Conquest 06: First Spoiler

[DBear]

CONQUEST OF THE MONTH 6, CONQUEST CLASS, NoAIPatrol=0--DBEAR'S JOURNAL

4000BC: See fish and wine near start. Worker heads north, to the wine. Scout follows the coast south, curragh goes north. Settler builds Lisbon, starts warrior. We maximize tech, going for writing, then mapping.

3750: First warrior is finished, start another. Worker starts mining to max production, scout discovers plains east of mountains.

3550: 2nd warrior built, start on granary. I need population.

3450: Curragh sights a Spanish warrior. Trade pottery + 10 for ceremonial burial. Mining is done. I send worker to road and mine n of wine. Next city will be built 3 n of Lisbon along coast. This will take advantage of rivers and bonus grasslands.

3400: Curragh finds Madrid. They have ivory.

3150: Barbarians seen near southeast coast.

3050: The Seljuks teach us Bronze Working. Curragh sights our scout along east coast. Our continent appears to be very small. Does the Seljuk appearance mean that one of our rivals is Middle Eastern?

3000: Tacitus reports that we are the wealthiest. Our rivals are the Maya (I HATE playing against the Maya, but sedimentary barbarians should neutralize their advantage), Spanish, Romans, Koreans, Arabs, Greeks, and English.

2950: Tundra island sighted off east coast. It has a barbarian camp.

2900: Scout finds lake with ivory nearby around southeast of our continent. The mining of the wine is done, worker starts to mine north of the wine. Lisbon needs 23 shields to build granary, at 4 spt. So I plan to whip next turn.

2850: My previous analysis is correct. I whip, then next turn Lisbon starts on settler. Our scout finds the Huns, they build our 2nd city Oporto on the other side of the continent! Curragh finds a settlement on the ne tip. Oporto starts building a warrior. I didn't particularly want a city here.

2550: We have circumnavigated the continent.

2430: Guimaraes founded 3 tiles north of Lisbon along coast. They start building warrior. We finish learning writing, start on mapping, and we open an embassy to Spain. They are building a settler in Madrid within 5 turns.

2390: Probably a mistake, but we trade writing to Spain for the wheel + 20 (best I could get--couldn't get Warrior Code). I wanted to know where the horses are, and the only ones are near the other side of the continent in the east.
2150: Silks are found in the center of the continent.

2110: Guimaraes builds warrior, starts worker. Spain is sending out warriors to explore.

1990: Curragh survives a turn at sea. Pliny ranks the world powers. Spain is first, Maya (damn 'em) 2nd, we are 3rd.

1830: It looks like the Spanish are racing us to the horses. We're going to win, though. Lagos founded. Guimaraes finishes warrior, starts on grainary.

1600: Checked F8: 2% land, tied for lead with Spain. 17% population, Spain has 21%. Culture is equal, Spain is ahead in score 157-130. Worker starts mining gold mountain. Curragh at nw point.

1500: Curragh sinks in sea. We learn mapping, start on ironworking.

1475: Unfortunately, Spain also has mapping. We have nothing to trade. Lisbon completes settler, starts galley.

1275: Emerita founded, starts warrior. We maximize production, which means slow pop growth. Lisbon finishes galley, starts spearman.

1225: Settler heads east. The damn Spanish have built Salamanca to grab the silks.

1200: We learn iron working, start Philosophy. Naturally, we don't have any iron while the Spanish have one just outside Madrid. I am starting to hate this game.

1150: Gold mountain is mined, worker heads south of Lisbon. Madrid has built the Colossus. I thought the science leaders were turned off?

1075: We are technologically backward, militarily weak, with no iron. This is why I stay on regent.

1050: We see if we can get RoP with Izzy. She wants 50 gold. Spain is up Masonry, Warrior Code, Philosophy (so much for that idea), and Mysticism. We decide Izzy doesn't need another 50 gold.

1000: Guimaraes finishes temple, starts galley. Settler reaches horses. Spearman stops 3SE, 1E of Emerita for future city site. Emerita is connected by road. Spanish build Murcia 5S of Lisbon.

(Note: I have 5 towns, about to build a 6th. I have 2 grainaries, a temple, and a barracks. My techs are Bronze, Iron, Pottery, Alpha, Writing, Mapping, Wheel, CB. Spain is my only contact & I have an embassy.)

