Quick Answers / 'Newbie' Questions

[Lennier]

I am in this game where I an trying to get a nation into a defense pact and or permanent alliance, but it just doesn't seem to want to come up as options. The nations friendly to me, it's a sea of green likes, with my gifting or selling cheap techs, us fighting the same enemies, same religion because of espionage, etc. etc. I am not the weakest nation, the other nations not the strongest. I even agreed to a war with the only other nation I wasn't fighting besides this one, not good enough? What do I need to do? At this point I want to see it just to see it, even if it doesn't contribute to a win or I could win some other way.

If either you or the target nation or both are in a war, you can't sign a defensive pact. A defensive pact is only in effect when bot civs are at peace; if one gets DoW'd, the other will declare war on the offending civilization. (And then the DP goes away.)

If you are too powerful, you can't get into a PA

 

[lymond]

AFAIK the planet generator comes from BUG. I got it after I installed BUG and lost it when BUG stopped working for me. A reminder, still need help with that...

TP..I posted a link over to a post in the tech forum some weeks ago regarding this. I will post it again here:

https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...25-on-ubuntu-9-04.327508/page-8#post-15010897

I really don't know how to help other than what the folks there have tried themselves. Future questions regarding your OS issues probably should be addressed in that thread.

 

[Eagle777]

That's a great tip! Indeed that was possible, I was not checking.
I think it is not the case here, though.

I have uninstalled everything. Then I reinstalled Civ4 complete. For now I cannot start BTS (I have not patched anything yet) - and that is to be expected with no patch, according to this link
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/installing-civ-4-on-windows-7-vista-32-64-bit.408537/.

I think this particular version is unpatched; it is a DVD version of Civ4 complete, and it was burned in 2007 with a few files on the DVD burned in 2008. BTS had a patch released in 2009.

I am wondering, should I first install the 3.17 BTS patch and then 3.19 patch on top of it, like the guide I linked above says?
Or just patch it with 3.19?

And Warlords patches, I am guessing they won't matter in any case if I'm playing BTS?

 

[lymond]

Burned? Sorry don’t think we can help you with an unofficial copy of the game. I suggest you purchase an official copy on sale online, and then you”d have no issues. You can get the game for about 7 bucks when on sale. Steam, GOG, Humble, Green Man.

sorry you are dealing with complete unknowns with a pirate version and can find no help for that here.

 

[Eagle777]

Oh, I'm speaking about a legit, normal version.

I probably spoke poorly and now you misunderstood me - "burned" by the producers/creators.
They all "burn" the DVD-s, and every such process shows the dates of the files on the disc.
So when I take a look at the DVD contents, I see the dates when the files were "created".

What I have is an official copy, bought on sale online. Nothing unknown about it. And it was less than 7 bucks, it was 3 or 4.
I have a steam version, too, but that bloatware I did not like much. It is why I sought and bought the disc version.

So, is it necessary to install the 3.17 BTS patch before installing the 3.19 BTS patch, like the guide mentioned above seems to imply?

 

[lymond]

Okay, so you meant that a different way. I would have not used that word though...ha

The complete version should still be patched. I did not even know there was a complete version before the final BTS update. First thing you need to do after install is check the version in game before doing anything.

Secondly, there are known issues with the disk version on Win 10. It's a SecureROM thing. I'm not sure there is much of a way around it without some significant workarounds, but you can check the tech forum..there is a sticky on the issue.

With Steam version you would not have this problem at all...install and play...(just switch to the beta legacy version though if you use mods) Steam is fine. I've been using it for about 15 years and have tons of games on it. Digital is really the way to go for pc games. Calling it bloatware is a bit myopic.

 

[leif erikson]

The complete version should still be patched. I did not even know there was a complete version before the final BTS update. First thing you need to do after install is check the version in game before doing anything.

Have an older, legit, version of Civ4 Complete and it requires me to update BtS when I have to reinstall it.

 

[Eagle777]

Yeah, I agree with digital being great. You can always redownload, and you don't have to pile DVDs, and such.

When I run Civ through Steam, though, it keeps (kept) starting up some of its extras which make everything just ever so slightly laggy and less responsive on my PC.

I have the one Leif has - since it's the 2007 version and the files on it are from Jan 2008 at the latest, it did not include the patch from 2009.

In a catch 22 situation, I also cannot start it to see which BTS patch it has - before I patch up BTS.
Like the linked guide says, the game does not start before you patch BTS.
(From my last attempt, the one I made before your tip and before reinstalling, I do know that once I patch it up I can start it).

Hence my question, should I plug in 3.17 before I add 3.19 on top of it.

 

[leif erikson]

Hence my question, should I plug in 3.17 before I add 3.19 on top of it.

I do not update to 3.17, 3.19 contains all the updates.

 

[Eagle777]

I figured so, as well, but I prefer checking before with those who could know better than me.

An odd turn of events followed.
I read your post, tried, and 3.19 patch setup, once I start it, wants to remove the game.

OTOH, 3.17 patch initializes and offers to install.

Very weird.

 

[leif erikson]

Perhaps we have different versions of Civ4 Complete and your version requires 3.17?

Seen stranger things....

Apologies if I steered you wrong.

 

[Eagle777]

No problem at all. No need to apologize.
You were just trying to help, and all ideas are welcome. And things often work out in quite unusual ways when it comes to computers.
I am grateful just the same.

