AI Quirks (Not the Usual Complaints!)

[cgannon64]

What are some strange AI quirks that you've encountered? Here's mine:

I'm France, in a good starting positition. I have good grasslands and such around me. To the south of me is a wall of mountains a good 6-tiles thick. To the west of me is the English, hogging up good land. To the north and east is ocean. So, I decide to go to war to take the land. After driving the English into the mountains, leaving them one city, I decide to be allies with Germany, the 2nd strongest civ and the other civ on the continent. I offer them a RoP, to try to warm things up. Their response: "We would never sign that with you. You broke that same treaty with the English."

For the Record: I never had an RoP with the English.

What are your strange AI encounters?

PS-Don't make this an "I hate the AI" thread.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

the usual! The AI relationship calutalion is so badly shot......

It is considered breaking a treaty when you attack without declaring war before via F4, it seems!

been there, seen that, gotten so pissed I nuked the world

 

[TheNiceOne]

I guess you entered English territory before declaring war? Not even Germany did that before declaring war against Poland in '39.

So what you did wasn't technically an abuse of RoP, but you made clear that your units shouldn't be trusted inside other countries' territory.

Next time, declare war without any units inside enemy territory, then enter his territory. You'll lose a turn (and much of the surprise factor), but you keep your reputation.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

TheNiceOne: you are exactly right, the problem here being that an AI doing the same thing to you is not considered a deal breaker by other AI - even if they break an MPP or gpt deal.....

So I guess it is OK as it is for the human, just make it the same for the AI - or vice versa

 

[maddskillz]

IF I have units in the AI's territory, and he has units in mine, I ask him to leave and he declares war who's rep suffers?

 

[D9phoenix]

Maddskillz: His reputation because he was the one who declared war.

I really haven't found any weird qurks yet, i just get annoyed that the AI's will remember something you did 4000 years ago and still complain about it. I really think there memory should be limited to 100 turns. That would still allow the AI to punish you but not indefinetaly.

 

[Gastric ReFlux]

I feel the real problem is that the AI haven't ever learned to express their anger in a timely and constructive fashion. So all their anger sits underneath. If they could just learn to express how they feel, they could probably get over slights in the Ancient Times much faster.

And a good anger-management class would help. They also have severe self-esteem issues.

 

[Jason Fox]

Originally posted by D9phoenix
Maddskillz: His reputation because he was the one who declared war.

I really haven't found any weird qurks yet, i just get annoyed that the AI's will remember something you did 4000 years ago and still complain about it. I really think there memory should be limited to 100 turns. That would still allow the AI to punish you but not indefinetaly.

I agree, something to make it at least sensible. The AI knows we're trying to win and that often means wiping them out, but this idea that they can never sign agreements because I started a war with a now defunct civ 4000 years ago is the extreme case and, if anything, will move them up on the "To be attacked" list whereas an equitable trade agreement might drop them to the bottom.

 

[Jaybe]

And some players will hold a grudge against [Joan, Elizabeth, Cathy, Xerxes, ...] over how many GAMES?

 

[sappling]

The AI keeps demanding beer from me. Is that normal?

 

[GodsPetMonkey]

Hmmm, my weirdest AI bug has to be when nearly all the opposing civs decided to take up a one city challenge.

Dunno why, but no-one, except me and the Aztecs to my north, expanded, at all, that game taught me that maybe settler spam is not a bad thing.

Wish I had a screen shot of the map, maybe I got a save somewhere....

Needless to say, it was also one of the easiest conquest victories I have ever had.

 

[Zouave]

Originally posted by cgannon64
What are some strange AI quirks that you've encountered? Here's mine:

I'm France, in a good starting positition. I have good grasslands and such around me. To the south of me is a wall of mountains a good 6-tiles thick. To the west of me is the English, hogging up good land. To the north and east is ocean. So, I decide to go to war to take the land. After driving the English into the mountains, leaving them one city, I decide to be allies with Germany, the 2nd strongest civ and the other civ on the continent. I offer them a RoP, to try to warm things up. Their response: "We would never sign that with you. You broke that same treaty with the English."

For the Record: I never had an RoP with the English.

. . .

Are you kidding? Is all this "news"??

It has been well-established in numerous posts going back months that REPUTATION IS A BIG CROCK.

