The Falkland Islands

[aelf]

Argentina should bide its time and wait for the UK to decline. It's already on track for that. The islanders will probably be loyal to whoever is more economically powerful.

 

[imperialman]

Argentina should bide its time and wait for the UK to decline. It's already on track for that. The islanders will probably be loyal to whoever is more economically powerful.

No you're quite right. In a world where the UK will decline enough to not be able to defend its territory, Argentina will somehow rise to have the military capability to enforce its will on a fortified archipelago.

 

[aelf]

Well, I'm also talking about legitimacy. I mean, surely you're not entertaining thoughts of imposing British rule if the islanders don't want it, right?

 

[imperialman]

Not at all no but the islanders themselves are mostly first generation Britons. I don't really see the opinion that Britain will decline to a point where being an Argentine national is preferable as being credible.

 

[warpus]

Not at all no but the islanders themselves are mostly first generation Britons. I don't really see the opinion that Britain will decline to a point where being an Argentine national is preferable as being credible.

Could happen in a couple hundred years. I don't see it happening at any point before that.

This is a very politically and emotionally charged topic for all Argentinians. They really want the island but I don't think they really want to rule over a bunch of people who don't want to be Argentinian.

 

[aelf]

Not at all no but the islanders themselves are mostly first generation Britons. I don't really see the opinion that Britain will decline to a point where being an Argentine national is preferable as being credible.

I'm kind of pessimistic about the fate of the UK, but not that pessimistic. Give it a couple of decades, at the very least.

 

[luiz]

Could happen in a couple hundred years. I don't see it happening at any point before that.

This is a very politically and emotionally charged topic for all Argentinians. They really want the island but I don't think they really want to rule over a bunch of people who don't want to be Argentinian.

The Argentines are very passionate about it but I'm not sure they know why they're passionate about it.

Also, many argenitineans (all my argentinean friends and colleagues, for instance) don't care for the Falklands and know that it's just something the government will bring up in times of crisis to try to unite the nation behind them. It's a cheap appeal to nationalism and macho pride, which unfortunately still works well in Latin America. But a lot of Argentineans see through that.

 

[warpus]

The Argentines are very passionate about it but I'm not sure they know why they're passionate about it.

Yeah, when I was in Patagonia I got the sense that it's important to them because they are Argentinian and no other real reason. Sort of like I have certain "expectations" for being Polish and Canadian, etc.

Also, many argenitineans (all my argentinean friends and colleagues, for instance) don't care for the Falklands and know that it's just something the government will bring up in times of crisis to try to unite the nation behind them. It's a cheap appeal to nationalism and macho pride, which unfortunately still works well in Latin America. But a lot of Argentineans see through that.

I think it works everywhere in the world. It's good to hear that a lot of Argentinians don't buy into it.

 

[imperialman]

I'm kind of pessimistic about the fate of the UK, but not that pessimistic. Give it a couple of decades, at the very least.

Hmm, we'll agree to disagree.

 

[aelf]

Hmm, we'll agree to disagree.

No, we can't, actually. There's a theorem of rationality called Aumann's Agreement Theorem which shows that no two rationalists can agree to disagree. If two people disagree with each other, at least one of them must be doing something wrong.

I'm quite happy to be wrong about this, but I'm not sure you'll be.

 

[Winner]

Not at all no but the islanders themselves are mostly first generation Britons. I don't really see the opinion that Britain will decline to a point where being an Argentine national is preferable as being credible.

Argentinian Invasion Plan, take II:

1) Discover oil fields near the islands
2) Britain hires American companies to drill there
3) American companies import workers from Latin America
4) Wait till the number of Spanish-speakers on the islands grows larger than the number of British loyalists
5) Claim rights for "self-determination"
6) Watch the UK (if it still exists) government crap its underpants
7) Repeat in the American southwest.

 

[Aleenik]

The Falkland Islands should belong to everyone, achievable in a united communist Earth.

 

[imperialman]

No, we can't, actually. There's a theorem of rationality called Aumann's Agreement Theorem which shows that no two rationalists can agree to disagree. If two people disagree with each other, at least one of them must be doing something wrong.

I'm quite happy to be wrong about this, but I'm not sure you'll be.

You, for certain reasons, believe the UK will decline immensely. I, for certain reasons, believe it will not. This thread is about the Falkland islands, not the future status of the United Kingdom.

 

[aelf]

On the contrary, what I've been saying has everything to do with the Falklands. Mind you, my first comment was about how Argentina can legitimately claim the islands as their territory, and that's what you responded to. And my view is that it's entirely possible that the economic clout of the UK will be significantly reduced relative to Argentina's such that it will be more economically beneficial for the islanders to want to be part of the much nearer country (even if the UK still has quite a lot of clout).

 

[imperialman]

On the contrary, what I've been saying has everything to do with the Falklands. Mind you, my first comment was about how Argentina can legitimately claim the islands as their territory, and that's what you responded to. And my view is that it's entirely possible that the economic clout of the UK will be significantly reduced relative to Argentina's such that it will be more economically beneficial for the islanders to want to be part of the much nearer country (even if the UK still has quite a lot of clout).

A fair point then, I had misunderstood your intentions. I'm actually quite curious, what do you believe will cause the decline of the UK to such a level?

 

[Joecoolyo]

Just give us the islands, that way neither of you can have it.

 

[aelf]

A fair point then, I had quite misunderstood your intentions. I'm actually quite curious, what do you believe will cause the decline of the UK to such a level?

Its current direction plus relative sizes making it quite probable that Argentina will eventually catch up in the manner of the BRICs.

 

[Zelig]

Again, if the PRC decided they think Hawaii is PRC territory and began interfering with shipping and whatnot in Hawaiian waters and suggesting that the USA turn the territory over to the PRC, what exactly do you think the USA should do about it?

• Acquiesce to their 'suggestion' and turn Hawaii over the the PRC.

This one would be most hilarious.

And I'm all for hilarity.

 

[Winston Hughes]

it's entirely possible that the economic clout of the UK will be significantly reduced relative to Argentina's such that it will be more economically beneficial for the islanders to want to be part of the much nearer country (even if the UK still has quite a lot of clout).

Perhaps if Argentina hadn't tried to take the islands by force, against the will of the inhabitants.

Such things are not easily forgiven, let alone forgotten.

 

[Lillefix]

Too often, "the people who were there first" is taken to be synonymous with "the people who were there when Europeans first showed up".

It doesn't matter if some Argentines were living there before the British showed up, it's who's there now that matters.

Are you implying that Argentinians are not of European origin or am I misunderstanding something?