975: Sagres is built, starts warrior. Workers start chopping forest se of Emerita. 2nd ivory roaded, start irrigating.

925: Lagos starts barracks. Emerita finishes spearman, starts another. Forest chopped. We learn Philosophy, start on Warrior Code.

900: Worker starts chopping forest near future city site to prep them for temple. We have to flip Murcia.

850: Guimaraes finishes galley, starts lighthouse. 6spt. Leiria built 3NW of Oporto, starts temple. Worker starts roading sugar north of Leiria. Eventually will connect to Sagres.

775: Spanish found Valencia 5SE, 1S of Lagos, just south of future city site. They're getting annoying. Whip barracks in Lagos.

730: Chichen Itza builds Pyramids. Sagres finishes warrior, starts settler.

670: Scout lands on tundra island, gets conscript warrior. Lagos finishes worker, starts archer. Lagos worker goes SSW to mine. Lisbon finishes settler, starts archer.

610: Copan has finished the Oracle. Evora built 2W of Valencia, starts temple.

550: Madrid builds the Mausoleum. Whip Coimbra to get temple.

510: Lagos builds archer, starts settler. Athens has built the Great Wall. Start roading between Coimbra and Murcia.

470: We trade lit for mysticism + 60. They are still up horseback and math.

450: Coimbra expands culturally. The suicide run is successful, land sighted. We contact Arabia, trading writing + 80 for Polytheism and Mathematics. We have just enough money to open an embassy. Mecca is 45 turns from the ToA. Just discovered I blundered with the whip at Sagres. They need 6 more turns to get the population needed to build the settler.

410: Lisbon builds settler, starts another settler. We need to get Oporto connected up so we can build the SoZ. Oporto is way too corrupt. Guimaraes is now at 11spt, 12 turns away from Lighthouse.

290: Whip Emerita for temple. Faro built between Sagres and Leiria, starts spearman. If someone beats us to the lighthouse, the SoZ is available as consolation.

270: Emerita starts granary. Rio Janeiro built between gold mountains north of Guimaraes. Galley rounds ne of 2nd continent and finds the Koreans. We make a BIG trade, giving Lit, Mapping and Philo for Monarch, Currency, and Horseback. Science leader sez now we're advanced. Still worried about not having iron, but I haven't seen any sword-rattling by Spain yet.

250: Lisbon starts the SoZ. We decide to delay switching to Monarchy until the Lighthouse is done. The lighthouse would give us a Golden Age.

170: Lisbon switched to library. Guimaraes finishes Lighthouse, starts ToZ. We get the golden age. Evora starts barracks.
We start switching to monarchy. We get 5 turn anarchy. Workers road mountains nw of Faro, extend road to Braga. Rio Janeiro connected by road to Lagos, start roading to Guimaraes.

70: Anarchy ends. We are now making 12 per turn, 3 from Code of Laws.

50: Santiago gets the ToZ. How on earth did they pull that off? Guimaraes, at 18 spt, goes for Great Lib. Lagos finishes spear, starts horseman.

30: Spanish built Pamplona in tundra north of Sagres. We need military, but we have no iron. I notice that Madrid has 8 pop, so I check with them, they have Construction, but won't trade. If we had iron, they would be asking for trouble.

10BC: We get laws, start construction. Izzy still won't trade construction straight up. Oporto rushes a settler for 48 gold. We have 18 left. At 80% tech, we are making 3/turn.

50: Madrid gets ToA, Chichen Itza gets Hanging Gardens. This is driving me nuts. Lagos starts settler, Faro starts temple. According to military advisor, our military is now comparable to Spain's. We have to cut back our science a notch to pay for the military.

130: Lagos expands, finishes settler and starts a grainary. Luanda built, start temple. Pamplona expands.

150: Barcelona gets the GL. This is ridiculous. We learn construction, enter medieval age, start feudal. Koreans already have it. Guimaraes switches to Palace to prepare for Sun Tzu. Just realized that I blundered with Luanda. I should've built inland. Vitoria, on tundra island, will expand with the ToA and probably flip Luanda. Arrrrgggh!

(I normally play on regent. My previous CotM I didn't do well, {started expanding waaay too slow} so I have no illusions of my ability.)

Maps below at 1000BC and at 150AD.

