spleen1015
Regent
I'm a builder by nature. I'm getting waxed on Regent level. I try to avoid conflict at all costs, but it doesn't seem to prevent the eventual attack.
Should I always prepare for war?
Should I always prepare for war?
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Always prepare for war?
- Thread starter spleen1015
- Start date
I had the same problems you do when I moved to Regent too!
The problem is that as a builder, you wont have a lot of military, which will make your civilization look weak. The AI at higher levels loves to attack the weak civs, so this might have something to do with your problems!
I normally "solve this" by letting 1-2 (depending on my land size) cities produce a Barracks and then constantly spit out military units only, while the other cities are producing Settlers, Workers etc. in the early game.
If you have 1-2 Spearmen per city, in addition to 12-15 attacking units standing by, you wont be attacked that easily
Remember; when moving to Regent, focus more on the military in the beginning. ONLY build the most necessary improvements (like a Granary in your Settler factory/ies and Barracks in your Military factory/ies.
This strategy may sound boring/stupid, as you of course would like to build Improvements instead to increase your culture - but once you have about 15 attacking units, you can attack your neighbour in the early stages - which means you'll snatch a few nice cities from him/them to help with your expansion
Oh, and one more tip: To determine how weak you are compared to the other civs, check the "Best Cities Of the World / Demographics" screen - and look at Military Service. Being dead last here is - needless to say - very bad at Regent or above.
The problem is that as a builder, you wont have a lot of military, which will make your civilization look weak. The AI at higher levels loves to attack the weak civs, so this might have something to do with your problems!
I normally "solve this" by letting 1-2 (depending on my land size) cities produce a Barracks and then constantly spit out military units only, while the other cities are producing Settlers, Workers etc. in the early game.
If you have 1-2 Spearmen per city, in addition to 12-15 attacking units standing by, you wont be attacked that easily
Remember; when moving to Regent, focus more on the military in the beginning. ONLY build the most necessary improvements (like a Granary in your Settler factory/ies and Barracks in your Military factory/ies.
This strategy may sound boring/stupid, as you of course would like to build Improvements instead to increase your culture - but once you have about 15 attacking units, you can attack your neighbour in the early stages - which means you'll snatch a few nice cities from him/them to help with your expansion
Oh, and one more tip: To determine how weak you are compared to the other civs, check the "Best Cities Of the World / Demographics" screen - and look at Military Service. Being dead last here is - needless to say - very bad at Regent or above.
I usually prepare for war since 4000BC. There are many type of wars but I think the most imporant war of all is the ecomonic war. It's usually from 4000BC to 400AD. IMO, we must win the ecomomic war and dominate the global ecomony before consider taking military action to acquire more land. Once we dominate the global ecomony, it's much easier to form military alliance, etc.
Ive just won about my 4th game on Regent, and from my experience you have to cut down on your building. One of the reasons people get stuck in Chieftain is that they try building every improvement in every city and it's simply not necessary. Try playing as a warmonger and you'll see an improvement in your performance. Once youve made your initial moves, decide on how you're going to win and what your next goal is. For example, if you find a Civ very early on (i.e. within 10 turns from the start), build 3-4 archers and rush their capital. You will have taken out a Civ in one fell swoop! Mini goals could be obtaining lux, resources, slowing down a rival by getting the AI to fight each other, a choke point, or whatever. Try and time these with the best attackers - Swordsman, Knights, Cavalry, Tanks, MA, or your chosen UU's era. Only build necessary improvements, and capture GWs rather than build them, although I must admit Statue Of Zeus was a decisive factor in my last victory (I also had 80% of the world's Iron too). I think Ill be playing Regent for some time yet though as the AI bonuses in Monarch look like a lot for me to overcome. Happy hunting
There is no question that no matter what your style and what you wish to accomplish, war is inevitable and a strong military is your utmost top priority, and its degree of top priority increases with difficulty level.
A strong miltary is important not only for defending what's yours, but also for diplomacy, especially when opposing civs attempt to extort things from you.
