10 stupid questions

M

MachDelta

Chieftain
Joined
Apr 21, 2004
Messages
66
Just scribbled down some stuff I was wondering about in my third game here...

1) Does anyone know the formula(s) for bombardment? Units will say "Bombardment: 8", but that means nothing to me without knowin what is bombardment compared against (eg: Attack vs Defence, Bombardment vs ???)
Also, I was wondering if there are any sort of tricks to using bombardment weapons. I was just a wee bit frustrated/dissapointed to try seiging a city with 7 catapults and only have 1 hit. Seems like a waste to me - building some cheap units and throwing them at the city was a MUCH better method of wearing their troops down in the stone age. Anyone else find this? Or is my craptastic luck just following me around? I'm about to try again with some real artillery this time, hopefully they'll fare better.

2) Anyone have any tips or tricks for pacifying a strongly militaristic nation (Germany)? They seem to love shooting at anything that moves, and i'd kind of like to keep them safely off my back for a while, so I can take care of some other things without having to worry about being attacked by them. Especially since we share a LONG border, and any battle between us would be extraordinarilly messy and very resource draining for both sides.

3) Kind of an extension of #2, but i'll ask this seperately. When you sign an MPP with the AI, does that guarantee your safety? Or is it possible for them to backstab you and attack anyways?

4) Corruption. Ah yes. Anyone have any tips for dealing with corruption? I've got the palace and FP covering the main body of my empire, and courthouses and police stations in just about every city, but thats not the problem. The problem is, my few fringe cities off on islands or ones i've conquored absolutely SUCK. They're so corrupt they can't build anything in under 50 turns. They aren't producing, they aren't holding any critical resources... all they're doing is denying the enemy of land, and constantly tempting me to sink thousands of dollars into the stupid things to try and get them moving. Should I just give up hope of ever producing anything with them, or is there something I can do?

5) Speaking of forbidden palaces... When you conquor an enemy city with a FP in it, is the FP destroyed? Or do you get to keep it (and does it work)?

6) About buying tech from AIs: Is there any point to this? The only times I trade tech nowadays is for one of two reasons:
-Trading equal level techs with a #2 or #3 civ to try and catch up to #1's progress
-Bait the tiny empires into doing my bidding with stone age techs :p
But as for buying techs from #1? Its rediculous! They charge like 7000 for modern technology, when I could easilly try stealing it from them for $1500 a try. So all I do now is swipe techs from other countries when needed. If they get pissed off, I just send them some gifts so they'll shut up. In the end though, paying $3000 for two tries, and shipping some ivory off to heal the damages is WAY cheaper than paying up front. I used to buy some tech way back in the stone age, but ever since its just been stupidly unfeasible. Is this the way it usually works, or what?

7) Speaking of AI's and stealing techs, does the AI ever try to steal techs from YOU? I've never seen/heard them try.

8) Also speaking of AI's and techs, is there any way (clandestine or not) to tell what the AI is currently researching? Like I know you can investigate cities to see how far allong a wonder (or whatever) is - anyway to reveal their techs?

9) Just a quick question about a unit: Guerillas. Whats the point of them? They appear to suck, IMO. They're 6/6/1, and cost as much as infantry... which are 6/10/1. I think they're the same price too, the only other difference is that guerillas don't require rubber. Which is silly, because in my game only one nation (Spain) doesn't have a rubber supply. But seeing as how they only have 2 cities on a tiny island, its not suprising. So other than leaving you something to upgrade your medieval infantry to (expensively, I might add!), and giving the few "crappy & half-conquored" civs something to build after everyones moved on to nuclear weapons... why would anyone build these things? Because they look cool? :lol:

10) Last one. I searched around for this, but all I found is some conflicting answers. Its about resources: When a strategic resource (say, rubber) runs out and 'respawns' somewhere on the map, WHERE will it respawn?
a) Only where the terrain conditions are currently met (eg: Jungle)
b) Anywhere where the terrain conditions were at one time met (eg: terrain that used to be a jungle)
??
I'm just wondering if I should stop hacking down this huge friggin rain forest or not is all :)



TYIA everyone! :D
 
Let me answer some of your questions.

No. 3
No your not safe.It happened to me once.
I signed a MPP with a civ and the next turn they declared
war on me.

No. 4
Relocate your capital,somewhere in the middle of your
empire.Or switch to a communist government.

No 10.
Horses and Rubber don't expire,the other strategic
resources do expire and respawn at the original
terrain a tile contained,not after terraforming.
 