 

[dmanakho]

I don't see the point in playing gotm if you like lotteries.

Gotms are played to compare skill.
They are played for competetion.

Lets go give runners in the olympic games a backpack of random weight varying between 0 and 25 kilograms. Wouldn't that be fun ?

:shakehead

I've read your posts and i can somewhat understand your frustration.
But you totally miss the point on why we all like it here. Because it is fun, that is the main reason.
If you play this game as a competition between you and Klarius you probably should create your own web site and Gotms for people who see CivIII as a pure mathematical or olympic competition.
I have a feeling that for the most of the people here it is 99% fun and enjoyment and just 1% of a competition.

Lighen up, enjoy the game. If you don't get settler this time, you will get it next time, or may be time after next time, so what.

Personally, I hate when people try to put pressure on Ainwood and Co asking to change the rules of the game. Everybody is different, and those guys simply can't make everyone happy no matter what they do.
Again, CivIII is supposed to be fun, not a professional sport league.

 

[Sandman2003]

I have played past this point, so I qualify to read and comment in this thread. My thougts on the GH issue. I popped 5 huts, 4 in the AA for four useless maps, and one in the very early MA for 50g, probably as a way of the RNG apologising for the rubbish from all the other huts.

I think that WackenOpenAir makes a good point. It is not so much the existence of the GHs in combination with the expansionist trait, but the fact that it was also a food poor starting region, meaning that an early settler popped from a hut was a much greater benefit than it would have been under similar conditions but in a food rich start.

I forgot to keep a pop count at the QSC time period, but my other stats were 7 cities, 1 settler and 6 workers.

 

[Roland Ehnström]

I've read your posts and i can somewhat understand your frustration. But you totally miss the point on why we all like it here. Because it is fun, that is the main reason. If you play this game as a competition between you and Klarius you probably should create your own web site and Gotms for people who see CivIII as a pure mathematical or olympic competition. I have a feeling that for the most of the people here it is 99% fun and enjoyment and just 1% of a competition.

I agree with both you AND WackenOpenAir. You're absolutely right that fun is everything. If you're not getting payed for it and it is not helping anyone else, why do anything at all if it's not fun? That's my philosophy. HOWEVER, competition can be fun in itself! The competition aspect of the GOTM's, for me is a big part of what IS the fun in the GOTM's. Without competition, it wouldn't be much more than just playing the AI, and that, simply, is not as much fun to me. I like GOTM's to be very much about competition, because I find this kind of competition FUN. Randomness, on the other hand, is not much fun to me: It's just frustrating.

To be a little analytical, the decition we (or rather Ainwood and Alan) need to make is NOT a decition between "fun" and "competition", but rather a decition between "competition" and "randomness". We need to figure out what is more fun: "Competition" or "Randomness".

Disclaimer: This post was written under the influence of alcohol.

-- Roland

 

[Jason Fliegel]

Open class. I'm not sure what kind of victory I'll be going for -- I thought about cultural 20K, but I ran a test game with that and just got spanked. The Seafaring/Expansionist trait combo just isn't conducive to 20K, I think. My goal for the Ancient Age will be scientific development, building temples and libraries, and possibly snagging a wonder or two -- in short, I'm going to try to have it both ways (all ways?) and set myself up for a variety of victory conditions.

4000 -- Like so many of you, I sent my scout east then northeast. I thought long and hard about where to send my worker, but ultimately decided I wanted to settle on the river, so sent my worker to the wines. The settler moved northeast.

3950 -- The worker began building a road to the wines. The scout moved north onto the mountain. After trying to figure out if there was anything to lure my settler further inland, I decided there wasn't and settled. I started researching ceremonial burial on max research and started building a scout. Over the next few turns, my scout begins working his way northeast.

3700 -- Scout 2 is finished, and I start working my way south along the coast. I start building a barracks as a temple prebuild.

3500 -- Having finished Ceremonial Burial, I start working my way toward Code of Laws for the all important Republic Slingshot.

3350 -- My hopes are high as I find a Goody Hut, but alas -- it only gives me 25 gold. I guess that's better than maps.

2900 -- Wouldn't you know it: the next hut gives me maps. Where are my free techs!?! I've already discovered silks and ivory on my island. I should definitely be able to beat the Spanish to the silks, and hopefully to the ivory as well. If I can do that, I might be able to conquer the continent with ancient cavalry.

