COTM60 - First Spoiler

[civ_steve]

COTM 60 First Spoiler - the Ancient Age!

Reading Requirements

1. You must be able to research a Middle Age technology.

Posting Restrictions

• Please be discreet about AI locations; however, feel free to discuss contacts and trades.
• No discussions of the middle ages (or later)
• No screenshots of any middle-age (or later) resources.
• Absolutely NO discussion of any other currently active 'X'OTM!

I believe this game will come at you in layers. The first one is the minor civs. How much of an affect did they have on your game? Two of them are squarely in the way of exploring the continent; were you able to get around them and make other contacts? By curragh/galley, did you get a land unit through, or did the other civs contact you first? As the Ancient Age draws to a close, how would you rate your game's status and what are your plans going forward?

 

[Spoonwood]

I planned to go for space here. I settled in place and turned 001 into a settler factory. The minor tribes fought with each other and staved off the barbarians, which I never fought once. I produced some warriors and went for temples at the borders. I did manage to contact Spain, France, and England in the south via scouts. That really didn't prove as much of a problem. I probably could have contacted them via warriors or enkidus (heck on two Deity Huge maps, recently, I've picked up all 15 contacts via enkidus, but that's a different story).

Not quite sure when I entered the middle ages. Sometime before that the Sioux managed to build the Statue of Zeus (I guess ancient cavalry aren't swordsmen). Using The Republic I pretty much traded myself into the middle ages and I think had all the continents gold. I've gotten too used to playing levels where I need culture, so I was building temples at my borders. I also had a Forbidden Palace build going on. I did have warriors over most cities also. Other than that, since I had no iron, I tried to forget about markets... accordingly didn't research literature for libraries, and planned on an archer rush to get rid of the minor tribes.

I somehow let the Sioux plop up a colony on the horses, even though I had it sandwiched between cities (and my culture hadn't reached that spot)... even though a razed city lay near there. One of the minor tribes even bulit the Pyramids and I think the Great Lighthouse also, so things looked promising. But, a few turns into the middle ages, the Sioux declared war on me. I did NOT have enough units at this point (even though I only planned on temples and the Forbidden Palace). I didn't have all too many horses coming at me, but the Sioux had some nice ancient cavalry, archers, and plains warriors such that I quickly started getting overrun. I cash-rushed some units on the first turn of the war, but by the second I had lost a core city at the border and knew I would lose even more core cities soon after. Maybe I could have hung on, but that was enough for me. I don't know if an RoP would have worked to prevent the Sioux's too early attack. Even if my planned archer/horse rush had worked and I would have forgone temples and a Forbidden Palace build, I don't believe it would have proved pretty at all.

Seriously, America should start in the high middle ages with muskets along with the other major tribes vs. those minor tribes.

 

[MinutiaRules]

Played Conquest-Class. Settled in place. Got the scouts out and soon realized that because of the close proximity of the minor tribes land would be at a premium!??! Sent the curragh to the south and met France, Spain and England (A sout later met the Iroquois). Built a second worker early and improved Washington quickly. Both scouts went north (east and west) to start. Found the bonus luxury but a few turns later the Sioux claimed it with a city . But to the west busted a free city ! (in this class goody huts are nice!). The scouts then headed south and made it to the lower part of the contenent where it was discovered that the AI avoided the goody huts (nice of them). Managed to get four settlers out and was getting close to claiming all the local land when out of the blue a large stack of Sioux came right at Washington. Game over as I had (could?) not (have) anticipated this large size of an attack. I won't be submitting but FYI I've now restarted this game 4 times with virtually the same result (its becoming an obsession!). Hope others had better luck.

 

[Rustwork]

exploration was not difficult with the scouts that can move freely through everyone's territory.

for me the apache got into a war very early with i think the iroquois. i noticed a stack each of sioux and cherokee soldiers fortified at my borders. i had about 3 cities with only two warriors in my capitol. i felt vulnerable and expected an attack each turn. i took the chance and was lucky not to be attacked. i don't know what i may have done to avoid their attention, but soon the cherokee attacked the apache, i joined them and captured both apache cities. i secured horses, and captured the great lighthouse. i immediately attacked the cherokee. they had few units since they had lost many in the war vs. apache. i allied with the sioux and they emptied their units at the cherokee. i let them do most of the fighting. they captured all but the cherokee capitol. at this time i attacked the now weakened, and dispersed sioux. after a few years i had eliminated all the minor tribes. adding ivory and iron from the sioux territories. along with the pyramids in the cherokee capitol.