A strong miltary is important not only for defending what's yours, but also for diplomacy, especially when opposing civs attempt to extort things from you.
scoutsout
Minstrel Boy
Oh yes! Even if you don't go on the offensive, you should prepare for war. There were a couple of other thoughts in here...
This is good advice. I'll add to it. Cities that can't grow past size 6 without an aqueduct, that produce a lot of shields. These make good "unit factory" sites in the early game.
@ Berrern: if you're talking about good defensive units in the border cities I'll go along with that. 1-2 defensive units in all of your cities can get costly in some forms of government.If you have 1-2 Spearmen per city, in addition to 12-15 attacking units standing by, you wont be attacked that easily
The best advice in that is to have some offensive units. Although a Horseman does not appear to be a good defender, a stack of horsemen in a city can skirmish a stack of slow moving units into the ground. (Leave city, attack, return to city, heal....)
I respectfully disagree.
In any of my games, my military has always been the weak (if not the weakest). However, my ecomony is usually strongest in compare with the AIs. May be this example will help demonstrate my point. For example, you have the weakest military and the AIs are starting to demand gold from you. Btw, the more you have, the bigger amount they will demand from you. Let's say they demand 300 gold from you or else! In this case, just simply pay them up. Since you have a strong ecomony, 300 gold is really just a little drop in the ocean full of water. If you take 300 gold and divide that by 20 turns (surely, they won't demand anything again for at least 20 turns), that means you are paying them 15 gpt to keep the peace. On the other hand, there is no way you can maintain a strong army for as little as 15 gpt. In the worse case, all the AIs are demanding money from you - take 15 gpt * 10 assuming you are playing against 10 AIs = 150 gpt for peace. 150 gpt is really equal to nothing. When you are at peace, your people are usually happy and happy people mean more gold income for you, etc. Overall, you are much better off just to have a strong ecomony than a strong military. Like in the real world, Money = Power. It may not buy true love, but it can definitely buy a lot of friends and power.PS: Please note that in order to focus 100% of all your resources to build a strong ecomony, you have to give up research as well. Don't waste time building library and university unless you want to win by culture or something.
The Commander
Warlord
Just out of curiosity Moonsinger, what difficulty are you playing on? Are you setting AI's to least aggressive or something? Because on Monarch and above, maybe even Regent, you WILL get smoked by the AI if your military is the weakest, regardless of how much money you've got. Giving in to their demands might stave off war, but eventually some aggressive Civ will just bum-rush you, at which point you'd better hope you still have enough money after bribing off the AI to pay other Civs to fight for you.
scoutsout
Minstrel Boy
Actually, it's possible to win without any military. Here's an amusing one Charis played titled "The Mongolian Peace Corps".
(And, IIRC, Moonsinger is a strong player who has won a few GOTMs...)
Tomoyo
Fate
That's because Charis is crazy and he got lucky a few times. (And because he is Charis) If Russia had not made peace or Mr Pindleton got a bad RNG roll?
Mostly Sid these days. Yes, I'm guilty of setting the AI to least aggressive mode at the moment.
However, I don't think that would make much different because I had played a lot of Deity game in PTW where the least AI aggressive mode isn't available. Giving in to their demands might stave off war, but eventually some aggressive Civ will just bum-rush you, at which point you'd better hope you still have enough money after bribing off the AI to pay other Civs to fight for you.
Since the AIs do not demand for what you can't give. If you have nothing, they do not ask for much.
Btw, just to show that I wasn't kidding about not focusing on research, you may want to check out this SAV:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MoonsingerPollutionSample.ZIP
It's a sneak preview of my current Sid game on huge map. It may take forever to load if your computer isn't powerful enough.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MoonsingerPollutionSample.ZIP
It's a sneak preview of my current Sid game on huge map. It may take forever to load if your computer isn't powerful enough.
The Commander
Warlord
Well i definitely give you credit for playing at SId level, i'm still on Emperor, but I mean, if they aren't demanding anything from you because you don't have dirt....... well, you still don't have anything for yourself. Come on, stand up to those bullies, have some pride!