2630 -- A wrinkle: Spain has their own ivory. Still, if I secure my own source of ivory, all will be well.

2510 -- I learn Warrior Code from a Goody Hut. I was hoping for something I could trade with the Spanish (they have Warrior Code and Bronze Working, while I have Pottery), but it's better than more maps.

2390 -- Last month I notced there was a river with no mouth. This month, there's a river with two mouths right near Madrid. Interesting maps, ainwood!

2350 -- My settler heads east with a warrior escort.

2230 -- I found Oporto

1830 -- I found Guimaraes

1250 -- I found Lagos near the silks. The ivory have already been filled in by the Spanish, but they will be mine. Oh yes, they will be mine ...

1100 -- I win the Republic slinghsot and decide to revolt. I draw a 4 turn anarchy.

1000 -- I found Emerita. I didn't keep track of my QSC stats, but I think I have 5 cities at this point, all with some sort of military, plus a few temples and a granary (I think -- I'm doing this from memory at the end of the Ancient Age).

975 -- I found Sagres. After cultural expansion, it will have access to ivory, assuming I can crowd out the Spanish city it borders.

800 -- Time to do some dealing with Spain. I sell Writing for 44 gold and Bronze Working. Then I buy Iron Working, Mysticism and the Wheel in exchange for Philosophy, Code of Laws, and 113 gold.

510 -- Disaster! Sagres culturally flips to Spain! Even though I out-culture Spain 530 to 362. Why you crummy ...

230 -- I sell the Republic to Spain in exchange for 200 gold, Masonry, and Horseback Riding.

130 -- I meet the [Censored] on another continent. The only trade they'll make me is Mathematics for Philosophy. I hold off for the time being.

90 -- I meet a second [Censored] civ. They sell me Mathematics and 22 gold in exchange for Code of Laws. This gives them technological parity with their first neighbor.

50 -- I lose a galley in treacherous waters, just in sight of coastline. Darn.

310 AD -- I sell the [Censored] Currency in exchange for Construction and 37 gold, thereby ending the Ancient Age. So how did I do? 310 AD is kind of late, but not too late. I have 13 cities, a weak army, no wonders, and no iron. On the plus side, I've managed to box in Spain (they have 9 productive cities and one tundra-bound city). The plan for the Middle Ages (and we saw how well my Ancient Age plan went) is to build Knights Templar (I've got a prebuild going) and use the crusaders to take on Spain. Then I'll turtle up on my island and trade my way to a Space Ship or DIplomatic victory. Or who knows -- maybe I'll conquer the world. I'm thinking a cultural victory is unlikely at this point, though. We'll see how it goes.

Here's my map at the end of the Ancient Age.

 

[Sandman2003]

Open, NoAIPatrol=0 (FWIW with sedentary barbs)

First, I thought that this was a very cleverly set up map. Thanks Ainwood,

Instead of an easy settler pump, we had a food poor start versus a civ starting in a highly productive area. Second, they had iron, and we did not, and even horses were a race to secure the resource before Spain claimed both sources. Then of course there was the ivory right on Spain's door, meaning an inevitable confrontation with Zeus and Ancient cavalry, with only horses, or worse, archers, to combat them.

Then of course, there was the conundrum of being completely surrounded by ocean, rather than having trade friendly coastal connections, so the best scoring games would need to pursue a high tech pace to magnetism or navigation to benefit from off continent luxuries. Thus an encouragement for the space, diplo or 100K games over the rapid domination/conquest ones.

I, of course, ignored that and pursued a conquest victory!

Opening Moves
I moved the scout NE, E to the hill and the worker to the wine to start irrigation. The extra bonus grass revealed were an encouragement to move the settler N. Next turn, the scout revealed the forest, with the opportunity to chop and speed a granary build. Was this the beginning of anorther set of Ainwood breadcrumbs? I decided to move the settler again, staying on the coast, but bringing the forest into the extended borders of the captial. The worker had to start on a road. The crumbs, however, finished there, so I founded the capital in 3900BC and started on a two curraghs, a worker, then a granary.

Research
Research was a fairly standard max on writing, code of laws and philosophy for free republic slingshot in 1375BC. I held back on revoting for 3 turns because the double chance on the revolution doesn't seem to work on conquests, and I had two settlers almost complete. Then I drew 6 turns of anarchy to form the Portuguese republic in 1125BC.