my plan is to research straight for cavalry. i investigate and see that france, england, and spain lack some element for a more advanced military allowing them nothing more than spears and archers. i should be able to dominate them all with horsemen until gunpowder at the earliest. i think knights would be overkill and a waist of time. i know the iroquois will have muskets at the least when i attack them and i hope to have an advantage.

i learned philo first and took literature. then a monopoly on currency yielded me the remaining AA techs through trades. i reached the MA around 1000bc. i took around 20 some turns to then learn republic. because i was at war i delayed my government switch. i suffered an 8 turn revolt! never had one that long before. what is the max? having waited so long to become a republic i fell behind 4 other civs in technology. the positive about it was that my population was higher and my empire more developed, allowing me to support the larger number of units i needed to fight for more territory.

i feel confident about where i am at in my game presently. i'm not sure exactly how the ai will fight at this level and am a little weary about having to attack the more developed civs. the iroquois are definately stronger than i am. trying not to be too cautious delaying a victory nor too reckless and suffer defeat. i think that will be the challenge going forth. i am fairly sure, unless i am surpise attacked, that i will be able to defeat the iroquois, but i feel a tendency to build an extremely big army first. fortunate not to be attacked early i am enjoying this game, and for me the increase in level above emperor.

 

[Yilar]

Okay, so reached the middel ages. I'm not really sure which win condition to go for. I'm thinking domination as the Sioux built the oracle and is now building ToA in my game. An early oracle+ToA would pretty much end happiness issues. Spain built the pyramids. Apache(inca) took the colossus and the Iroq is building TGW.

I started off by moving scout to hill beside gems, that revealed game, so I planted and irragated cow. Then build up was usual granny and settlers. I built my usual many granaries (4!). I just can't resist, and I had problems deciding what else to build, as space was quickly becomming a problem, with the minor tribes boxing me in.

I reached the middel ages in a personal record of 1375BC. Sioux was kind enough to do polytheism and england/iroq/france did map making, currency and construction. So I got the slingshot in 1375BC and could then trade code+philo to Sioux in exchange for poly, then I could trade poly+philo for currency, construction, horseback riding and map making. Preventing the other civs from reaching the middel ages (the southern civs didn't get Code of Laws). I just hope they don't have contact with Sioux hehe . There were no science civs on the continents, so no free techs for me

Pre-QSC stats (1375BC) include:
1 Town
7 cities
4 granaries
2 barracks
9 workers
1 scout
5 warriors
4 archers
1 curragh
Contact with sioux, apache, cherokee, iroq, france, spain, england.
434 gold (thx iroq )

Oh and I got 4 turn anarchy

 

[Lanzelot]

As Yilar I spotted the game and set up the capital as a 4-turner. In the other towns I build nothing but military (and a couple of barracks). I guess this was the factor that the tribes didn't attack me. And of course the fact that I did lots of trading with them. In the very beginning I gifted 1g to each of them, don't know whether that made a difference.

I tried the full slingshot, because I saw in SGOTM14 that it can be done successfully on Demigod. I reached Philosophy in 1275BC, which I thought was pretty good, but someone on the other continent, that I hadn't met yet, must have gotten it first!
So I had to do Republic by hand, which took 25 turns. (690BC). And of course I got 7 turns anarchy!! I traded the Republic to Spain (the most advanced AI) for Map Making and entered the MI in 670BC.

Exploration: I was pretty convinced in the beginning, that we would be alone with the three tribes on a smallish continent, so I did not send my scout past the Cherokees in order not to annoy them Instead I planned to do exploration via curaghs. I lost one curagh in a suicide attempt to cross over in the direction of Spain. Only the next curragh realized, that our "continent" did not end after Cherokeeland, and sailed around the "bay" to meet France and Spain, and then it was sunk by barbs (the third barb galley was too much).

So my research as well as my exploration have been a disaster in the Ancient Age... At least our three native tribes had been good trading partners and build one great wonder each: Colossus, Oracle and Pyramids.