No 5.

Once you take a city the FP is destroyed. Civs are only allowed to have one FP. But if in C3C, under Communism civs can build a Secret Police HQ's which acts as a FP.
 
I can answer five of them.

Originally posted by MachDelta
5) Speaking of forbidden palaces... When you conquor an enemy city with a FP in it, is the FP destroyed? Or do you get to keep it (and does it work)?
Click to expand...
The Forbidden Palace is a small wonder. Like all small wonders, they're destroyed upon capture.

Originally posted by MachDelta
6) About buying tech from AIs: Is there any point to this?
Click to expand...
Buying techs is a vital part of the game if you are behind. Modern era technologies naturally cost a fortune, so buy them, steal them, or research them yourself.

Originally posted by MachDelta
7) Speaking of AI's and stealing techs, does the AI ever try to steal techs from YOU? I've never seen/heard them try.
Click to expand...
They do. You don't see the message because you never caught one...

Originally posted by MachDelta
8) Also speaking of AI's and techs, is there any way (clandestine or not) to tell what the AI is currently researching?
Click to expand...
As far as I know, no.

Originally posted by MachDelta
9) Just a quick question about a unit: Guerillas. Whats the point of them?
Click to expand...
You've pinpointed it: they're for nations who don't have rubber.
 
1 - Not offhand, but I think the "8" bombardment defense has to do with the bombardment attack (i.e., if it's less than 8, it'll miss, or miss more).

2 - Sign treaties (i.e., luxs, gpt, etc.) so that they're less likely to declare war on you. Build more military units, too.

3 - Nope. But it is a good way to ruin that AI's day (and rep) when you know they're going to attack.

4 - There's several ways to combat it. Courthouses, WLTKD (We Love the King Day - all happy and content people. Use temples, markets, cathedrals, etc. for this), government (republic and democracy are the best). Also, if you're using the 1.07 patch, then corruption is worse. Get the 1.29f patch if you haven't already.

5 - It's destroyed. It would be a game breaker if you kept it.

6 - There is a point. What you're seeing is tech depreciation. If only 1 civ has a tech, it's very expensive. If more have it, it's less expensive. Also, trading some techs to the AI for a large sum of GPT, it'll slow down their research so that they can pay you.

7 - Yes, I think they do.

8 - Yes, sort of. If you try to trade a tech to the AI every turn, and the price of that tech starts dropping, it means 1 of 2 things. First, the AI could be researching it. 2nd, other AI civs could have it (via their research, or trade, depriciating the price).

9 - It's for civs that don't have rubber. :) Try a game without the vital resources. You'll see that they come in handy for a "Poor Man's War".

10 - The resource will respawn on a tile that represented that origanal tile. i.e., say there's coal in the jungle, and the AI had 3 jungle tiles, but no coal. Even though the AI cleared those 3 jungle tiles, the coal can still relocate to that tile. You can see where the resource relocates by searching the map (CTRL-SHIFT-M helps). This requires knowing where the current resources are. So, don't worry about chopping down jungle. It'll still appear there, even though it's grassland.

Which brings up an interesting question... in C3C, if marshland can turn into coast, how do you get coastal oil if it re-appears there? ;)
 
Does marsh change to coast due to global warming?
 
Originally posted by Tatran


No 10.
Horses and Rubber don't expire,the other strategic
resources do expire and respawn at the original
terrain a tile contained,not after terraforming.
Click to expand...

I have had rubber sources be exhausted. What version of the game are you playing?
 
Thanks for the answers guys! :D

The only thing frustrating me right now is bombardment. I'm "trying" to lay seige to german cities, but its not working so hot. I've got maybe 35 artillery pounding away each turn, and maybe like a dozen bombers (yes yes, im building more), but they seem to miss a hell of a lot. I remember attacking one city with 7 artillery and 1 bomber... end result was that I took 1 heath off an infantryman. :eek:

I dunno, maybe its supposed to be one of those "ballance" things, but I fail to see how bombardment could 'miss' so often. If a battleship sat outside of San Francisco, randomly shelling it for a year straight... don't you think it would actually HIT something? :rolleyes: :lol:

Oh well.
/me starts researching nukes :p
 
Originally posted by Quasar1011
I have had rubber sources be exhausted. What version of the game are you playing?
Click to expand...

I'm playing Conquests with patch 1.15 .
The disappearance probability of rubber is 0.
 
1)In modern times, a good city bombardment with artilery would help to reduce the pop of that city, so therefore, the units guarding that city would have less defence resistance. In the previous ears, catapults/canons help your city's defence, without losing your defence units.