I was able to trade for all other AA techs except currency and construction. I researched construction first, had I done it in the other order, I could have traded and saved half a dozen turns or so! We hit the MA in 320BC - not particularly spectactular!

Contacts
I produced a lot of curraghs, and lost a lot, often in sight of land. Fortunately, I did not waste shields on any additional scouts, as it would not have helped much. Our sole scout met Spain in 3250BC. One successful transcontinental curragh made contacts in 1425BC, 1200BC, 1100BC and 875BC. The other two civs eluded me until the MA, although I knew where they were!

QSC results
7 cities
1 settler
6 workers
1 scout
9 warriors
1 curragh

1 granary

Techs: BW, IW, Masonry, Alphabet, writing, code of laws, philosophy, republic, pottery, the wheel, ceremonial burial, mysticism.

In 320BC as we entered the MA, we had two luxes connected, and a supply of horses, building up a force to hit Spain. Here I made what I consider to be an error of judgement that affected my later game plans. A scientific civ needed only currency to enter the MA, and lacked the republic. I did not know the other sci civ at this time! I sold currency for a reasonable $ plus gpt - fair enough, though this in itself would speed the opposition's tech pace. Worse was to come. I traded the republic, $ and a large gpt to secure the sci civ's free tech of feudalism, forcing much slower research towards chivalry, and aiding our future enemies! For a faster conquest approach I suspect that these two trades would have been better avoided, or at least the second one!

 

[The Moose]

Chess has plenty of luck. Any time you make a decision based on what you think your opponent is most likely to do while also being aware of another possibility, you're taking a gamble and that's luck. If there were no luck in chess, there would be no need for best 3 of 5 matches, the best player would always win. Chess has far less luck than most things in life though.

I would argue that Chess has plenty of luck. There might be a small factor of "luck" when your opponent makes a mistake or falls into your trap but generally there's hardly any luck (only mistakes). Even choosing black and white is no luck as you know what you're dealt from the start. The best player always does win but the best player isn't always the same human being as personal daily conditions play an important role (but that's not luck either).

Anyway, I like the goody huts in GOTM/COTM and wouldn't want a change.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

OPEN - no ini tweaking (pointless with sedentary barbs anyways)

That's not true. It affects the AI Civ behavior as well. For example, when you go to war with Spain, they will permanently move their empty Galleys through your waters, messing up your Fishermen (but that's a smart move, I do the same ).
And, the AI gets less predictable - when they move units out of a border city towards you (but still in their lands), they don't necessarily will attack in 2 turns.
Really, the NoAIPatrol=0 setting adds a lot back.

 

[WackenOpenAir]

I would argue that Chess has plenty of luck. There might be a small factor of "luck" when your opponent makes a mistake or falls into your trap but generally there's hardly any luck (only mistakes). Even choosing black and white is no luck as you know what you're dealt from the start. The best player always does win but the best player isn't always the same human being as personal daily conditions play an important role (but that's not luck either).

Anyway, I like the goody huts in GOTM/COTM and wouldn't want a change.

I agree about your chess argues except that black/white certainly does have a big impact and will give the white playing the edge and possibly make him win even if he is not the best player at that moment.

About fun vs competition i only want to add:
Why do people here spend so much time creating systems to calculate Jason score, to register score, creating rules and assigning awards?
Competition is what makes game played, certainly when time passes by and players have already seen all the new things in the game. This is something most game developers are very aware of.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

I agree albeit a little halfheartedly with those who claim settlers/towns from GHs are unbalancing.
I think we have a problem with the competition when you can only pop 3-4 huts in the early game, no matter how well you play it, and those huts for some people yield a chance to jump the palace to a perfect settler-factory placement. I popped 4 huts and got maps and 3 techs. I will unvariably be a long way behind those who popped a settler from the hut on the mountain close to the cow (I replayed the opening and got the settler then).

My QSC ended with a lousy 5 cities (my worst QSC ever). I had revolted though and wasn't far off finishing the GLight which brought me and early and crucial GA to catch up with and subdue Spain.

I do play for fun, but like the right drunk gentleman from Sweden stated, competition is part of the fun for me. It's a bit of a drag to play on with a game thinking if only I had gotten that early settler...