The ToA, however, was build in Spain, and in my original plan Spain played the role of "research partner" for a space or UN victory. So no idea yet, how to proceed. ToA (+Oracle) is essential for a high score, but if I run over Spain, I loose an essential trading partner. And switching to domination is also not good, because I am already late for that, and horses&iron are both occupied by the tribes, so I will have to use archers in the beginning

Lanzelot

PS: QSC stats:
all AA techs except Map Making and the optionals
11 towns, 38 pop
2 granaries, 6 barracks
1 settler, 7 workers
24 units

 

[Yilar]

If you are going for UN or space how is ToA gonna help you, it expires at edu? You should research mono-theo-edu quickly with a couple of prebuilds for universitets going if you are really commited to UN or Space.

 

[Lanzelot]

If you are going for UN or space how is ToA gonna help you, it expires at edu?

It doesn't help directly, but if it's built close to you, (so you get it early long before Edu), then it increases your score significantly (because of increased happiness - also add the Oracle into the equation!). And because of the increased happiness you need to spend less for lux and have a higher science output. But if it's built far away, then it's no longer a significant factor, because by the time you get it, you are already close to Edu.

 

[CKS]

Open, 20 K, not expecting to win

I settled in place and put my 20K city 2 N. I got to philosophy first and took construction as my freebie. I also got the Mausoleum in New York. The AI knew literature very early and I had no chance at the GLib. Still, I entered the Middle Ages feeling cautiously optimistic that I might survive long enough to squeak out some sort of victory.

 

[I. Larkin]

Spoiler 1. (Open)

Settle on spot, that reveal Game. With a plan Warrior – settler-- Granary. Miscalculate something with Forest chop, also scared a lot of “minors” built regular Archer. Found NY at East coast, very inconvenient, even thought to disband. Scout was blocked by Cherokees, only when Curragh appeared they let Scout south. Met France, Iroquois, England. Curragh spot Spain. Apaches did quiet well BTW, Cusco build Colossus at 2430 BC and Pyramids later on. They also discover Writing first, beating my “full speed” research. Bought writing and go straight to Philosophy 2350 BC. I trade Mysticism widely in a hope of Polytheism; like in SGTOM 14. Learned that no Iron nearby and only Horses far west. (Apache built Colony there). Could get Phylo at 1725 BC; Curragh reach China. Barbarians killed it next turn.
Options with Phylo was to take Literature or Construction via IBT “big picture” trade. Decided to wait “couple of turns”. Fortunately at 1700 France got Polytheism, embassy showed that they at war with Cherokees, but did not take a risk.
Trade IBT and turn after, got “all” ATTechs but Currency and Construction, and keep Monopoly on Monarchy. Established 3 more Embassies, Iroquois were at war with English. Made MAPT deal vs English. Revolt first at 1650 BC, got 4 turns Anarchy.
At 1625 BC Apaches declare! Made MA with Cherokee. When Anarchy was over I made Embassy and MA with Sioux. That’s really helped! Like blue tornado they smashed Apache’s “a’ vanguard” and capture Tiwanaku. Then filled area near Cusco and stuck. In 1475 I made “Lancelot like deal” with France (30 gpt for MAs (they asked it!) and 21 gpt back for Monarchy) in a hope that Apaches will over soon. But(!) Apaches captured Chartless instead. Only at 1200 BC this war was over. Iroques killed them captured Chartless. For access I found San-Francisco at bottleneck IBT France and Cherokee, but it was too late.
Fortunately Sioux lost a lot during this war (meanwhile I shortrush Horses like crazy, setting research at minimum), and I declared Sioux straight after war was finished. Caught by surprise, they lost Tiwanaku and Cusco, but the rest was hard, as they got SoZ.
England got Construction first, so I decided stop MAPT deal when it ends end and got Construction for the bunch of techs they did not have. Iro continue this war with England 53 turns more! They got Republic early but did not switch to. At 850 BC Sioux war was over and Barbarians apprising took place. France and Iro got Currency and become “MAs”. All barbarians were killed before reach Copan. Because of that the war with Cherokee was delayed. I decided FP in Cusco, to build it faster rush Temple, (Sioux Oracle helped), with Courthouse and with WLKD it was “only 40% corrupted”. Galley crossed ocean the same way as Curragh and establish contact with Germany and later with Russian.
Declare to Cherokee at 730 BC. 710 BC cascade took place, Germany got HG, Paris GW, Salamanca ToA, and Madrid got Lighthouse. Nobody had Literature yet. At 690 BC China got Republic that I trade to Construction, got Currency from France and revolt to Republic. Four turns Anarchy again (!)
At this point future looked very promising. Idea was to use France as natural shield (GW) and carry out war vs Spain firs and Iroquois second. Four useful Wonders in possession also promise very good support.