2)Try to always have some kind of trade with strong military nations(either with lux. or bribe them 1-2gpt: they don't easily declare when you give them gpt).

3)When having a MMP with multiple nations, if one declares to another nation, you must avoid to attack in enemy territory, only defend your ground:this way you avoid to be at war with third nations. You should always try not to have many MMP's, only MMP's with the with the 1-2 strongest nations. If you're strong enough(or too much strong) militarily don't even accept MMP's, as they'll get you into trouble sooner or later.

4)As other civfanatics suggested, relocate your capital in the middle of your empire, or avoid to built the FP until later in the game, and as much possible far away from your capital(so the cities far away get benefitted). Built courthouse's and police station's in your cities, and all the cultural improvements.

5)The captured FP is destroyed.

6)If they have a spy in your city and have the money they go for it. Plant a spy in the other nations and built the IA asap.

7)They seem to research first the advancements who allow them to built a Great Wonder.

8)Very often you NEED to buy a tech(to built units, or a GW). If you have researched a tech nobody knows, sell it for other techs and a whole bunch of cash: you can then increase your own tech rate as the other nations will pay you the gold. Always have them pay you gpt, not to risk a war from them.

9)If you are unlucky and don't have rubber inside your terittory, you'll be able to answer this question yourself. If you have the money to trade for rubber, do it: nothing better that infantry/mech infantry for defence.

10)The resources respawn randomly where the terrain condintions are currently met(oil, etc...) a sometimes where they are currently aren't(coal, rubber in a cleared jungle tile).
 
Originally posted by MachDelta
The only thing frustrating me right now is bombardment. I'm "trying" to lay seige to german cities, but its not working so hot. I've got maybe 35 artillery pounding away each turn, and maybe like a dozen bombers (yes yes, im building more), but they seem to miss a hell of a lot. I remember attacking one city with 7 artillery and 1 bomber... end result was that I took 1 heath off an infantryman. :eek:

I dunno, maybe its supposed to be one of those "ballance" things, but I fail to see how bombardment could 'miss' so often. If a battleship sat outside of San Francisco, randomly shelling it for a year straight... don't you think it would actually HIT something? :rolleyes: :lol:
Click to expand...

Yes, you'd think that if a Battleship sat outside a city and pounded it for awhile, something would get hit, wouldn't it...? :)

I'm no military expert, but the Civ3 bombardment model tries to strike a fine balance between realism and game balance. Thec crux is: You always need lots of artillery. The nice thing is that, unlike regular units, your artillery should last forever - unless the enemy gets incredibly lucky (or you didn't defend your artillery stack well enough), you should never lose any artillery, which means that you can accumulate obscene numbers of the things by the time that they really start to come into play (the industrial age, as soon as you get Artillery to replace those Cannons). Even though Artillery is the first bombardment unit which can really help your war effort, don't neglect catapults and cannons - yes, they only have a range of 1 (so you need to move them further), but they can help to soften up the defenders before you attack, which equates to less units lost. Even taking one or two health bars off a defender can dramatically improve your odds in an attack - try it out on a combat calculator and you'll see what I mean...

Remember that, when you tell a bombardment unit to target a city, it will randomly pick either the units, improvements, or citizens as its target. It will then "roll the dice" to see if it's hit or not. Citizens and improvements have a defence of 16 - so your Artillery stands about a 50% chance of missing. (Note: This may have changed in Conquests - there is a great thread on artillery use here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=25078 ). So between its random targetting of units, buildings and population, you will end up missing an awful lot. All the more reason to have lots and lots of artillery.

From what I've picked up by reading other players' comments, one of the easiest ways to use artillery is to combine them into one or two massive stacks of artillery plus a few very strong defenders (an army of Infantry? It's pretty much invincible, except by lots and lots of Modern Armour), move it two tiles away from the enemy city, and pound away until there is nothing left. Then move in with your units...

And one last thing - if you're playing C3C, bombers now have lethal land (and sea) bombard - yes, it's controversial, but it's also very very useful - given enough bombers, unless your enemy has AA units (which the AI rarely does), you can conquer cities without risking a single unit. Great, or what? :)
 
1) Usually it just luck. When it chooses the target and it isn`t in the city, you`ll miss it.

2) Trade and diplo. Trade for gpt. You pay for gpt. ROP or MPP is ok too. But this doesn`t always work. I`ve been attacked even when supplying lux to him. He just want to have it for himself.