However, I managed to bounce back from that and, having submitted, while playing the game in effect with only one trait (I could have traded for the first-level techs I got from the huts), I got my best gotm score ever.

I think it would detract from the game if we removed the expansionist trait altogether. I think Cotm1 was better balanced though, b/c the map had so many huts that everyone with basic scouting skills were bound to get something good.

Wacken: I don't think your represantation of # of citizens takes into account that better players are better at exploring, know that they have to switch builds away from settlers when popping huts and so on.
In short, better players will have a higher settler yield from huts, but to top that off, they have better starts to begin with. (I hate poor food starts, which probably account for much of the fact that I only have 5 cities at the end of the QSC).

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

I popped 4 huts and got maps and 3 techs.

...and you dare to complain?
What about 25gp and 2xMaps?

Nevertheless, I think it's fine to keep a few huts around. If you're solely playing for the score, you also don't have to pick Predator.
And believe it or not, before someone told me about the "Competition", I really believed people play GotMs for fun, to compare if different moves would yield better results, and to learn from others .

 

[Greebley]

I chose the Predator Save and settled in place

4000 BC: Start on Writing at full. Built a Scout, Curragh, Worker, Granary
Met Spain in 3500 BC.
Got a skilled warrior from a hut in 3200 BC.
Got Warrior code and Bronze working from Huts
Learned writing in about 2470 BC and started CoL, then Philosophy.
First settler wasn't until 2150 BC.

[Early War]
In 1830, Spain demanded writing and I refused. She declared war.
My capitol was large so I set it to building archers every two turns
I auto-razed Toledo in 1250 BC.
Got republic and revolted in 1175 BC.
Captured Barcelona in 1150 BC (cost 3 archers though) and got Myst, Wheel, Masonry for peace. Then trading for Iron Working, Mathematics, and HBR.

Became a republic in 1050 BC.

So my QSC was a weird one: Only 3 towns with one being Spanish. On the other hand, Spain had 4 towns with 3 being size 1. Only Madrid was size 6.

I redeclared war a short time later and took out Madrid. It flipped back on me and was a overly difficult to take out the second time (poor RNG). I broke deals doing this, but my plan was to destroy Spain before meeting anyone else to keep my rep intact.

By 370 BC, Spain was destroyed and I had 12 towns.

I entered the Middle ages sometime around 0 AD.

----------------
On the settlers in huts issue: Removing all the huts for an expansionist civ would be a bad idea IMO. There are plenty of games with an element of luck and Civ is one of them. Skill is still dominant. The top players in the end won't necessarily be those that got a settler - there are plenty of other parts of the game that can make up for an early settler. I believe there was/is a policy to remove huts that are 'too close' to the capitol. This seems the best solution to me.

 

[Felton]

I had alot of fun playing the game, as monarchy is not normally a challenge for me to win anymore (thats not to say I come close to any of the good players here), but this was as tough a monarchy game as I've had because nothing went right--

no goody hut settlers
Spain discovered philospophy the same time I discoverd COL, and I was max researching for a slingshot--I think they may have popped philosphy from a hut, as they had a warrior up north and I didnt get the scouts up there till later.
I had no horsies or iron, and Spain built Statue of Zeus as I started my archer attack
I almost got my butt kicked attacking Spain's capitol, which was on a hill, and had to advance in another direction to save my cats-- I think they had 8 spears defending the city, a couple of which I managed to promote to elite
My first curragh sank
No GL from the really nasty war against spain

I did manage to wipe out spain by the start of the middle ages, which was around 1700 a.d. (no, just kidding, but it was a. d. when I got there). I won the game, eventually, so yay me.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

...and you dare to complain?
What about 25gp and 2xMaps?

I'd take any amount of gold over 1st-tier techs (with Spain so close) as I knew I'd have a monopoly of 2-3 techs anyway

Nevertheless, I think it's fine to keep a few huts around. If you're solely playing for the score, you also don't have to pick Predator.

This was my first attempt at predator and, like I said before, my highest Gotm score ever. Sometimes predator helps you.

And believe it or not, before someone told me about the "Competition", I really believed people play GotMs for fun, to compare if different moves would yield better results, and to learn from others .

