic would be interesting so that Europeans can enslave the natives and put them to work (as the Spanish did with the Taino) or the natives can capture and enslave Europeans. Captured units on both sides can somehow achieve freedom/becoming assimilated. Assimilated European units (real life example) could have a special role amoungst the natives, in terms of teaching a particular trade to other natives or triggering technological advances. The natives could also kidnap units for ransom.
3) Actual victory could be achieving Nationhood, or, having achieved Nationhood, having to withstand a final European onslaught akin to the War of Independence.
4) Unique units for each Native race to add replayability and flavour. These unique units don't all have to have a military role. Some could economic benefits or have other benefits e.g. priests, medicine men, etc. For example, an Aztec Priest could perform human sacrifice on a unit for some benefit - there was a mechanic like this in the packaged Mesoamerica mod for Civ4.
5) Perhaps when playing the Native you could have a number of turns to prepare, before the Europeans arrive. A countdown to 1492. This would add some excitement and give the player a chance to get set up/expand before having to cope with the settlers.
Questions
1) What becomes of bells and rebel sentiment? Could they work towards nationhood instead?
2) How does land purchase would work if you are playing the natives?
I'm sure there are lots of other ideas/thoughts out there. Please refrain from the 'I think the whole idea is stupid' and try to be positive.
1.11: Native victory & ability to play them
I thought now was a good time to start a discussion about what a playable Native game might look like, and dump out some ideas and thoughts.
First, I think it is important to address Wheldrake's comment that a native victory is anachronistic. I think a lot of the fun of Civ is the 'What If?'. No one seems to complain that Romans wielding rifles or Babylonians building space rockets is anachronistic. However, I do think it's worth thinking about 'What would it have taken for the Native Americans to repel the Europeans and establish their own nation?' Yes, it might be far fetched, but this is a game not a history lesson. I would expect playing as the Natives to be a big challenge whichever way you cut it. But can it be made a fun challenge?
Thoughts and ideas in no particular order (I know many of these things would be tricky to implement but it is worth having the discussion):
1) The massive technological gulf between natives and europeans is clearly the biggest obstacle. Knowledge is the biggest commodity they lack. The only conceivable way that the natives would be able to repel the europeans would be if they had the technology to compete economically and militarily. Gameplay wise it would be great if natives could have technological advances, perhaps triggered by totals in the Education yield. The more educated your population the more you are able to have specialists and build an economy/military. Technological advances could also be obtained from Europeans somehow.
2) Some kind of enslaving mechanic would be interesting so that Europeans can enslave the natives and put them to work (as the Spanish did with the Taino) or the natives can capture and enslave Europeans. Captured units on both sides can somehow achieve freedom/becoming assimilated. Assimilated European units (real life example) could have a special role amoungst the natives, in terms of teaching a particular trade to other natives or triggering technological advances. The natives could also kidnap units for ransom.
3) Actual victory could be achieving Nationhood, or, having achieved Nationhood, having to withstand a final European onslaught akin to the War of Independence.
4) Unique units for each Native race to add replayability and flavour. These unique units don't all have to have a military role. Some could economic benefits or have other benefits e.g. priests, medicine men, etc. For example, an Aztec Priest could perform human sacrifice on a unit for some benefit - there was a mechanic like this in the packaged Mesoamerica mod for Civ4.
5) Perhaps when playing the Native you could have a number of turns to prepare, before the Europeans arrive. A countdown to 1492. This would add some excitement and give the player a chance to get set up/expand before having to cope with the settlers.
Questions
1) What becomes of bells and rebel sentiment? Could they work towards nationhood instead?
2) How does land purchase would work if you are playing the natives?
I'm sure there are lots of other ideas/thoughts out there. Please refrain from the 'I think the whole idea is stupid' and try to be positive.