Not only does the AI remember stuff you allegedly did THOUSANDS of years earlier (which is ridiculous and unrealistic) it blames you for stuff you NEVER did!

I have been ATTACKED by civs for NO reason; defeat them; and I'm generous with the peace when they ask for it. Two thousand years later some new civ will insult me and cancel some tech deal because I threw into AS A FREE BONUS some resources citing "my perfidy" or "broken deals" with that civ that attacked me.

It is all garbage, and another way to screw the human. And Firaxis won't fix it.

I don't know which is worse: This AI or Jar Jar Binks. (If you saw Episode 2 it is all Jar Jar's fault, if you recall his Senate speech).

 

[Evie]

Zouave, the day you point to me a country which has been ruled by the exact same person for six thousand years I'll point to you a country which has been holding grudges for milleniums.

Seriously, you can't ask hyper-realism when the *BASIC PREMISE* of the game is that you will rule a tribe throughout six thousand years and more - you would be dead by the second or third turn of the game. Boring, wouldn't it be?

As for the AI holding against you things you "didn't do", most of it has been explained away as well. In some case, you get the blame for things you had no control over, true, but it's not like THAT never happened.

Get blamed for breaking a trade pact when you faithfully kept your end of the bargain? A barbarian (or other nation) probably moved in and cut your trade line for a while. Get blamed for breaking a ROP you never had? You more than probably attacked without a declaration of war. Japan didn't break a RoP with America, but Pearl Harbor sure as heck was a reputation hit.

 

[D9phoenix]

Jaybe: Of course, you can't trust them once they break that trust. They are programed to always act the same way ... that's my story and im sticking to it. NEVER TRUST the FRENCH or the GERMANS!!!

One thing did come to mind though, Not so much a bug.. but has anyone else notice that the germans always seem to annihilate themselves in the mid to late industrial age ???

 

[Zouave]

Originally posted by D9phoenix
Maddskillz: His reputation because he was the one who declared war.

I really haven't found any weird qurks yet, i just get annoyed that the AI's will remember something you did 4000 years ago and still complain about it. I really think there memory should be limited to 100 turns. That would still allow the AI to punish you but not indefinetaly.

Blaming the human for stuff he NEVER did, or hating the human for thousands of years because he made a separate peace before the 20 turn period with an ally, not only stinks and is stupid, it is just another form of AI cheat.

 

[Evie]

If you betray someone, that someone is not going to thrust you again.

IRL, nations "get over it" after a while, but IRL, nations don't have the same ruler for 6000 years.

You're pretty sad if you must call this "AI cheating" when on the other hand some players know perfectly which AI to expect betrayal and threats from and which is more trustworthy.

SHould we call it human cheating? It's a matter of balance, Zouave.

 

[Chris_b_89]

"As for the AI holding against you things you "didn't do", most of it has been explained away as well. In some case, you get the blame for things you had no control over, true, but it's not like THAT never happened."

Different countries see things in different ways IRL too. The English don't necessarily see themselves as the bad guys in the Revolutionary War. Look at all the controversy over the Civil War and Confederate flag more than a hundred years later. Many Southerners still hold a grude for perceived wrongs, while many Northerners consider Lincoln a hero; it's all a matter of perspective.

Even if you were completely "in the right" in a particular war; if they were or are allies with the nation you went to war with, they may still take their side. (And there are always to sides to an argument).

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

but, Chris, IRL political leaders do change, and so do grudges held by them. also, there's always many voices, and there's realpolitik - which is missing in Civ3 between human and AI, but is present between Ai and AI. That is the point here, the AI will deal with a untrustworhty AI, but not with a 'clean' human!

 

[sumthinelse]

Originally posted by Oda Nobunaga


As for the AI holding against you things you "didn't do", most of it has been explained away as well. In some case, you get the blame for things you had no control over, true, but it's not like THAT never happened.

Get blamed for breaking a trade pact when you faithfully kept your end of the bargain? A barbarian (or other nation) probably moved in and cut your trade line for a while.

And you approve of the way this works? The lesson is that you should not trade resources with the AI?

I wish that it were possible to go from war to peace and actually live in peace in civ3, but to do that I have to go back to civ2 or SMAC. No, in civ3, I have to hunt down the last settler and annihilate the other civ once a war starts.