ANd not having anything has never stopped the computer from rolling over me
ANd not having anything has never stopped the computer from rolling over me
I've been playing as a warmongerer lately and it's loads of fun. I'm even using artillery for something more than decor! One thing I've learning to do is build a small, efficent nation, and then take what you need. I have seven or so wonders now (middle ages) and none of them were built by me. )
One thing I've learning to do is build a small, efficent nation, and then take what you need. I have seven or so wonders now (middle ages) and none of them were built by me. )
Just a random tester's note. Did you know that if you play on chieftain level with least agressive AI, that the AI probably won't found their 2nd city until REALLY late into the game? (atleast in one game I tested...)
Oh, I even tried a OCC on demigod level - with most agressive AI (managed to fend off an attack AND alliance against the superpower, Greece. Wound up signing peace, giving Greece a rephit with Russia. They never recovered, since Russia fought them for the rest of the game). That was a hair-raising game, but atlest the Statue of Zues and Knight's Templar helped.
Oh, I even tried a OCC on demigod level - with most agressive AI (managed to fend off an attack AND alliance against the superpower, Greece. Wound up signing peace, giving Greece a rephit with Russia. They never recovered, since Russia fought them for the rest of the game). That was a hair-raising game, but atlest the Statue of Zues and Knight's Templar helped.
scoutsout
Minstrel Boy
Lemme get this straight, you built SoZ and Knights Templar, on Demigod, in a OCC? Daaaaang, I knew you were good (
) ... and to think I felt silly about "wasting 3 shields" on SoZ in a recent Emperor level SG...
Originally posted by The Commander
Well i definitely give you credit for playing at SId level, i'm still on Emperor, but I mean, if they aren't demanding anything from you because you don't have dirt....... well, you still don't have anything for yourself. Come on, stand up to those bullies, have some pride!
I think you are missing my point.
There are time we need to kiss someone feet and give in to all their demands, and there are time we need to just focus on doing just one thing (that mean giving up military and research and strictly focus on the economy). No matter how good we are, we can't possibly doing everything all at once. The economy is key to any Conquest victory down the road. PS: Have you seen/read "Back to the Future" trilogy? It's kind of like that. Just because they are bullies, doesn't mean we have to fight them when there are so much else we can do. Let's take care our econmy first, make our citizen happen, make our nation strong before wasting time on war whenever the bullies walk by. The bullies will be punished in the end.
Originally posted by scoutsout
Lemme get this straight, you built SoZ and Knights Templar, on Demigod, in a OCC? Daaaaang, I knew you were good (
I was lucky enough to have the only sources of ivory in my area - it was a tiny map. The Great Library is still pretty easy to get, since the AI rarely researches it. My attempt was at a 20K challenge (I might have barely made it had Russia and Greece not had that blood fued... Victory was in the late 1900s-2100 I think.). Although, I was worried about a potential AI space victory. (They were starting to break out in front in techs after my Great Library expired).
No.
After you did some scouting in the beginning and
you noticed you are alone on your large island/
small continent just settle the whole continent
and research the republic ASAP.
I totally agree with Moonsinger,a strong economy
makes the difference.If an AI declares war on me
I always make alliances against them and pay gpt
and let the other AIs do the dirty work.That will
keep them busy.And you also don't have to worry
about an alliance against you.
SimpleMonkey
King
I dunno. I may not be anywhere near playing on Emp. or Deity, but in any successful game I've had so far, the only way I've survived is by preparing for war to keep the peace. AI only respects a strong military. I had a great game going as the Babylonians and thought I had a strong army, but a lot of it got eaten up in a pre-emptive war with Germany. I eliminated Germany as a threat, but the same turn that I took Berlin was when swarms and swarms of immortals started pouring over my border. I had peace treaties with Persia and trades going on and they were gracious to me and everything, but as soon as they smelled weakness, they came in and tore me up. Better to have a hefty military ready to go than to let all your beautiful library and cathedral filled cities get over-run. And it seems to me that you usually need more military than you think. IMHO.
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