I play Gotms for fun, to compare moves, to learn from others and for the competition. I've never had a better Gotm result than ~ #20 so I'm not hardcore w/r to the competition by no means. But it helps me focus cause I hate loosing, even if I don't have much chance of winning a gotm

 

[n0xie]

My very first GOTM. Have been lurking quite a bit and hope to measure up to all the 'pro's' here Since it's my first try any commentary is well appreciated...

I made notes but somewhere in the middle I kinda forgot to add notes (too busy managing the civ I guess) so it's 95% complete.

Since everybody seemed to do the philosophy/republic gambit I figured I'd try it. I usually rush to monarchy then switch to republic halfway through the middle ages. I wonder if advantages of republic measure up to the unit upkeep. I mean I usually have an army of workers and at least 1 defending unit in each city.

Here goes

4000 - Setler NE, worker SE (BG), scout on a mountain
3950 - Lisbon founded, builds scout, worker starts mine on the BG, scout goes off to do it's job. Start with writing.
3600 - Lisbon builds scout -> warrior | worker mines/roads BG -> irrigate/roads wines
3500 - Lisbon builds warrior -> couragh
3450 - contact Spain
3400 - Hutt gives me maps
3300 - Lisbon builds couragh -> settler
3130 - Hutt gives me CB
2900 - Lisbon builds settler -> settler
2710 - Oporto founded -> warrior
2470 - Writing -> COL
2390 - Lisbon builds settler -> settler | Hutt gives me maps

Since Lisbon has 4 trade in it's home town square, and a river nearby I decide to try and race the Colossos and make Oporto my settler factory, although it does not have bonus food, it should be able to do fairly well with a granery

2310 - Oporto builds warrior -> granery

2070 - Guimaraes founded -> couragh
1750 - couragh1 starts suicide run
1700 - couragh1 survives (!) new land found
1650 - COL -> Philosophy
1450 - Contact XXX. Trade Writing for The wheel/BW/Mysticism
1425 - couragh2 starts suicide run. Philosophy -> Republic -> Literacy. Start revolt.
1400 - couragh2 joins the titanic
1325 - The republic of Portugal is a fact. Founded Emirita (luxery rush)
1300 - Contact YYY. Trade Writing for Iron Working/Masonry/WC + 10 gold. Lisbon starts Colossos
1200 - Coimbra founded (horse resource rush)
1150 - Sagres founded
1125 - Spain builds Colossos (at least I can capture it later ). Lisbon switches to temple
1050 - Contact ZZZ. Backward Civ. Trade Writing for Polytheism and 18 gold with Spain. Trade Philosophy for Horseback Riding with YYY
1000 - Republic is raping my gold. Workers and Spearman/warriors costs me too much money. Have to slow down science to pay for civ. Begin to start wondering if Monarchy isn't a better option or if I jumped to republic too soon.
950 - Lisbon finishes temple, start ToA in an attempt to compensate my settler rushes.
925 - Trade Polytheism + 60 gold for Mapmaking with YYY. Start Galley to populate island which has iron.
450 - Hutt on island gives me maps
410 - Middle ages

Somewhere in between 1400 I invented Mathematics/Construction/Currency. I had to set the scale up and down depending on city size and all that

A bit late compared to others but I don't think I'm doing all that bad. If I manage to get the ToA in, I think I can risk a republic war with Spain using knights hopefully (since there is no iron except for the one Spain already has).

Hi n0xie - welcome to the GOTM.

I edited your screeenshot, because the minimap was showing some spoiler info. By the way, I couldn't do anything to the image you were hosting on imageshack, so I just attached it to your post.

- ainwood

Oops sorry

 

[Randy]

Well my 2 cents on huts.

I got map, and 3x25gp. But thats fine with me maybe the next game I'll get a city or settler.

So please leave them the way they are.

 

[Darkness]

I just completely fail to see how people think this is just a bit lucky and find it to be acceptable after seeing the QSC differences in this thread.
This is not just a bit lucky, the free settler here has an impact certainly bigger than even en 8 turn anarchy vs a 2 turn anarchy. And i would certainly prefer a free settler over an SGL in this game.

i state the total population counts so far:

WITH free settler
28
24
18
33
(26 average)

WITHOUT free settler
15
15
12
(14 average)

What more do you need to be convinced ? This is no game, this is a lottery.