3) No. When someone has a better offer, they may choose to backstab you. Or they may sign another MPP which can cause havoc in the long run when war happens. You know it, right?

4) Corruption. It`s always the huge debate thing (quote). In 1.15, FP just doubles the OCN and decrease a little corruption in cities near it. So, don`t surprise if you see even cities near to FP is highly corrupt especially after you exceed OCN number or in AA. Courthouse, police station and WLTKD are the ways to overcome this. Alas, they too cost you a fortune. Built FP in cities with about 50% corrupt and is sorrounded by other cities. After you get Nasionalism. Replaceble parts, you can turn citizens into polices and civil engineers to reclaim/get extra shields.

5) It is destroyed.

6) Buying is cheaper than research by yourself. You can hasten the tech pace too because you don`t have to research some other techs that have been researched by the AIs. Selling tech gives you lots of gpt so that you can research fast and still get some money. The only problem is on regent and below, AIs are usually so poor that they don`t have the money to pay you. I hate this!

7) Yes. I`ve seen a message once telling that one AI was trying to steal my tech but fail. Look into older thread.

8) No. They like techs that give new unit, wonder or government. When you have one tech that nobody has and try to sell it to one AI, look at the price they want to pay for some turns. If it gets cheaper, this can be the indication that they are researching that tech, broke or someone has already had it.

9) You need them badly if you don`t have rubber and nobody else wants to sell it. Resource in C3C is scarcer too.

10) Not sure. Usually in the terrain that match the requirement
 
I believe that an artillery bombard of 12 acts like an attack of an 12 offensive unit.

Against an Infantry in the open:

Probability of hit = 12 / (12 + 10) = 0.55

Now fortified: 12 / (12 + 10*(1+0.25)) = 0.49

Now behind a river: 12 / (12 + 10*(1.25+0.25)) = 0.44

Now in a fortress: 12 / (12 + 10*(1.5+0.5)) = 0.38

So, an arty will hit an infantry fortified in a fortress across a river only 38 out of 100 times.

Cities are similar, except you can hit other things besides troops - improvements, population. a 12+ pop gives a 100% defensive bonus!
 
Here's my stab at a few not answered:

Originally posted by MachDelta
1) Does anyone know the formula(s) for bombardment? Units will say "Bombardment: 8", but that means nothing to me without knowin what is bombardment compared against (eg: Attack vs Defence, Bombardment vs ???)
Click to expand...

There are three key variables in any bombardment attack: bombard value; rate of fire (ROF); and the defender's effective defense value. The bombard value is the "attack" value of the bombardment unit (i.e., 4 for a catapult, 6 for a trebuchet, etc.). The ROF is the number of bombard attacks the unit makes per turn (i.e., 1 for all bombard units until artillery when it grows to 2). The defender's effective defense is the defense value as adjusted for any modifiers (i.e., fortified, in a city, etc.) Bombard works similarly to regular attacks except there is no chance of the bombard unit being defeated. As an example, let's imagine an artillery (bombard 12, ROF 2) attacking an infantry fortified in a City on plains (effective defense of 18.5 due to defense of 10, fortification bonus of 2.5, plains bonus of 1, and City bonus of 5). When the artillery fires at the infantry, the bombard value of 12 is set against the effective defense of 18.5, menaing the chances of scoring a hit are 12/(12+18.5) or 39.3%. Each successful hit takes a HP from the infantry. With a ROF of 2, the artillery has two chances of taking HPs -- it can either miss completely (36.8% chance), take 1 HP (47.7% chance ), or take two HPs (15.4% chance).

[/b]10) Last one. I searched around for this, but all I found is some conflicting answers. Its about resources: When a strategic resource (say, rubber) runs out and 'respawns' somewhere on the map, WHERE will it respawn?
a) Only where the terrain conditions are currently met (eg: Jungle)
b) Anywhere where the terrain conditions were at one time met (eg: terrain that used to be a jungle)
??
I'm just wondering if I should stop hacking down this huge friggin rain forest or not is all :)[/b]
Click to expand...

Initial resource locations are assigned at the creation of a map. Oil, which may be found in marsh, will still appear even if the marsh has been cleared before the discovery of refining. However, once initial resources are uncovered, if the resource depletes it will reappear only in terrain that permits its presence at the time it reappears -- in other words, while an initial oil can appear in a grassland that was former marsh, a reappearing oil will not appear in a grassland even if that grassland was formerly marsh. As others have said, rubber never depletes, so no worry there.
 
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