The whole story gets even weirder, but it somehow worked out in the end.

So I install the game from the Civ4 complete DVD.
It does not run after installing - which is to be expected; that is how a prepatched version is supposed to behave.
And the dates on the DVD seem like a strong indicator that it is patchless (since the BTS 3.19 patch is from 2009, and DVD has just a few files from Jan 2008 and everything else from earlier on).

But the 3.19 patch won't patch the game, and tries deinstalling the whole game when I run it.

And, apparently 3.17 says that 3.19 indeed is already installed by default (it shows that it's "upgrading" from 3.19.000 to 3.17 when I'm installing it!).
And it is happy to install over it anyway.

So, despite two strong signs that 3.19 indeed is up, BTS just does not start (Run as Admin does nothing) before I
- install 3.17
- subsequently (re?)install 3.19.

That way I managed to get it to work, and plugged BAT which is now behaving fine (!), so all is good.

 

[leif erikson]

Glad you got it running. Enjoy the game!!

 

[TruePurple]

If you are too powerful, you can't get into a PA

I am not too powerful, nor am I the weakest nation. Similarly the nation I want to PA is not the strongest or the weakest. So how can I tell why I can't get a permanent alliance/what is necessary for me to get one? Is there a certain amount of like points I need to get one? Is there a stage beyond "friendly" to get to with said nation to get a PA?

 

[lymond]

I am not too powerful, nor am I the weakest nation. Similarly the nation I want to PA is not the strongest or the weakest. So how can I tell why I can't get a permanent alliance/what is necessary for me to get one? Is there a certain amount of like points I need to get one? Is there a stage beyond "friendly" to get to with said nation to get a PA?

TP - Do you have the Permanent Alliance option turned on in the custom game options? It is not a default setting.

Otherwise, I will include a small guide WastinTime wrote up some years ago:

https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/permanent-alliance-guide.164653/#post-3853417


I've only used the PA option a couple of times over the years, and not anytime recently. I recall you need a Defensive Pact for a certain amount of turns - I think 40 turns, but may be different depending on game speed. Or you need shared war for a certain number of turns, which might be faster option, though not sure the duration. I think, but not certain, that shared war is cumulative. That is, if you were in multiple wars during the game they add up by the time a PA would be enabled otherwise by tech needed. I'm not sure if Defensive Pact time is cumulative since obviously DPs cancel when at war, but you need to be in a DP anyway to even enable the PA. Likewise, I'm not sure if DP and war duration are cumulative. For instance, you were in shared war with a leader and then later a DP, and that time adds up.

 

[TruePurple]

Lymond, is there a way to see in game whether PA is turned on/allowed in said game?

Can someone please explain this strange territory loss. My territory is purple. Notice the clams in blue. But this is recent, for the longest time this was my territory and suddenly it's my neighbors. It's weird enough I lost any territory since this city is one of my cultural powerhouses that I can use for a culture win along with my capital to the right of this at the very right edge of the picture, but why that spot and not the spot above it that is closer to the other nations cities?

Also, any advice for reclaiming this spot aside from war?

 

[vorlon_mi]

In a number of posts in the Strategy forum, someone will write, "Once Shaka/Toku/Monty started plotting against me ..." How do I tell that? I am running the BUG mod, but which screen do I look at?

 

[AcaMetis]

When you check an AI's trade screen and see that they're not willing to be bribed to go to war with someone (anyone, really) because "We've got enough on our hands right now", that means they're plotting. Not necessarily on the player, but someone. Troop placement can give a hint as to who they're plotting on - if an AI is stacking an army on your borders, and his other border cities have only a few defensive units in them, odds are very high that you're the target.

BUG, as a convenience feature so you don't have to check every trade screen every single turn, adds a red fist icon next to a civ on the scoreboard when the AI is plotting and the player can tell that they are from their trade screen. That last part is very important to remember - if an AI refuses to talk to you, or doesn't have anyone they can declare war on other than you, you won't get the red fist icon even if they're plotting war.

 

[lymond]

Lymond, is there a way to see in game whether PA is turned on/allowed in said game?

There is a settings tab in the victory conditions screen, or whatever it is called. Button in the top right - I think the fist button. You can see the options you currently have active there, if any, in the middle. (On the left side you would see game settings such as map and size)

Can someone please explain this strange territory loss. My territory is purple. Notice the clams in blue. But this is recent, for the longest time this was my territory and suddenly it's my neighbors. It's weird enough I lost any territory since this city is one of my cultural powerhouses that I can use for a culture win along with my capital to the right of this at the very right edge of the picture, but why that spot and not the spot above it that is closer to the other nations cities?

Also, any advice for reclaiming this spot aside from war?

Pericles likely went culture mode himself, which he is prone to do, so he is generating a lot of culture from those cities likely and eventually overtook that tile. You say that you are going for a culture victory, but you have not emphasized culture here. You are still at 100% research and at the point in the game you are teching Computers. In a culture type game, you would have gone full culture mode a long time ago. It is extremely late in your game for a culture win, not that you can't still achieve it, but at this point, depending on difficulty, other AIs may be very close to their own achievement. Check the victory screen I just mentioned above to determine this.

 

[TruePurple]

Why that tile and not the closer one?

So under options in the fist screen has to be a specific one allowing permanent alliances? If that isn't listed there, it isn't allowed?