@wackenopenair:
I didn't get a settler either, but I still got 20 population I think. IMHO Ainwood's got it perfect like it is now. The removed GH close to the start provide some balance to the game (and the more remote ones benefit the players who take chances and go for max exploration), but the game would be a boring mathematics test if all chance-regulated parts were removed.

I despise maths, but I lke civ3. SO, please Ainwood, keep it like this!!!!

This is a competition, but I see it more like a chance to compare a game in which I have tried to play my best, with others who have done the same. I play for score (and I'm pretty decent at that, if I say so myself), but I don't mind being beaten by another player who's been a bit luckier. That's just the way a RNG based game is.
For me it's about performing my best and seeing where that gets me...
I didn't move the settler in COTM2 and I ended up 50th or so, whereas in the other COTMs so far I haven't finished below 4th (hope this doesn't sound to arrogant ), but I still had a great time playing COTM2. To me it was more fun than COTM5, where I ended up with a silver medal. Why? Because COTM2 taught me a lot and was far more difficult and it made me feel I had recovered well from a bad start (and I also got a few nasty surprises along the way), where COTM5 was just an easy breeze from a good start to a fast domination. There was no challenge, no surprises -> less fun...

Just my 2 cents...

 

[socralynnek]

Open class - NoAIpatrol=0

Not a very good ancient age

Settled north.

Early war with Spain, but I couldn't hurt them and when they had IroNWorking, I made peace with them.
And since they got SoZ, I wouldn't dare to attack them.
Researched Writing at min then CoL at max, but Spain researched Philosophy one turn before me...(maybe they got it from a goody hut)
3 huts and like DocTS, I only got maps and once 25g.
The first four curraghs sank before meeting anyone, so it was not until I could build galleys that I met the others. (Even one galley sank early on)

When I entered the MA, I had a few more cities than Spain, but since they were inTundra it was not that big help.

So, I said goodbye to my dreams of a very good score this time...

 

[Fat_Blerk]

Unlike most people here, I tried to destroy Spain as soon as I realised that they had all the horses and iron and ivory, and thought that I would never get anywhere unless I had them myself. I completely forgot Knights Templar ( doh! ), and of course I could have relied on upgrading to longbowman, but oh no, I made my one mission in the game to take Spains capital.

I had quite a good game in the meantime, winning the race to philosophy being quite lucky with the one curragh, discovering every civ and having some good trading.....meanwhile at home....around 40 dead archers and 20 dead horsemen later, I got so desperate to take Spains capital that I threw almost every piece of army that I had at them, and left my capital undefended. A Spanish spearman walked into it. ( double doh! ). I almost threw my laptop through a window, and quit the game.

Great fun though.

 

[bluebox]

welcome, noxie! your game is not too bad, indeed! I compared your key dates (getting republic, getting to middle ages) and they are good. moreover, you mangaged early sea exploration and found some others civs.

My very first GOTM. Have been lurking quite a bit and hope to measure up to all the 'pro's' here Since it's my first try any commentary is well appreciated...

I made notes but somewhere in the middle I kinda forgot to add notes (too busy managing the civ I guess) so it's 95% complete.

Since everybody seemed to do the philosophy/republic gambit I figured I'd try it. I usually rush to monarchy then switch to republic halfway through the middle ages. I wonder if advantages of republic measure up to the unit upkeep. I mean I usually have an army of workers and at least 1 defending unit in each city.

...............

1000 - Republic is raping my gold. Workers and Spearman/warriors costs me too much money. Have to slow down science to pay for civ. Begin to start wondering if Monarchy isn't a better option or if I jumped to republic too soon.

Starting with alphabet and doing the "slingshot", Republic is araound pretty early in c3c, indeed. the trade bonus (1 extra gold for every tile that pruduces gold) is likely to be eaten up by the unit support. but I would like to encourage you to try republic.
There is a way to overcome this adverse effect, this is, to grow your cities up to size 7+. cities with size 7 and more can keep 3 units free of cost. I try to found my cities near rivers and lakes, so I don't have to build aqueducts. with the despotism penalty removed, my cities grow faster. after my first big republic war, my unit support often drops to zero, because I captured enough cities.
during the transition phase right after the switching, republic is costly. but as soon as your number of free units increase, republic becomes as good as monarchy and gets way better than monarchy later on: you get the full food & shield production of the worked tiles, get faster workers, plus get the gold bonus, and save an anarchy period, later.